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Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom

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john boltonMedia100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Dec 16, 2011 at 8:34:11 am

I have search as many Forums as I can to try and find the solution to the Jagged edges on Still images when Panning and Zooming. I am using Media100p 12.0.3 with BORIS RED 4.3. I can drag a still image from the BIN onto the Media100 timeline and the picture is perfect. If I then open the EDIT section and transfer it to BORIS RED and then make some adjustments to the size of the picture and some slight panning all seems to look OK. But when I click apply and it transfers it back to Media 100 there are jagged edges on any object that is diagonal (Like the sloping edge of a roof). I have tried setting the Media 10 project to PAL 16:9 and also PAL psf but makes not difference. I have tried using the IMPORT/ still pictures to get the pictures into Media100 . Also I have adjusted the picture for the one pixel up shift to overcome Interlace problems which I think it does help but it does not clear the jagged edges (looks like a saw blade). There are no visible adjustment in BORIS RED 4.3 for Interlace, etc that I can see or find in the user manual. I have also reduced the still image actual picture size to 1024 x 576 and it makes not difference. Clearly I am missing some basic setting somewhere but I am now out of options of where to look. I am assuming that there must be a solution to this else anyone who wants to include still panned images with Video would never even contemplate Media 100 with BORIS. Any guidance would be appreciated John


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Floh PetersRe: Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Dec 16, 2011 at 10:47:37 am

Hmmm, sometimes there are some issues with psf timelines. Try your image in a interlaced timeline to see if this changes anything. Plus, how are you monitoring your signal? On a CRT/interlaced screen or on a progressive screen? Or only on computer displays?



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john boltonRe: Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Dec 16, 2011 at 10:59:43 am

Hello Thanks for the reply. I have tried standard PAL without psf and it does not make any difference. The image diagonal is jagged in the Preview window on the computer monitor and also on a standard widescreen TV from firewire through Canopus box with s-video out. Somehow BORIS RED is dong something to the image but I can’t see any option to alter anything. I guess it looks as if the image does have an interlace problem but when running the sequence the jagged edges do not move or flicker…..make it even more difficult to work out ….. John


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Floh PetersRe: Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Dec 16, 2011 at 11:02:49 am

Hmmm, can you post a Media 100 timeline/project and still file somewhere so that I can download it and have a look?



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john boltonRe: Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Dec 16, 2011 at 11:20:13 am

Hello Floh. UM yes I can do that but it will be a few days before I am back in the Studio as I work with another guy who live some miles way from me. I am assuming you want the actual Project test file and not just a screen capture of the timeline. I will setup a drop-box for you to download it or an email address I can send it to. I was going to contact Jon Kozenko at BorisFX who has been helping me solve some other weird problems but I thought that on the forum someone would have already seen the problem and solved it haha .. I will call my colleague as see if he can do it for me to save time .. Thanks again


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Gary MilliganRe: Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Dec 16, 2011 at 8:40:30 pm

[john bolton] "There are no visible adjustment in BORIS RED 4.3 for Interlace, etc that I can see or find in the user manual. "

In RED, under the "Edit" menu you should find "Project Settings". Are the "1:2:1 Deflickering" and "Better Quality Field Rendering" selected?



HTH

Gary

This is me - this is what I do - http://web.mac.com/garymmw


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john boltonRe: Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Dec 17, 2011 at 8:48:38 am

Hello Gary. When BORIS is opened from M100p there is no header like - File - Edit - Composition, etc just the floating Panel like Control panel - Composite window, etc. So are you saying I need to open BORIS on its own to start with and do those settings and then close it down and then open up M100p and then open BORIS from there? or maybe the Header should be visable when it is opened from BORIS but there is no option to enable it or disable it. John


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john boltonRe: Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Dec 17, 2011 at 9:11:17 am

The only Header shows Media100 at the top left of the MAC screen even when BORIS is opened from M100. There is no option on the Control Panel. It sounds like I am missing something that should be displayed. Any chance you can do a screen shot of your BOIRS layout when it is launched from M100 so I can see where you are finding the EDIT. The one you have shown looks like a Windows sceeen but of course it may be the part I am missing Thanks in advance John


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Floh PetersRe: Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Dec 17, 2011 at 1:51:21 pm

[john bolton] "The only Header shows Media100 at the top left of the MAC screen even when BORIS is opened from M100. "

Right, but it is still the Boris menu layout. In the Edit Menu, there should be the Project Settings



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Gary MilliganRe: Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Dec 18, 2011 at 4:08:22 am

[john bolton] "Any chance you can do a screen shot of your BOIRS layout when it is launched from M100 so I can see where you are finding the EDIT. "

As Floh has stated: "Right, but it is still the Boris menu layout. In the Edit Menu, there should be the Project Settings"

It is also where you can edit your RED Preferences.

Click on the image below to see a larger version.



Hope this helps.
Gary

This is me - this is what I do - http://web.mac.com/garymmw


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Jaeson KoszarskyRe: Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Jan 9, 2012 at 6:00:54 pm

I move still pictures around frequently with Media100 & RED and the results are very clean, diagonals included.

Is the quality different if you export your project from RED as an MOV file than when you return to the Media100 and render there?

Are you viewing both fields of the Media100 output on your monitor?

In Media100, what quality/codec settings are you using?

Jaeson



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john boltonRe: Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Jan 10, 2012 at 8:55:01 am

Hello Jaeson .

Thanks for the reply

"Is the quality different if you export your project from RED as an MOV file than when you return to the Media100 and render there? " >>>
===============

As a MOV file direct from RED it looks very poor as if there are watery type movement and noise . ave also tried buring the DVD but that is worse. Have deleted all the Prefs, etc <>

Not sure what you mean by this as I was assuming that you could not see just one field. Have tried in Interlace and progressive <>

Have tried then all and it does seem to make much difference. Have also noticed that if there is a still image that has been Pan Scanned, if there is a darkish area like shaded trees, as vertical ripple appears to wobble as the picture moves but does not appear in the lighter sections. When we were using Media 100i 8.1.1 we had excellent output on preview monitor and TV monitor but no PAN/Scan and only 2 Audio tracks. With Media 100P 12.0.3 even the regular video work looks poorer. Have deleted the Prefs on this as well. The current work-around is to do the stills in Vegas and import as AVI but the thought was that BORIS would save all that issue. I still have to answer some of the other forums queries and have been trying all possible solutions first. A guy called Jon Kozenko at borisfx support has mentioned that BORIS does sometime need the De-interlace ticked OFF as this causes problems and any Preview settings in Boris need to be on full as this passes it back to Media 100 and changes the default . So a lots of thing to do. I am in the middle of an hardware upgrade to Quad core so will get that sorted first. Maybe it is time for Vegas as this upgrade has been a disaster... I will let you know the test result in a few days. Thanks again


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john boltonRe: Media100p with BORIS RED - jagged edges on still pictures when Pan and Zoom
by on Jan 15, 2012 at 10:06:31 am

After lots of searching question I have found the problem. In the end BORISFX offered on last solution. It appears that there is a BUG in 4.3 which passes any setting back to Media 100 and make that the default even though it does not show those settings, Their comments were ….“RED 4 also had an odd habit where the settings for 'Change Preview Quality' and 'Change Preview Resolution', accessible at the bottom of the Composition window, will follow into your host (in this case Producer). So, as such, I would have you make sure that the 'Preview Resolution' is always set to 'Full' when you Apply back. As for 'Preview Quality', while it's generally best to have this at 'Best', the Best setting can also amplify any jagged edges by increasing clarity of them. Because of this, try toggling the 'Change Preview Quality' between Best and Draft; just always keep Preview Resolution at Full” …. and sure enough the Preview quality was in Draft mode . This small symbol at the bottom of the Composition window is easy to miss and I did not even think of looking for it and also would not of thought that it would actually effect the Project setting quality in Media 100p. So now all seem to be as it should be,,, Hope is stays that way and thanks to all those in the forum who offered the possible solutions, Regards John


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