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Simon Bienert
Exporting Premiere Project for AVID
on Apr 15, 2018 at 12:49:36 am

I am working as a DIT on a project in without timecode. Syncing video and audio was quite a feat and now the editors need an export in DNxHD MXF OP-Atom for postproduction in Avid and I am working in Premiere Pro.

To export in that format I tried the DaVinci Resolve workflow:
In Premiere Export synched sequences to XML -> import in DaVinci -> export individual files to DNxHD MXF OP-Atom

The problem with this workflow is that the exported files do not have the synched audio files with them. This only works if the files are synched in DaVinci and it does not work in imported sequences.

The solution to this might be to write the timecode of the video to the audio files and then in DaVinci automatically syncing them up by timecode and export the individual files for Avid.

What would be the best workflow to get my files to DNxHD MXF OP-Atom.
Thank you


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Shane Ross
Re: Exporting Premiere Project for AVID
on Apr 15, 2018 at 4:04:55 am

[Simon Bienert] "the editors need an export in DNxHD MXF OP-Atom for postproduction in Avid and I am working in Premiere Pro."

OK, first question...why are you working in premiere when the production is working in Avid? Were there meetings discussing workflow? Anyone mention this fact when you were hired? I do know that there are companies that will start projects with very little communication to people hired, so they might just expect that one app was being used when the hired person expected another. ALWAYS ask what NLE will be used when you are hired as a DIT. That's pretty much the first question, and primary focus of a DIT...to provide the editors with media that they will use to edit on their NLE...and then knowing the online workflow. Those are the basics of that position...and nothing should have happened until all of that information was known to all parties. I don't mean to scold you specifically, because it's the job of everyone involved in post. But yeah, if this isn't mentioned by them, it's on your shoulders to ask them what they need, what they will be editing with and how they will be onlining. Because everything YOU do is the start of that path.

[Simon Bienert] "To export in that format I tried the DaVinci Resolve workflow:
In Premiere Export synched sequences to XML -> import in DaVinci -> export individual files to DNxHD MXF OP-Atom"


OK...but then how is the show being onlined? Will this transfer enough metadata to allow the online editor to relink to the camera masters?

[Simon Bienert] "The problem with this workflow is that the exported files do not have the synched audio files with them. This only works if the files are synched in DaVinci and it does not work in imported sequences."

Correct. This is why syncing is typically done either in Resolve, if IT is used to provide dailies, and will be the online tool...or inside the edit system of choice. Or in software than can provide the dailies directly to the editor and the NLE they are using. I'm not sure even if Resolve would maintain the audio metadata needed if the audio house wants to conform the audio to the audio masters...which is why all syncing on stuff I work on, is done in the NLE, after dailies are made.

At my work we use software called CONTENT AGENT to transcode all of our dailies...and we have an established workflow from start to finish to know what works and what we need to do...that's something you need to talk about now.

[Simon Bienert] "What would be the best workflow to get my files to DNxHD MXF OP-Atom."

#1 - Find out what they will be onlining with...now that you know what the offline will be done with. Then coordinate based on that information, how you will sync. Will it be done in Resolve? Or in Avid? What works best? Either way, you will have to start over...sorry.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Brent Marginet
Re: Exporting Premiere Project for AVID
on Apr 15, 2018 at 7:14:12 am
Last Edited By Brent Marginet on Apr 15, 2018 at 7:19:22 am

I second everything that Shane has said and...

What you really need to do is to transcode all the Video to OP-Atom DNxHD in Resolve and then Resync everything in Avid. If you change the timecode of the Audio and transcode from Resolve with Synced Audio the Video Editor(s) won't care but the Audio editor(s) will have major issues with this.

After the Video edit is done the Audio Editor(s) will need to link back to the original Audio in many cases and if you adopt your suggested workflow they won't be able to do that. First, you really should never change the timecode that's embedded in any file and second if you transcode the clips with the synced audio any reference to the original audio will be lost. Linking back will be a nightmare or impossible for the Audio Editors. I've worked with FCP-7, X, Pemiere Pro and Avid but never have I synced in a different NLE than the edit is going to be done with, that makes no sense whatsoever.

Not using timecode is a massive error on everyone's part on a project like yours but if that's the way it's going to be then the only other option is to send a mono audio mix to each camera. Even if the cameras do not have T/C Inputs, products like Tentacle that send T/C to an audio channel are cheap enough to buy or rent and will save everyone from days of frustration, delays and money in the end. If you go the Audio route then you can use the Sync by Audio Waveform feature every NLE now supports and again save, save, save.

"MY MEDIA/PROJECT MOTTO: If you think three copies of your Media or Projects are enough. Take a moment to place a value on them and then maybe add two more. Hard Drives are now stupidly cheap. A RE-SHOOT AND YOUR TIME AREN'T."


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Brent Marginet
Re: Exporting Premiere Project for AVID
on Apr 15, 2018 at 7:37:08 am

One last thing I must add are the "Conform" Options in Resolve. You need to make sure that they are setup properly so that the Reel/Tape Column is populated properly in the Trancoded Media. This will allow accurate links back to the original camera media when "Round Tripping" back to Resolve for the Colour Correction portion of the Project. Even if a Resolve Round Trip is not going to be done, set this up anyway. The Timecode and Reel/Tape Metadata are the two most important pieces of Metadata used when linking back to the Source Media in every NLE that exists.

If I remember on Monday I will post a screen grab of the most common way this is done.

"MY MEDIA/PROJECT MOTTO: If you think three copies of your Media or Projects are enough. Take a moment to place a value on them and then maybe add two more. Hard Drives are now stupidly cheap. A RE-SHOOT AND YOUR TIME AREN'T."


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Pat Horridge
Re: Exporting Premiere Project for AVID
on Apr 15, 2018 at 8:51:04 am

I'm teaching a whole section on Technical Supervision over the next few weeks to Uni students.
It's such an important element of a Production.
Errors an issues like this are so easily avoided if you have a Technical supervisor and plan the work.

Pat Horridge
Broadcast & Post Consultant, Trainer, Avid Certified Instructor
Free online Tutorials at VET digital media academy online http://vimeo.com/channels/752951
pat@vet.co.uk



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Simon Bienert
Re: Exporting Premiere Project for AVID
on Apr 18, 2018 at 5:19:48 pm

Thank you Shane,
The reason I used premiere to sync is that the video files that had a reference track, had very low volume and where clipped at the same time. That meant that auto-syncing by Waveform in Resolve would not work. I had to sync the tracks manually by zooming into the waveform and recognizing patterns in the clipped tracks. As far as I know that is not possible in Resolve to look at both waveforms when syncing.

In the end the workflow I used was to export the individual files with synced audio from Premiere in AP1a, resyncing them in Resolve by auto-syncing by Waveform and exporting them to AP-Atom. This maintained the metadata and the link to the audio files.

Thank you for the software tips. I did not know of CONTENT AGENT.

Thank you Brent,
Buying or Renting that equipment last minute was not an option because of being in a third world country where it is really hard to come by these things or import them. In the end we used a wireless lavaliere system to send a reference track to the camera. As stated before another issue arised because of that.

Thanks for the "conform" tip in Resolve.

I am new to this forum and it is so nice to have a support system and that there are people who share their knowledge. Thank you for taking the time to help. Please excuse any mistakes but English is not my first language.


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Nina Lucia
Re: Exporting Premiere Project for AVID
on Apr 23, 2018 at 6:45:46 pm

"The reason I used premiere to sync is that the video files that had a reference track, had very low volume and where clipped at the same time."

Perhaps you could have done same in Avid, I don't know, I don't usually have to do the syncing, but it's worth a look.

So did they not use a slate/sticks for the footage? If yes, and you can't sync automatically using waveforms or timecode, it's not that time consuming to mark the sticks on both picture and sound in Avid then using 'auto sync' > 'sync by inpoints' to create your synced clip. Map a key on your keyboard for the 'auto-sync' command to make it faster, then select each picture and audio that goes together, hit your mapped key and repeat for each clip.


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