FORUMS: list search recent posts

No more Cool Lights Fresnel 650's. Alternative?

COW Forums : Lighting Design

<< PREVIOUS   •   VIEW ALL   •   PRINT   •   NEXT >>
Rick Wise
No more Cool Lights Fresnel 650's. Alternative?
on Nov 5, 2016 at 2:54:38 am

Cool Lights (Richard) has informed me he will no longer carry the 650 tungsten Fresnel. I require my online lighting students to have one of these to learn about that multiple advantages of using Fresnel lights. I wonder if anyone here has found a suitable alternative to the workhorse Arri, which costs so much more and is therefore not to be considered for these courses. My first choice would be to find an LED Fresnel that has a similar output, but so far I cannot find any at a "reasonable" price. My second choice would be to find tungsten units that are safely grounded and that also have barn doors and scrims. Suggestions for my students?

Rick Wise
Cinematographer
MFA/BFA Lighting and Camera Instructor Academy of Art University
San Francisco Bay Area
http://www.RickWiseDP.com


Return to posts index

Todd Terry
Re: No more Cool Lights Fresnel 650's. Alternative?
on Nov 7, 2016 at 8:17:21 pm

Hey Rick...

Richard may not be selling his Arri knock-off fresnels anymore, but they are still plentiful.

I just did a quick search using the terms "650 Fresnel" on both Amazon and eBay and got tons of results, probably the very same instruments that CoolLights used to sell (they certainly look like the same exact Arri clones in the same exact silver and blue housings). Came-tv.com has them as well.

Even in this LED age I for one applaud you for teaching with tungsten fresnels. It's a little bit the way that I advocated people learning to shoot with film long after it was fashionable (or even possible, when both labs and filmstock were available). If someone can master shooting film, then shooting video or any digital format is a cakewalk (and definitely not the other way around). I think the same is true with lighting, if someone can light and light well with hot/hard instruments, then I trust their knowledge a heckuva lot more when they move into flos and LEDs. We've finally edged into the age when some LED fresnels have the focusability and cuttability that tungsten fresnels do, but those instruments are still on the pricey side... you could probably buy several of the Chinese old-school tungsten heads for the price of one true Fresnel LED head.

T2

__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com



Return to posts index

Rick Wise
Re: No more Cool Lights Fresnel 650's. Alternative?
on Nov 7, 2016 at 8:31:05 pm

Thanks, Todd. I did a similar search and got similar results. However, I don't trust most of these Chinese copies. The really cheap ones have reviews that complain about endless smoking/stinking. It appears that none of them are properly grounded. I did find a couple of places that sell used Tweenies and Arri 650's and am directing my students there. I also suggest eBay but ONLY to get genuine Mole or Arri versions. B&H does sell an Ikan version, and claims that Arri scrims will fit it, and that it's grounded. That's one other possibility for them.

I agree that if you can light for film, you can light for video. I like to teach my students the visual advantages of mixing hard and soft lights. I look forward to the day the price of LED Fresnels drops down to a decent price level. You can, now, get an LED "bulb" to slip into an existing Mole or Arri Fresnel, but that means owning the original body, which of course these beginning students do not. The argument that over time you'll end up saving money in bulb-replacement and electrical-usage costs means nothing to a 20-something kid shelling out for her/his first lighting kit. Otherwise, it might make sense to buy one of those really cheap bodies, throw away the bulb, and insert the LED. And, ground the sucker to boot.

Rick Wise
Cinematographer
MFA/BFA Lighting and Camera Instructor Academy of Art University
San Francisco Bay Area
http://www.RickWiseDP.com


Return to posts index


Craig Alan
Re: No more Cool Lights Fresnel 650's. Alternative?
on Nov 12, 2016 at 6:56:59 pm

I don't find that LED fresnels have the same look as tungsten. The tungsten ones to my eyes have a hotter circle in the middle and a gradual softening outward. I's think that the Fresnel lens should create that but the LEDs seem a more consistent intensity. But I'm inexperienced. The only LEDs I have are not fresnels. I have seen them demoed but maybe they were set on flood rather than spot? Regardless I just think they have a different smoother look to my eyes.

I'd love to get rid of all the stingers and the extra effort cord management takes but the price difference is a deal killer anyway. Plus battery maintenance replaces the cord management with its high cost as well. Even with kino flos I think its a different look. LEDs, the high end ones anyway, have a very consistent dial in color temp which can be pretty cool (in both senses). But I really like the warmth of traditional Kino Flos. I know the LEDs can dial warmer but again it seems to have a more consistent overall temp. If a light was a camera it would be like having a very high F stop.

I also like the hard shadows you can get with tungsten Fresnels and Lekos. Do the LED versions of these allow for hard lighting with crisp intense shadows?

I'd love to have a battery powered LED kit for location shoots. Maybe one 650 LED fresnel and one LED Kino Flo with two baby jr stands and maybe four bricks. Any recommendations. Maybe moles for the fresnels and Kino Flo brand? But that would get pretty pricey. But those two lights would be real work horses. Worth the investment but maybe the prices will keep going down as LEDs become industry standard.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


Return to posts index

john sharaf
Re: No more Cool Lights Fresnel 650's. Alternative?
on Nov 12, 2016 at 7:21:22 pm

I'm having deja vu, or maybe this is continuation of a previous thread, but the LED solutions are simple, but they're hard to find in the forest!

Hard light: Finally not a problem anymore! VisionSmith Relamps current and legacy Fresnels (up to 2K) at very high efficiency (250w = 2000w), low or no heat, daylight or tungsten, dimming without color change, and lasts 20K hours. Same with conventional 1K, 650, 300 Fresnels. I bought a MR 407 today on ebay to make into one of these.

Softlight: Double the output of your Kino Flos by replacing the tubes with Linear Strips from Quasar Science. You eliminate the ballast, the dedicated cable and gain output, choice of daylight/tung by a switch setting, dimmability (sounding familiar?), oh and lasts a lifetime

In-Between: My first LED love - Cineo TrueColor HS, which was the result of a lot of money spent in research and design when the industry was young, and has evolved into a line of products which grows logarithmically; from the tiny 3" MatchStick to the Mombo light class QUANTUM (75000 lumens at 1200w) of profession, mission critical, modern lighting kit.

As I said before; I'm selling all the heavy feeder cable, distro (except what I use in my studio), HMI's but retooling the small tungsten kit and Kinos.

Your mileage will vary as the saying sos

Cheers,

JS



Return to posts index

Craig Alan
Re: No more Cool Lights Fresnel 650's. Alternative?
on Nov 12, 2016 at 11:40:24 pm

Thanks for the details. Yes its been discussed before but just want to hear how well its evolving and i've read elsewhere that the different tech has different looks and that some lighting designers tried out LEDs but have switched back expect for non-studio shoots.

About a year ago I watched demos at Mole Richardson and Kino Flo of their LED lamps and they were expensive and definitely good lamps but not the same look as traditional versions.

But I will look into the cost of your suggestions. Hands on is the only way to really get an understanding.

Are you saying above that you still use your HMIs in a studio setting? And other traditional lamps as well but only in a studio set up. Do you still prefer them in a studio?

"...what I use in my studio), HMI's but retooling the small tungsten kit and Kinos. " Not quite following what you are doing with what here. Keeping the HMIs and putting in LED replacement lamps and ballasts in the tungsten and Kino kits??

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


Return to posts index


john sharaf
Re: No more Cool Lights Fresnel 650's. Alternative?
on Nov 13, 2016 at 12:47:53 am

I'm keeping my temporary power distro system in my studio, in case I ever need a light bigger than 20A (household)
Selling all my HMI's, yes. Including 4K's and 1800's 800's which I've replaced with WASP 1K and BEE 275w Plasmas (very efficient).
Relamped Babies and Juniors (with VisionSmith LED's) and Kinos with Quasar LED Strips are bright and dimmable; use them for studio lighting and location, along with Cineo MatchSticks, Matchbox, Mavericks, LS, HS and XS (checkout these manufacturer's websites).
These decisions represent the rapidly changing lighting technology that's available these days.
Sorry if I was unclear.



Return to posts index

Craig Alan
Re: No more Cool Lights Fresnel 650's. Alternative?
on Nov 13, 2016 at 1:00:32 am

Thanks. do you have any side by side comparisons or even just examples of the light you are getting with the new ones. Are the traditional name brands not as good as the ones you are suggesting or just more money? I know Mole and Arri both have LED replacement kits.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Canon 5D Mark III/70D, Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV40, Sony Z7U/VX2000/PD170; FCP 6 certified; FCP X write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


Return to posts index

Bob Cole
Re: No more Cool Lights Fresnel 650's. Alternative?
on Dec 22, 2016 at 3:23:25 am

John, have you figured out a way to power your VisionSmith ReLamp'ed fresnels from batteries?

Bob C


Return to posts index

<< PREVIOUS   •   VIEW ALL   •   PRINT   •   NEXT >>
© 2017 CreativeCOW.net All Rights Reserved
[TOP]