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Aaron Keeny
Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 4:22:57 pm

Ok so I am working on a project that was shot on varicam. I am having a problem when I export the video, it isnt playing back the way it is in the sequence.

Everything plays back in the timeline fine, but when I export the video some cuts are playing back at different times in the footage. The only difference ive know is the cuts that play back correctly have a blue-gray bar in the render bar area and the ones that play back wrong do not. The footage was all captured with a preset of DVCPRO HD 60p. However in the bin some clips say 29.97 fps and some say 59.94. The ones that have a frame rate of 29.97 are the ones that do not have the blue gray bar and are the ones that play back a the wrong cut that I made. I am sure the problem lays in the frame rate difference but I do not know how to go about fixing the problem. Any help would be much much aprreciated.

Thanks

Aaron


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 4:56:12 pm

[Aaron Keeny] "The footage was all captured with a preset of DVCPRO HD 60p"

It seems that some of it was captured with the 720p30 preset. You can recapture those clips to 720p60.

Jeremy




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Aaron Keeny
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 7:29:38 pm

That could be I dont know how the preset could have changed. I am really pretty sure i never changed it, also some of the clips that have different frame rates are from the same tape and I know I didnt change in between logging clips and batching.



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Aaron Keeny
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 7:30:43 pm

Also do you or anyone else know what the light blue bar is in the render area. I did some research and did not find much info.



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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 7:55:54 pm

Light blue means it's already rendered.

Jeremy


If some of your clips are 59.94 and some are 29.97 it seems that perhaps an easy setup was selected in between your logging. If you need to render some footage and not others, there's a problem.

As a test, create a new sequence and drag one of the problem clips to that new sequence. When FCP6 asks if you want to change the setting to match the clip say yes. Then hit Command-zero and see what the frame rate says.

Jeremy


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Aaron Keeny
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 8:07:21 pm

Thank you very much for the help.

So what is the best settings for capturing Varicam footage, I think an easy setup of 720p60 was used for the capturing.

I will try your suggestion and let you know what happens.

If you have a chance here is something I posted a while ago that never got a response maybe you have some answers.

http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/8/981101

Again thanks a bunch

Aaron.



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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 8:18:17 pm

In your other post, you said you used 720p30. Which one did you use and what frame rate did the dp shoot in?

Jeremy




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Aaron Keeny
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 8:22:07 pm

I know I think I screwed that up I posted that before I had a little better understanding of things that where going on. The DP shot in various frame rates throughout the tape. But it is my understanding that the varicam always shoots at 60p then with FRC remove the extra frames when you shoot in 24 and want the footage to play in slow motion.



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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 8:44:36 pm

You are right, but you can also remove redundant frames upon capture with the other presets. Anything that is supposed to be used for fast or slow motion needs to be captured @ 60 and ran through the FRC. What is the main frame rate shot in? Normal motion, not overcranked. 60? 30? 24?


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Aaron Keeny
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 8:46:51 pm

Most of the stuff is shot in 30p. Normal motion the DP is shooting 30p.



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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 9:06:44 pm

Okay, so it's best if you capture with 720p30 except the slomo stuff which needs to be captured 720p60 and processed with the FRC. Your timeline should be set to 720p30.

Jeremy




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Aaron Keeny
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 9:14:47 pm

My dilema with that is I dont know exactly which shots where shot in 60p. The same shot could be shot in 30p first then in 60p or visa versa and there was no one logging shots or anything on set.

I guess my option is to capture at 30 then FRC on the entire clip that may be in slow motion.






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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 9:19:34 pm

The clips that are supposed to be slow motion will come in playing fast and the 30p stuff will look normal. Any clip that comes in at the wrong speed you will need to recapture to 60p.

Next time, tell the DP to keep a separate tape(s) for slomo stuff so he or she doesn't confuse the edit process like you are finding out. It's also best to roll lots of heads and tails on off speed shots and it's really nice when someone holds a piece of paper in front of the lens announcing the frame rate for off speed shots (you know, like a good ole slate).

Jeremy




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Aaron Keeny
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 9:21:45 pm

Brilliant. Thank you so much.



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Aaron Keeny
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 9:21:53 pm

So I think I fixed my original problem. I opened a new sequence and made the preset
720p30 and copied the edit to that new sequence when I did that the edits
that where playing at the wrong cut where playing as they did in the
exported version. In other words the wrong version plays out in my sequence
so I was then just able to fix the cuts that where not playing correctly.

This Varicam stuff is just a little frustrating. But I thank you for all your help. Im sure I will have a problem in the future that I may have to come to you for some advice. Hopefully someday I will be able to return the favor with some good advice but I doubt it.





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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 11, 2008 at 10:16:13 pm

[Aaron Keeny] "Hopefully someday I will be able to return the favor with some good advice but I doubt it. "

Ha! You never know, Aaron. Information flows both ways.

Good luck and post back with anything else.


Jeremy




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Jurrian Bevelander
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 12, 2008 at 11:49:24 pm

Hallo,

At the company where I edit for, we are facing very frustrating behaviour inside FCP 6. This problem is just like Aaron described:

All footage is captured with FCP preset DV-PAL 48 (720x568). After editing the footage to the timeline, everything looks good. However when I export my edit from the sequence and watch it in a quicktime player it shows different cuts and footage (at some places) than was played back, originally.

I tried to put my exported mov in a new sequence with on top of that videotrack, footage from the original captured source-material (at places where FCP replaced frames) in the exported movie.

This didn't give me any satisfiing result.

Mostly this problem occurs when footage is not captured at once. Sometimes it just replaces, the selected frames in the timeline, with other frames from that same file, or mixes it up; playing the in or out point a little bit earlier or later.

It also happens that FCP sees duplicated frames and connect this with another file. For example: where it shows duplicated frames in file 1 it takes frames from file 2 (with the same colourbar "duplicated frames") and put those frames from file 2 in the place of file 1, where it says duplicated frames.


I wonder, if anyone has experienced the same problem and if there is a solution for it? Recapturing might be one but sometimes not on the long term.

thanks

Jurrian





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Aaron Keeny
Re: Problem with edit.
on Apr 14, 2008 at 12:57:39 pm

The short term fix I found that worked without recapturing the footage is to make a new sequence make the sequence preset whatever frame rate you need not sure what you will need with the whole PAL thing. Then copy everything to that sequence and the clips that are playing back wrong will show and then you just need to reedit them.






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