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Timecode Reader anyone?

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Bruce Wittman
Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 8, 2012 at 4:36:54 pm

Has any clever person figured out how to use a timecode reader (not timecode generator) within FCPX? Our clients want a timecode window burn of our raw footage, NOT the timecode of the timeline? I have seen the Spanish plug-in, but it does not work with FCPX Version 10.05, as far as I know.

Many thanks!

Bruce Wittman
Executive Producer

Eagle Video Productions, Inc.
2201 Woodnell Drive
Raleigh, NC 27603-5240

Website: http://www.eaglevideo.com
Email: bruce@eaglevideo.com

pho: 919-779-7891
cel: 919-818-5556


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Bill Davis
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 8, 2012 at 6:07:50 pm

Not directly "read" it - but you can click on the Project in the Project Library then open the inspector and use the Action Menu - (the wrench icon) to change the starting timecode of your project to match the value of your original.

That should sync your window burn with the original tape.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Bruce Wittman
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 8, 2012 at 6:44:07 pm

Hey Bill,

Thanks for your suggestion. In my case, I have 139 shots (Sony XDCAM) that need window timecode.

Bruce Wittman
Executive Producer

Eagle Video Productions, Inc.
2201 Woodnell Drive
Raleigh, NC 27603-5240

Website: http://www.eaglevideo.com
Email: bruce@eaglevideo.com

pho: 919-779-7891
cel: 919-818-5556


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Bill Davis
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 9, 2012 at 12:33:33 am

[Bruce Wittman] "Hey Bill,

Thanks for your suggestion. In my case, I have 139 shots (Sony XDCAM) that need window timecode.
"


Ok.

I think the central truth is that if you're planning to use X as an "intermediary" solution and need to read that original timecode in order to coordinated with an outside editor that must reference the original numbers, the "closed" FCP-X system is not going to work well for this.

If you're just looking to do window burns for use with clients to coordinate a paper edit - then there's nothing to stop you from dragging all 139 clips onto a timeline and doing a timecode burn out of that.

I do that all the time for clients - and it's fast and easy.

And you can use the notes to keyword selects from that window burn timeline and use "reveal in event browser" to transfer your ranges back into your Event.

So in that sense, the "original" timecode becomes inconsequential if (and it's a BIG if) you can remain in X through your entire edit..

But I understand that if you must have references to the camera files because more than one editor with different systems need to use your X selects as a general purpose logging database, it's not as automatic to get that exported at this stage in the X development cycle.

I'm willing to bet that this will change over time, because at heart it's a big database, and importing and exporting data is one of the core capabilities of every database.

But for now, you probably need a different tool.

Sorry.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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James Bayliss-Smith
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Oct 10, 2012 at 4:47:56 pm

[Bill Davis] "And you can use the notes to keyword selects from that window burn timeline and use "reveal in event browser" to transfer your ranges back into your Event."

Hi Bill can you explain this step in more detail. I can't seem to make selects without using the blade tool to cut the timeline up ThEN using the reveal in event browser to reference the source clip. I hope that makes sense, how do you make selects on the timeline. I can make range selections but then I cannot control-click them to reveal in event browser, just whole clips or bladed clips.


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Chelsea Wagner
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on May 27, 2013 at 6:37:31 pm

Very nice fix.... Worked great with the timecode generator....


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Mark Dobson
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 8, 2012 at 6:11:47 pm

It's not possible at the moment Bruce.

If you put 'timecode' or 'source timecode' in the search box in the forum post index you will be able to read my previous attempt to discover an answer to this very specific problem.

I resorted to FCP7!


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Bruce Wittman
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 8, 2012 at 6:45:09 pm

I had to do the same thing. It's a shame when you have to move backward when moving forward...

Bruce Wittman
Executive Producer

Eagle Video Productions, Inc.
2201 Woodnell Drive
Raleigh, NC 27603-5240

Website: http://www.eaglevideo.com
Email: bruce@eaglevideo.com

pho: 919-779-7891
cel: 919-818-5556


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Leo Hans
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 8, 2012 at 6:48:09 pm

I had a Free Timecode Reader, but sadly It has stopped working since 10.0.4. I don't know if its a FCPX/Motion bug or a deliberate change in the filter I was using for it, but It doesn't longer work.

http://finalcutargentina.blogspot.com.ar/2011/07/timecode-reader-gratuito-p...

I have reported the problem to Apple, but It still doesn't work. Perhaps in 10.0.6? I hope.

Leo Hans
Editor AVID - Final Cut Pro
http://www.leohans.com


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 9, 2012 at 1:45:30 am

[Leo Hans] "I had a Free Timecode Reader, but sadly It has stopped working since 10.0.4. I don't know if its a FCPX/Motion bug or a deliberate change in the filter I was using for it, but It doesn't longer work.
"


What's weird is that clip skimming tc broke in .4 only to be fixed in .5.

Maybe they are related somehow.


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John Moffat
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 8, 2012 at 7:21:05 pm

There is a workaround that might help.

Copy the RAW files that you want to send to you client into a new event. FCPX will then copy those files at the finder level into a new event folder. Use Compressor to add burnt in timecode to your viewers.


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Bruce Wittman
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 8, 2012 at 7:55:08 pm

Hey John,

Not sure what you mean by using Compressor for each of these 139 separate shots with time of day time code. Sony XCAM gives me a BPAV folder, which I un-compress with the Sony XDCAM browser or bring directly into FCPX Event using Archive Camera Footage. Can you explain further?

Bruce Wittman
Executive Producer

Eagle Video Productions, Inc.
2201 Woodnell Drive
Raleigh, NC 27603-5240

Website: http://www.eaglevideo.com
Email: bruce@eaglevideo.com

pho: 919-779-7891
cel: 919-818-5556


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John Moffat
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 8, 2012 at 8:35:10 pm

Hi Bruce,

I've not used XDCAM or any files direct from a BPAV folder in FCPX yet so this might not work. Or i'm not understanding what you want. However when you import files into FCPX it will copy (at the finder level) the Quicktime files into "Original Media" folder in the event folder. I would use FCPX to create a new Event and move a copy of the 139 files you need into the new Event. At the Finder level a new Event folder will have been created with a copy of the 139 shots in it. Grab those files and stick them through Compressor selecting add BITC from the options.

You might need to transcode the files to Proxy or ProRes422 first so compressor can read them. I don't think it can read BPAV folders.

john


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Tom Brooks
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 9, 2012 at 12:56:41 am

To make "window dubs" of raw clips I control click on a clip in the Event Browser and select "New Compound Clip." Double-click to open the compound just created. Add more of your original clips if desired. Put the Timecode generator on top of the whole thing. Seems to work for me. I just share the compounds with clients and use the original clips for my edits.


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Bill Davis
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 9, 2012 at 1:17:00 am

Not sure I understand why you make compounds here?

Just string your clips out in a project. Drop a timecode generator as a connected clip on the first clip - and stretch it out down the entire timeline.

Share and you've got a Window Dub. Simple as that.

No need to compound anything.

And as I mentioned before, if you want your window dub to match a field tape, just go into the Project Library - click on your project. Open the Project Properties and make your initial timecode value match your field reel.

This software is designed to be easy and direct to use. I think people sometimes make it much more difficult than it needs to be.

FWIW.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Bruce Wittman
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 9, 2012 at 1:28:10 am

Hey Bill,

Your idea works if my client uses FCPX also. These 139 clips are time of day coded. That means each shot has a time code that may not be sequential. Shot 12 may be 9:25:00 and the shot 13 could have 12:23:44 tiomecode, so your timeline timecode will not work in this case.

Bruce Wittman
Executive Producer

Eagle Video Productions, Inc.
2201 Woodnell Drive
Raleigh, NC 27603-5240

Website: http://www.eaglevideo.com
Email: bruce@eaglevideo.com

pho: 919-779-7891
cel: 919-818-5556


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Andreas Kiel
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 9, 2012 at 10:12:08 am

As said above, the TCR died with 10.0.4
I think quite a lot of people have filed that as a bug, so there is some hope it will be fixed.

Only chance is to make a copy of each of the files with burned in TC using Compressor or to use FCP.

-Andreas

Spherico
http://www.spherico.com/filmtools


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Bill Davis
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 9, 2012 at 6:36:23 pm

[Bruce Wittman] "Your idea works if my client uses FCPX also. These 139 clips are time of day coded. That means each shot has a time code that may not be sequential. Shot 12 may be 9:25:00 and the shot 13 could have 12:23:44 tiomecode, so your timeline timecode will not work in this case."

Bruce,

Yeah, I get that. What I'm actually saying is that the way I used to think about timecode when I started back in the analog era, was that whatever the timecode was that the camera stamped onto the tape - that was the timecode that followed shots down the entire production pipeline. With few exceptions.

What's changed for me is that once I got into the realm of digital files, where (depending on your workflow, of course) virtually lossless digital cloning of media is possible, I had to re-think things in the face of the fact that there's really no functional penalty for making an early stage clone of my field stuff - and making THAT my new master source. And if you can do that. You can make changes like timecode application and scene order at that point.

I couldn't do that back in the day, because every generation WAS a degredation and the goal was to keep as close to the original quality as possible.

Today I don't worry about that.

So I'm saying that if I *KNOW* that I'm going to be working in ProRes exclusively after camera ingest, then there's not as much value in trying to preserve links back to the camera master timecode - I can just distribute my clone to EVERYONE in the production chain - with the timecode I specify - and everyone can proceed from that new starting point.

Again, I don't understand your workflow so there could be ample reason that you need to match back to a tape on a shelf or even the clone of a field file in an archive somewhere. So it's perfectly possible that you can't use my suggestions. And that's fine. But I just seem to run into a lot of folks who follow the older traditions when those don't "necessarily" always make quite as much sense in the new digital era as they did in the old.

Only you know your workflow well enough to know whether something suggested here will work for you.

Along with everybody else, I'm just guessing and trying to help.

Good luck.

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Tom Brooks
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 9, 2012 at 12:51:34 pm

Bill, my goal is the same as your method with the Project. If I want to window dub all the clips of Dave Smith, I highlight the first one in the Event Lib, make a compound from it, name it Dave Smith window dub, and then append all the rest of the Dave clips to the compound. This puts the compound in the Event Library and the default is to match the timecode to the first clip. Drop the TC generator on and stretch it and I'm done. Seems like the only basic difference is that you store a Project and I store a compound clip in the Event Library. That makes it real easy for me to see that I have created window dubs of all the source clips--usually interviews in my case. It works with sequentially coded clips--would not work with the time-of-day coded clips that Bruce has.

When I get the selects back from the client, I just use the original clips and Favorite the selects as I mark them.


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Bill Davis
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 9, 2012 at 9:50:32 pm

You're right.

Same difference.

I seldom put compounds in my Event Browser - but thats no reason not to do it that way.

In fact I'm not sure there's any real huge difference between storing a Window Dub as a Event or as a Project.

Both are available to you whenever you need them.

I suppose I think of Events as stuff I draw on for projects, and Projects as expressions of Events for export. Since sharing is typically what I do with window dubs, my brain thinks it should be a Project, not an Event - but there is absolutely no actual reason I can think of that your way doesn't work every bit as well.

One of those differences without much distinction, I guess.

Carry on!

"Before speaking out ask yourself whether your words are true, whether they are respectful and whether they are needed in our civil discussions."-Justice O'Connor


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 10, 2012 at 5:43:52 pm

Alex4D tweeted that he might have a work around for this, but he hasn't posted the solution yet.

"It's more about using a generator to display the source timecode of a clip on the clip itself, ... Broken since #fcpx 10.0.5"

He also called FCP X, Final Cut W for Workaround. :)


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Alex Gollner
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 11, 2012 at 11:51:15 am

The workaround is better than some but not as convenient as applying an effect to a clip.

The problem is that clip timecode is no longer passed to effects. This means setting up the timeline the clip is on to match that of the clip. So, open a clip in its own timeline and add the timecode generator. It reads the timecode of the timeline it is on - which is correct when opened from within the Event.

However these 'timecoded' clips don't display properly in projects. The generator in the clip timeline gets the timecode of the project, not the clip. So the workaround workaround is to make a single angle multicam clip of your timecoded clip. When this multicam clip is used in a project timeline, the timecode generator in the clip timeline gets the timecode of the multicam clip. Luckily multicam clips default to starting with the timecode of the clip they are based on.



Not a great solution for 136 clips, but perhaps better than nothing.

An advantage of multicam clips is that every instance of the clip in all projects links back to the same multicam clip, which means that if you want to turn off the clip timecode, you need only open the multicam clip in the angle editor and open the single angle clip in its own timeline and either delete or disable the generator. Once you do that in the multicam clip, the timecode disappears in all uses of the clip in all projects.

To see more screenshots and more detail on this method, visit my blog.

Hurrah for 'Final Cut Pro W'!

Hope the need for this workaround is short-lived and will be obviated in the next update (which is due by the end of the month given the frequency of previous updates).

___________________________________________________
Alexandre Gollner,
Editor, Zone 2-North West, London

alex4d on twitter, facebook, .wordpress.com & .com


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Bret Williams
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 14, 2012 at 5:45:26 am

Another option. Pretty similar really. Right click the clip in the bin, er, event, and "open in timeline." THAT timeline has the same tc as the clip. As it actually IS the clip. Add the TC generator and it matches the clip. BUT it also turns your clip into a compound clip in the event. However, just opening the clip back up and deleting the generator immediately returns it to a regular clip.


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alban egger
Re: Timecode Reader anyone?
on Aug 11, 2012 at 9:03:03 am

Since the plug-in I had doesn´t do this anymore I have a workaround if it was one camera....

Enter Multicam, throw all he clips in there and let them be arranged by timecode.
Set the timeline Timcode to start with the first clip´s timecode.
now drop a timecode generator and render it out.

import again and remove all the black-holes.



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