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Carbon Copy Cloner vs Time Machine + Upgrade

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Bob ColeCarbon Copy Cloner vs Time Machine + Upgrade
by on Jun 13, 2009 at 3:02:05 pm

1. Does Time Machine make Carbon Copy Cloner obsolete? How do you recommend combining the two?

2. re Delay of upgrade. I have a MBP (Leopard) and a Mac Pro (Tiger) (both Intel). I've been delaying upgrading the MP to Leopard, waiting for Snow Leopard. I don't really have an urgent need for Leopard and the Tiger-Snow Leopard upgrade deal looks as if it's worth waiting for. Right? Wrong?

Bob C


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Zane BarkerRe: Carbon Copy Cloner vs Time Machine + Upgrade
by on Jun 14, 2009 at 1:11:06 am

[Bob Cole] "Does Time Machine make Carbon Copy Cloner obsolete?"

No. TimeMachine does not make a bootable backup while CCC does.

[Bob Cole] "How do you recommend combining the two? "

Simply do both.

I like having both so that id something happens I can boot from the CCC disk and get something done if I have a deadline. However I also like having Time Machine because then I can go back in time and bring back a file that may have been deleted or a older version of a file that is now corrupt. You cant do that with CCC because it keeps the two drives completely identical so if the file you need was already deleted or corrupt at the last CCC then CCC cannot git you back the file.


Simply put use both and all will be groovy.

There are no "technical solutions" to your "artistic problems".
Don't let technology get in the way of your creativity!



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J. Tad NewberryRe: Carbon Copy Cloner vs Time Machine + Upgrade
by on Jun 15, 2009 at 4:41:31 pm

So, after a new install/re-install of the system software, the recommendation is to CCC the system drive to a Backup Drive, then do Time Machine updates to another drive/partition for the incremental changes? That seems to make sense. Or, is CCC any good at incremental changes? If not, it sounds like you would end up with 2 complete backups of the system drive: the first CCC one, then a Time Machine one which also would have the incremental changes. Verify when you can.

Thanks again!

J. Tad Newberry
Big Ya Productions
Power Mac G5 (soon to be Mac Pro something!)
Dual 2 GHz
http://www.bigya.tv


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Bob ColeRe: Carbon Copy Cloner vs Time Machine + Upgrade
by on Jun 15, 2009 at 4:49:03 pm

[J. Tad Newberry] "Or, is CCC any good at incremental changes?"

CCC gives you a choice of a complete backup or incremental, but my personal peace-of-mind meter says, do a complete backup. After all, the whole idea of a clone is to have something that you are pretty certain will work. I've started rotating the CCC clone drives so I actually have two. otoh, I probably don't do them as often as I should. When I get Time Machine on both machines, I'll be set.

Thanks Zane and Tad.

Bob C


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Zane BarkerRe: Carbon Copy Cloner vs Time Machine + Upgrade
by on Jun 15, 2009 at 8:16:49 pm

[J. Tad Newberry] "is CCC any good at incremental changes?"

The incremental backup feature in CCC works fine (its way faster then doing a whole new clone each time), however the incremental feature on CCC works VARY different then they way Time Machine does Incremental backups.

Time Machine keeps all incremental backups (until the backup drive is full then it drops the oldest one) that way you can go back in time and bring back files that are farther back then the last incremental backup.

When CCC does its incremental backup it simply compares the last CCC backup with the current state of the drive being backed up and then backs up any files that are new or have been changed. When it does that it does NOT keep any older files or files that are no longer on the drive you are backing up from. The end result from a CCC incremental back up is still an exact clone of the drive, just as if you had done a full clone, it is just a TON faster.

So the reason I recommend doing both is because with CCC you get a bootable clone AND with Time Machine you can go back and recover files that may be from several incremental backups ago. You cannot do that with CCC, it only gives you a backup of one fixed point in time. Time Machine does give you multiple points in time that you can go to but it is NOT bootable like CCC.

I hope that better explains why it is so nice to do both.



There are no "technical solutions" to your "artistic problems".
Don't let technology get in the way of your creativity!



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Bob ColeThanks!
by on Jun 15, 2009 at 8:35:11 pm

[Zane Barker] "I hope that better explains why it is so nice to do both. "

Yes indeed. When it comes to back-ups, I'm with Oliver: "More please."


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J. Tad NewberryRe: Carbon Copy Cloner vs Time Machine + Upgrade
by on Jun 15, 2009 at 11:40:03 pm

Good info. So, to be clear, am i on track here? For a system drive, the way to go would be to start with a CCC onto another drive. Then do regular incremental backups via CCC to keep the clone somewhat "current". ALSO, do a Time Machine backup (to the same backup drive?) but this would mainly be for the regular incrementals that TM does on its own every hour, so there would be a VERY current incremental backup to go back to for any other reason. Then, when the terrorists strike and kill just my main system drive, use the CCC backup and it's latest incremental, then also use the latest TM incremental to end up where i had started within 1 hour of the crashed system drive. (Now that i type all this out, it sounds like a no-brainer...just seeing if i'm catching all you're saying and doing enough, while not being too redundant too redundant too redundant).

Then, for non-system drives (i.e., project files, etc.), just use TM since i wouldn't need a bootable copy? For media drives, a RAID is probably best? When a project is all done, how many of you guys dump all the media (captured from tapes, discs, cards, etc.) to another drive for long-term archival?

oi!

Thanks again!

J. Tad Newberry
Big Ya Productions
Mac Pro 2.66 GHz Quad-Core
3 GB RAM
http://www.bigya.tv


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Bob ColeRe: Carbon Copy Cloner vs Time Machine + Upgrade
by on Jun 16, 2009 at 2:51:34 am

Your system drive plan sounds good. As for backing up the RAID, that depends entirely on your file organization and the nature of the assets on the RAID. I suspect you'll get a lot of different responses regarding this problem. The COW sells a DVD about "getting organized in Final Cut Pro," which would be helpful to you if that's your software.

If all your RAID assets come from timecode original tapes, which you can keep on the shelf, you don't need to back up the RAID.

I may be in the minority, but I just put everything on the RAID (timecode or not) and then back up the RAID onto LTO-3 tape. Of course, if you use P2 and SxS camera originals, you need some kind of redundant storage anyway, and that makes the durability of LTO tape quite appealing (as opposed to hard drives). I suspect a lot of people find backing up onto BluRay attractive, and I hope you get a response from somebody about that.




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