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Is Media 100 Dead?

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jeremy Rowell
Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 11, 2013 at 10:55:50 pm

Have not seen any updates in awhile, and no upgrades are planned. Is it time to start looking at alternatives when I am adding new systems to my production facility? Anyone have any information that points in a different direction?



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Michael Slowe
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 13, 2013 at 2:03:53 am

What difference does it make to your workflow even if what you say is correct? Why are people so fixated on updates and upgrades? OK, being able to edit HD codecs was a considerable upgrade but unless you need 6K editing what do you require?

Obviously as Media 100 is my sole edit system I would hope it continues to be supported but I will still continue using it.

Michael Slowe


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jeremy Rowell
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 13, 2013 at 11:12:03 pm

It makes a HUGE difference to my workflow! There are a ton of codecs that should be supported and are not. If I was confident that Media 100 was working on these and making an effort to keep their software current, I could JUSTIFY to my company the they should invest THEIR money on a new Media 100 system.

I deal with many other companies that send me files and I am always trying to find a work around to get it into a file format that one of my Media 100 systems likes.

I do not unstand how you can infer that no improvement or upgrades are needed. Every piece of software must continue to evolve to stay current, or it will fade away... as M100 is doing now.

I understand your need to defend what you love. I have purchased 6 m100 systems over the past 13 years and currently have 3 in my production dept. I do not want to use anything else. But I can't have blinders on, I have to answer to the people that write my checks.



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Michael Hanish
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 16, 2013 at 12:51:48 pm

So, what is it that you are trying to do? Perhaps someone here can help.

I would guess that many of us around here have figured out various work-arounds to frustrating or non-functional workflow bits with Media100 over the years.

best,
Michael



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jeremy Rowell
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 16, 2013 at 7:12:07 pm

I've been using M100 since 1998, I'm pretty good at figuring work arounds! Don't get me wrong, I love M100. My 3 current systems are rock solid. I don't want to cut on anything else. With that said, look at any other NLE. Final Cut, Vegas, Premier, Edius, Avid... I guarantee they are working on a new version. bringing new features. supporting new codecs. Introducing new innovations. Is M100? All signs point to no.

I would love to see tabbed time lines. Native support for more codecs. Surprise me with features I didn't know I couldn't live without.

How can I ask my company to spend thousands on software that does not look to see V.3? I can't just buy it because I'm comfortable editing with it. No way to justify that.



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Marcus Warren
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 17, 2013 at 5:12:42 am

Hi Jeremy. You will have to forgive Michael. Every time the issue of newer and better comes up, he always asks, what's the big deal? I get the impression that if someone told Michael that he was going to buy a new car, Michael's response would be, "Why do you want to do that? Your 1948 Buick is still running, right?"
Some folks, like Michael, are just fine with the status quo. Many of us aren't.

But back to your question; Is Media 100 Dead? My take? Yes, Media 100 is functionally dead. Even if development continues, I fear that it is nothing more than a zombie, a walking dead piece of software. Floh has mentioned on this forum that work on on the next version is complete. Does it matter? I mean in the context of market share, marketing, the ability to take advantage of the newest technology and the like?

Artel Software/Boris FX has shown no stomach for hyping the software, or adding new content to the website or providing meaningful point upgrades. I feel sorry for folks like me who paid for the subscription service; you know, $100 covers all of the paid upgrades over the course of a year. There were none.

Boris Y hasn't posted on this forum in more than 17 months. But he does post on the Boris FX forum. His ignoring this forum does not instill confidence in the future of the software. That probably does not matter to Michael, but it is a telling sign for the rest of us. Pay attention to what I am saying. Boris has not posted on this site in nearly a year and a half! That has to tell you something!

Jeremy, you are concerned about codecs. I am in the market for a new camera and Media 100 is my only real editing software. That automatically means that my choices are limited, when you consider all of the camera formats that Media 100 apparently does not support. Software like Sony Vegas (not the Pro version), Adobe Premiere Elements and Corel Studio probably natively support more formats and codecs than Media 100 and they cost less than $100. Media 100 retails for nearly $1000.

I mean, does it tick off anyone other than me that other NLEs have access to most advanced Boris software, but the latest BCC filters still are not available for Media 100 after all of this time? And the scenario extends to the latest FEC filters, Soundbite, heck, we don't even get Media 100 tutorials.

So yes, Media 100 is dead. But Michael will tell you that it is still usable. Final Cut Pro v1 is still usable under the right circumstances. Folks on this forum admit to using versions of Media 100 that predate BorisFX's acquisition of Media 100. Heck, my Amiga computers are still usable (sorta). Linear tape to tape editing is usable as well. So what?

We have software that appears to be unloved by the parent company even though it may still be in development. I'm not sure what happened, but sadly "it" did.

Jeremy, you asked should you look elsewhere? The answer is yes. I'd only reconsider if Boris his own self posts on this forum and give assurances about the future of M100.


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Michael Slowe
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 17, 2013 at 11:13:50 pm

No Marcus, I don't have a 1948 Buick, although, funnily enough my son in law has just bought one and had it adapted for a classic car rally over the Andes! I often up date cars and am currently delighting in an S3 Audi.

Of course, I also welcomed all the meaningful Media 100 updates that enable me to import and edit XDCAM footage in a huge variety of codecs, with multiple video and audio tracks etc etc. My point was that people tend to over state the need for constant improvements. I make documentary films and can do all that is necessary within Media 100 for these films to be very successful. As Michael Hanish asks in his supportive post, what exactly do you want and need right now?

There is always rival software to everything , some better, some worse. I, for one, would be very sad to lose Media 100 but I'm an old man and it will probably see me out. The whiz kids, cutting all sorts of fancy multi layered commercials will no doubt find applications with which they will dazzle and amaze us.

Michael Slowe


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Jaeson Koszarsky
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 23, 2013 at 5:27:07 pm

What difference does it make to your workflow even if what you say is correct? Why are people so fixated on updates and upgrades?


For me, I'm looking for bug fixes more than new features, although that would be nice too. I'm tired of force-quitting M100 multiple times on a daily basis because it hangs up comes back from RED (this just happened again right now). That's my #1 beef at the moment. #2 is the random glitches in rendering layers & exporting MOVs. Some days go better than others with #2.

Feature-wise, I see BorisFX putting out a lot of great new filters for every other system but Media100/RED.

Jaeson



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Jaeson Koszarsky
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 23, 2013 at 7:01:52 pm

Another Media100/RED nuisance is with the still images. RED is a little flaky with the aspect ratios. Sometimes it is fine, other times it will change how it interprets things after applying, or corrects itself after applying. Another daily occurrence. Just now my Volkswagen logo was squashed instead of round. Going in/out of RED sometimes corrects the problem. Oddly enough, if I toggle 1:2:1 deflickering on/off before returning to RED, it usually fixes or prevents the problem.

Jaeson



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Frank Cann
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 29, 2013 at 10:32:28 pm

The amount of M100 bugs I deal with is a joke.
The biggest one is - after editing a graphic (first time only) - I must force quit then reopen to move forward.
I must force quit 15 times a day. Brutal!


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Jaeson Koszarsky
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 29, 2013 at 10:40:34 pm

The amount of M100 bugs I deal with is a joke.
The biggest one is - after editing a graphic (first time only) - I must force quit then reopen to move forward.
I must force quit 15 times a day. Brutal!



I hate this too.

One work around is to click somewhere on the empty desktop, then click on the Media100 window you want to work in. Only this window will be active, you can't click from Media100 window-to-window while in this bug state but you can still get some work done without force-quitting all the time.

Some shortcuts and buttons don't work properly in this bug state.

But with the desktop-click work-around to hop from Media100 window to Media100 window, I can often wrap up the current project before force-quitting.

I still end up force-quitting on a daily basis though. We have two licenses for Suite 2.1.2 and this bug affects both systems equally.

Jaeson



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Bernhard Grininger
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 17, 2013 at 5:55:44 pm

Hello,


from a cold analytical point of view I think a drawback for M100 is,
that it relies on Quicktime architecture (doesn't Boris RED either?).
Apple decided to EOL Quicktime architecture and replacing it with A/V Foundation.

So there are two options for Artel to cope with this circumstances:

Option#1: adopt M100 to A/V Foundation, which requires TIME; a lot of it.
[means: follow Apple wherever they are heading for and benefit from it; just like in the past]

Option#2: develop it's own media architecture.
[means: a lot of work under the hood OR much license fee for 3rd party components]



Another issue is that now FCP-X fills the market of an easy to use but still professional application.

There are also two options for Artel to cope with this situation:

Option#1: make M100 easier than FCP-X
[can't imagine how]

Option#2: make M100 more powerful than FCP-X
[Boris filters and effects are some of the very best. Using them in a unified, well designed editing interface that basically assembles a finishing app – *cough* *844/X* *cough* – would be a powerful combination.
And sorry, NO! Boris RED's interface is the opposite of well designed]



Furthermore I'm the opinion that in M100's long history two fatal mistakes were done:

Mistake#1: EOL 844/X and reactivate the Media100 app instead of
getting rid of hardware development and push development of 844/X.

Mistake#2: restrict video-I/O to AJA Kona boards. !NOTHING against AJA nor Kona! Great products!
But this decision simply was a shot in the knee! Lightyears way off-road the general trends in the market.
Simply a STUPIDITY!!! Sorry for this hard word. It is not that analytical.


Nevertheless I don't see M100 to be dead – yet.
At next NAB we will need to see how Artel copes with the new situation
an evaluate again.

But while Artel copes with the current situation today, Adobe prepares Adobe Anywhere for the market of tomorrow and I would expect Apple to bring something similar, making us editing FCP-X on iPads while
heavy processing is done elsewhere...

Best regards,
Bernhard


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Nick Lammers
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 22, 2013 at 2:55:28 pm

I haven't posted here for a long time but I felt compelled to jump in. First, asking if M100 is dead is a worthwhile question for anyone purchasing new systems. While the "it still works so why change" attitude is fine for existing systems, if someone is buying new you have to make sure your investment is leveraged well for the future and it's the perfect time to compare features and price points of M100 to other systems.
Even if Boris does make improvements to M100, it's lack of market share, marketing efforts, etc all concern me. I love cutting on M100 (sadly, I haven't been able to for a few years due to company's switch to FCP) but it makes no sense to be the "last dinosaur standing."

Lastly, I hope things improve. Some day I'll be buying a new system again and it would be awesome if M100 was a legitimate contender.

Nick Lammers
Surgical Media Productions
St. Louis, MO


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jeremy Rowell
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 22, 2013 at 5:49:58 pm

That is exactly where I'm at. I can't justify having my company buy software that was great , but is not going to be doing any upgrades other than supporting new aja drivers. I have to look at the future... sadly that does not look to have M100 in it for me.



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Michael Slowe
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 25, 2013 at 2:23:05 pm

Jeremy, my initial response to your mail was, I now realise, rather petulant. It's true, I am likely to be the "last dinosaur standing", as Nick puts it. It's just that I so like editing on Media 100 and am so comfortable with it that moving to another seems so daunting, rather like a divorce after many years of marriage.

I'm truly amazed that no one from Boris (Media 100) has posted any comment at all on this thread. Here we all are, Media 100 users of many years standing, loyally sticking with it, and raising reasonable questions. There used to be a guy, forgotten his name, who would jump in and answer pressing questions. We have the worthy Floh doing great work on the technical side from Germany, but he can't be expected to speak for the company on policy matters. How about it Boris Y, let's hear from you!

Michael Slowe


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Nick Lammers
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 25, 2013 at 3:13:38 pm

Michael, that "last dinosaur standing" comment was not directed at you specifically. I thought I'd clarify that since you seem to be the type who gets his feelings hurt easily :)

Sounds like many of us are in the same boat - strongly hoping to stay with M100 but not getting much encouraging news.

Nick Lammers
Surgical Media Productions
St. Louis, MO


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jeremy Rowell
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 25, 2013 at 8:47:22 pm

Well said. I feel your pain, I do not want to move to another system... but I have to guess the future and do what is right for my company. From where I'm standing, the future of M100 does not look so good.



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Jack Shepard
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 23, 2013 at 7:49:42 pm

Like all of you: Big fan. Love M100. Frustrated by BorisFX disappearing act.

Appreciate all the comments and it was interesting to read your tech take Bernhard. The quicktime situation makes it tricky for development I'm sure. I'm a couple of versions back and I've been at a "I need to upgrade soon" point for awhile due to Lion/Mt. Lion.

Reading the comments an idea popped into my head for Boris - although I am no means a software developer. The part about M100 that everyone has always loved was the interface. The codec compatibility issues and a lot of the tech capabilities, well, not so much... which is understandable as M100 is much smaller player than Apple/Avid/Adobe.

Since BorisFx is mainly a plugin company - why not turn M100 into a plugin which provides the M100 interface within the other bigger players editing software. That way you could take advantage of many of the technical advantages of the other companies but maintain the interface we all know and love.

Maybe, not technically possible. But, just an idea!



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Jim Wiseman
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Jan 25, 2013 at 6:43:20 pm

I just hope they at least keep up with Mac OS updates and AJA drivers, including the new Thunderbolt devices. Also hoping to hear a bit of feedback from the company here as well. I was the M100 dealer here in Hawaii for years, sold many systems. I still do my finishing with M100 now that I am back to only doing production. Use other NLE software as well for the codec support, but always move it to ProRes for the entire edit process with M100. Best interface ever designed, especially for documentaries, my main use.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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Marcus Warren
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Feb 11, 2013 at 1:35:46 am

Jim, would you mind elaborating further on why you consider M100 to have the best interface (compared to the other NLEs listed in your signature) and the reasons why you choose to finish in M100 rather than those other editors (what do you see as the M100 advantages)?
Thanks


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Michael Slowe
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Feb 12, 2013 at 12:10:35 pm

Marcus, I know that your question was directed at Jim but may I just give my own opinion as well?

The Media 100 interface is the nearest I've seen to the traditional 'film edit' configuration. It is clear, basic and uncluttered and we have easy direct access to our media clips, unlike many other systems. Changes to media in the timeline can be made instantly and intuitively, without having to press any keys other than the mouse. I don't think that it is this simple or as fast in other systems.

Sorry Jim for jumping in, we await your opinion with interest!

Michael Slowe


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Jim Wiseman
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Feb 12, 2013 at 6:58:06 pm

Unlike Michael, I have never edited film, although I have been doing portable and broadcast video since 1970, well before computer based editing. I was the exclusive Avid dealer here in Hawaii from the early to late '90's, as well as one of two Media 100 dealers from near the beginning to the end. Since then I have returned exclusively to production work. I also now use Adobe Premiere to preview material in any codec and do some color correction and titling, then exporting ProResHQ to Media 100 for final edit. Why? Because it has the fastest, simplest, most direct editing metaphor of any non-linear editor I have worked with, the quality is superb, audio simple and direct, and exports have always been flawless. It just works. Premiere on the Mac has been less than stable, but seems to be improving. A bit too much concentration on features as opposed to functionality. The M100 software has grown up on the Mac, it is not the second choice platform. The other reasons I prefer M100. And Avid, while great for closed system feature production, is not open enough for my workflow that can involve many sources.

I am almost exclusively in documentary production these days, so my need for complicated effects are few when I get to final. M100 has good hooks to After Effects, and of course RED is integrated. I could also do effects at the Premiere stage of my workflow. I do hope that Boris keeps developing M100, at least keeping up with OSX updates, AJA drivers including support for Thunderbolt devices, and bug fixes. I would hate to see M100 fall by the wayside. The silence has been rather deafening. I, like Michael, will probably continue to use it for as long as possible.

Jim Wiseman
Sony PMW-EX1,Pana AJ-D810 DVCPro, DVX-100, Nikon D7000, Final Cut Studio 2 and 3, Media 100 Suite 2.1, Premiere Pro 5.5 and 6.0, AJA ioHD, AJA Kona LHi, Avid MC, Hexacore MacPro 3.33 Ghz 24Gb RAM GTX-285 120GB SSD, Macbook Pro 17" 2011 2.2 Ghz Quadcore i7 8Gb SSD, G5 Quadcore PCIe


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olof ekbergh
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Feb 17, 2013 at 2:40:35 am

I have used M100 since the mid 90's and I love it.

But I have finally stopped using it except for legacy projects that need to be reedited.

I am very sad about this but it is just not working well any more.

I use FCPX and it is really fast and works w/o the need to transcode any of the solid state media I shoot these days. The lack of tabbed timelines and bins is ridiculous. That should have been done a decade ago. Media management is a pain, the separate audio and video files is really silly in todays world.

So I have basically said goodbye to an old friend. I still have 4 licensed seats but they all use other SW most of the time now and there are really only 2 that still work with M100.

I would give M100 another chance if they updated it to be as fast and easy to work with as FCPX and other modern NLEs. But that seems unlikely. I have not even looked in on this forum for a month or so now, I used to be pretty active and I often talked with the crew at M100 about problems and possible improvements.

So I am sad to see M100 go but for me it is the reality that it has been abandoned to a slow death. I stopped my platinum updates a year ago I think, good move it seems.

RIP

Prove me wrong...

Olof Ekbergh


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Michael Slowe
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Feb 17, 2013 at 11:06:37 am

Yes Olof, we've missed you. Sorry to hear your tale but I don't quite understand your gripes. How inconvenient is it with separate files for audio and video? I thought that Media Management was one of the strong points compared to others and the speed, seems quick enough, doesn't that largely depend on the computer in use? Transcoding media from the cards is a pain I agree but it doesn't take long and once it's done it's done.

The lack of communication with Boris is a worry as we've all agreed. Still no word from the main man.

Michael Slowe


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olof ekbergh
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Feb 17, 2013 at 2:49:18 pm

Michael, once you start to work with FCPX, you will be really impressed by how quickly you can work. And how easily and well you can manage media.

As soon as you mount a card or a HD with pretty much any media on it you can import it in a lot of different ways. If it is organized in folders each folder becomes a keyword (a smart bin really) and you can assign many keywords and favourites to any clip. You have to wrap your head around this but basically FCPX is a searchable Database for all your media, and you can save "smart searches". You can also start working with the files as the import is going on.

Once you start using a modern way of file handling the old bins and media folders really is clunky in comparison.

All your projects (events) and programs (timelines) are always visible but can be hidden or just put into folders to keep them organized and instantly available. M100 1 project at a time and locating media when opening is a pain.

M100 is just stuck in time, there are new and much improved ways of working once you wrap your head around them. If these new ways of working were not faster and easier to find/archive media and project I would not care. But the new ways save time and keeps me much more organized, it is so easy to find any clip even from a totally different project.

I resisted switching to FCP/Avid/Premier for years and I think the first program that really is worth switching to is the latest versions of FCPX. I did end up using FCP7 a lot in the sat few years because of collaboration with other editors, but I never liked it. I have always loved AE and I still use it a lot, but I must admit that Motion is very good and integrates really well with FCPX.

I don't want to sound like an Apple ad. But the truth is that there are new and different ways to think about video editing and at least for me it works well.

I would love to see a modern version of M100, but it does not seem likely.

As long as M100 works for you, use it. I just found FCPX is much faster and easier to organize for my way of working.

Olof Ekbergh


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Michael Slowe
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Feb 19, 2013 at 10:45:17 am

Olof, thanks for your explanation, I must seem like a dinosaur to you. The trouble is I was a film editor and the Media 100 system of bins is merely carrying on with our previous work flow. Also, speed is not important to me and I certainly don't need to access more than one project at a time. Once a film is finished that's it - archive the file and wipe it all off the system - one at a time is quite enough for me.

It really does seem, from what you say, that the heading on this thread is the reality. I'm upgrading this week to the latest version and that might well be it. I'll carry on as long as it all works, my films seem to be very popular and I'm not so far, in any way inhibited in my editing with Media 100, other, younger, more ambitious editors will doubtless thrive on the wonderful new software appearing almost daily it seems.

Michael Slowe


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Maxwell Federman
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Apr 15, 2013 at 2:05:25 pm

It's unfortunate to think that this thread is going unread or at least not acknowledged by Boris FX or Floh Peters or anyone really "in-the-know" but I'd guess the reluctance has a lot to do with the jump to 64-bit systems and the implications of re-writing the software.



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Maxwell Federman
Re: Is Media 100 Dead?
on Apr 15, 2013 at 2:24:29 pm


Here in Texas, the biggest universities had been training students exclusively on FCP and had gone so far as to build massive and elaborate servers for it. Even Apple, a giant of the computing world, decided they'd throw in the towel on a conventional editing system and release FCPx much to the dismay of many people. It just so happens that Apple has a large wing here in Austin and rumor has it that a 64-bit "FCP 8" was in development of not finished and will probably never see the light of day; probably because the business people at apple figured it would make sense to release what amounts to a hybrid of FCP and iMovie and release it at a very low price point. If you haven't seen it yet, you'd likely get a laugh from the FCP X video released by the Conan O'Brien show that mocks professional use of FCPx; it's worth a search on YouTube.

Anyways we've watched as Avid took full advantage of apples move, solidifying themselves as the one professional edit system. I guess premeire is also gaining momentum now on Mac; but working with Premiere CS_ on the PC and all of the horrible bugs and crashes remind me of what brought me to Media100 in the first place.

While it was the very first NLE editing system I ever saw in action; it took some time until I could convince my then-employer to try it. Media100i was a great product for its time albeit not without it's own quirks and flaws. Editing style often dictates the best tool to use, and nowadays the projects I am working on often require as many as 12 tracks of video to incorporate the layers of graphics and keying that go into a composition. Sadly this workflow would be less than ideal for m100 in its current incarnation and probably not so great for FCPx either.

It's easy to look at what it would take to get Media100 up to snuff so to speak and think it wouldn't take much. But perhaps we must consider the difficulty and expense involved in creating a video editing application. And apparently changes in Apple's development program have added additional hurdles. I think you guys are doing the right thing by voicing your opinions here on the COW.

And in defense of Boris Y, I think he is probably a very busy person, and it's not unlikely that he also has his own feelings about media100 as it has been a part of the Boris FX / Artel story for so long now.

I have a 10 year old German shepherd. Last year her ACL tore in the hind leg. I spent $2000+ on surgery and an implant to prolong her life... but I did it out of love; not because it made financial sense to do so. Granted, we are discussing a piece of software and not an animal. But it's a piece of software that people love, or this thread would not exist. I only hope that the Boris team will chime in here and at least explain what is going on with the software; if its nothing, then why.


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