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Bit Vice question

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Jack ShepardBit Vice question
by on Jan 18, 2007 at 3:21:11 pm


This topic has been covered a lot on this post but I can't seem to get it to work so.... I am going to ask away.

I just tried exporting (from M100i8.2.2) a "by reference" and "self contained" movie and then importing it into BitVice to be encoded. However that causes Bitvice to crash. Then I read about the M100 codec causing Compressor to crash -- and figured this might be the same with Bitvice. So I pulled the codecs out (there were 3: Media 100transcoder.component, media100vout.component, media100hd.component). Bitivice worked but then it only encoded a pure white program.

What am I doing wrong? I assume that I was just supposed to pull one of those codecs out. Or do I need to add another codec that I don't have?

Thanks!


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topher944Re: Bit Vice question
by on Jan 18, 2007 at 5:11:12 pm

Hey Jack, You need the transcoder and the v-out. If you look at a post from Floh on Jan 7 under the heading "Floh, Can you confirm" Floh leaves a link to the new M100 codecs that also work on the "i" (v8 and lower) M100s. The link includes clear instructions. I installed these new HD codecs on my two v8 systems and it really made some improvements. Compressor will now read self-contained and reference clips - no problem. AE really cooks too! The download will put the codecs in the right file for you
HD>Library>quicktime but you may need to re-install 2 of the 3 you deleted(transcoder and v-out). When you work with compressor from M100 remember to alter your compressor settings. M100 works in the RGB color space where Black is 16 (legal) and white is 235 (legal). Compressor works in the YUV color space which is Black is 0 and white is 255. Thats why you see faded blacks and dingy whites when encoding a m100 project in compressor. I'm working on a feature from M100 to DVD right now and my settings are
NTSC
4:3
upperfield
closed gop
7 frame structure
Filters:
black restore + 7.5
colors (highlights and midtones = +20 (leave shadows/lowlights at 0 or you add noise back to your blacks)
Gamma is 1.4 (you could try 1.3 and 1.5)
Compressor has a great split frame view of your original work and "with filters applied" if you double click the source file in the original compressor window that contains the time/quality encode settings.
Scroll through the dark parts of your program to make sure you haven't destroyed the image (showing as digital black squares) that end up as noise on the finished DVD encode. Play with the gamma a little bit to see what the "crushed black" looks like in your program.
I'm still finding compressor produces the cleanest image(no new noise) - but bitvice has the best color reproduction. I've done about 50 tests on this project I'm working on now. Thought I might save you some time!
Best of Luck! Kind Regards, Chris K.


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FlohRe: Bit Vice question
by on Jan 18, 2007 at 5:19:15 pm

You need to reinstall the codecs. There is one missing: the "Media100.component". This one is the one that is needed. Currently your system tries to use the Transcoder, which hasn


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Jack ShepardRe: Bit Vice question
by on Jan 18, 2007 at 5:28:28 pm

I can't thank both of you enough for your help.
You just saved me an infinite amount of time!

All the best,
Jack


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topher944Re: Bit Vice question
by on Jan 18, 2007 at 7:44:33 pm

Jack, Forgot to mention to play with contrast a few points too. It can help get your blacks back. Have you noticed any xtra noise in your bit vice compressions? Kind Regards, Chris K.


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Jack ShepardRe: Bit Vice question
by on Jan 18, 2007 at 7:58:19 pm


Just kicked out a DVD with your specs (now that I have the right codec!) -- it looks pretty good I have to
say. The colors and contrast I thought actually looked quite close. I did notice dissolves were a bit strangely affected - they seemed to "burst" on and off a bit if that makes sense... which I am sure probably has something
to do with the blacks.

In terms of bitvice and grain, I'm not sure if I am a good judge at this point. I have always used an external dvd burner/recorder as a quick and down and dirty way of kicking out dvd's. But it came up recently that I actually needed to make one digitally so... thought it was time to learn. I'll post more as I try it.

Cheers again for the help -- you literally saved me days!



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topher944Re: Bit Vice question
by on Jan 18, 2007 at 8:41:34 pm

Hey Jack, Yes the dissolves tend to get a bit crispy - I also believe it's the blacks. Maybe compressor will add an rgb studio range adjustment in the future. Glad to have helped somebody! Kind Regards, Chris K


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PaulyGRe: Bit Vice question
by on Jan 18, 2007 at 9:25:22 pm

I am still surprised you guys are getting more acceptable results with Compressor.

Am I reading these posts correctly or is my medication kicking in??

Paul



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topher944Re: Bit Vice question
by on Jan 18, 2007 at 11:02:50 pm

Hey Paul, I still can't believe it either, after all the good things that have been said about Bitvice. Compressor is handling the motion and the 640 to 720 scaling much cleaner than Bitvice. Bitvice color is far superior, but it adds unacceptable noise in areas of high motion - which is about 30 percent of my feature. By the way, if you ever scale via AE don't flip the fields from upper to lower. Leave it in upper and move your image 1 pixel down and 1 pixel right and you'll notice much sharper images, especially in Titling. I understand a pixel down but don't ask me how the hell 1 pixel to the right helps - but in split frame comparisons - 1 pixel shift right gives sharper lettering in the titles. I then send it out as an animation file and it looks great - except BitVice adds too much noise. By the way, I tested BitVice with about 20 different combos of upper field/lower field/1 pixel shift/no pixel shift/M100 720 codec/Animation/ and they all add noise to the picture. Noise that was not there after the scaling from AE! I have enough test DVDs lying around, I could re-tile my kitchen and yours with em! I'm happy, for the moment, I didn't spend the 350 on bitvice for this project. I hope the makers have been reading our posts. Best of Luck! Kind Regards, Chris K


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Michael SloweRe: Bit Vice question
by on Jan 24, 2007 at 11:32:15 am

Since you're talking about BitVice picture quality I would like to say what we have tried. I am editing in 8bit uncompressed HD and when making SD DVD's have been letting BitVice do the downscale. The results were not too bad but sometimes a bit noisy, especially with movement. I was advised to try the downscale within Media 100 and to use Motion JPEG B as the compressor. This gave me a slightly better picture quality. Has anyone else done this and would Floh care to make a comment on this please?


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topher944Re: Bit Vice question
by on Jan 18, 2007 at 11:02:59 pm

Hey Paul, I still can't believe it either, after all the good things that have been said about Bitvice. Compressor is handling the motion and the 640 to 720 scaling much cleaner than Bitvice. Bitvice color is far superior, but it adds unacceptable noise in areas of high motion - which is about 30 percent of my feature. By the way, if you ever scale via AE don't flip the fields from upper to lower. Leave it in upper and move your image 1 pixel down and 1 pixel right and you'll notice much sharper images, especially in Titling. I understand a pixel down but don't ask me how the hell 1 pixel to the right helps - but in split frame comparisons - 1 pixel shift right gives sharper lettering in the titles. I then send it out as an animation file and it looks great - except BitVice adds too much noise. By the way, I tested BitVice with about 20 different combos of upper field/lower field/1 pixel shift/no pixel shift/M100 720 codec/Animation/ and they all add noise to the picture. Noise that was not there after the scaling from AE! I have enough test DVDs lying around, I could re-tile my kitchen and yours with em! I'm happy, for the moment, I didn't spend the 350 on bitvice for this project. I hope the makers have been reading our posts. Best of Luck! Kind Regards, Chris K


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Andy TaplinRe: Bit Vice question
by on Jan 31, 2007 at 6:37:49 pm

Just thought i would join in here a bit late I know...

If you're serious about MPEG-2 encoding and you want the best result from M100 and you don't mind paying


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