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MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina

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Don Scioli
MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 15, 2012 at 11:35:21 pm

I was just at the Corte Madera Apple store in California and placed a new 15 inch MacBook Pro Retina alongside a plain MacBook Pro and ran a commercial we just produced at 720 HD res from YouTube. As they ran simultaneously. I was not impressed by the retina image, it looked murky and crushed. I did an "unofficial" survey of customers in the store and asked their opinion and everyone picked the older MBP as having the better looking image. It was a spot that was very saturated with vibrant colors. (see below)







Since video is the most important component of what we do, I don't get this technological "benefit" if it does not look good. I use Mac Pros, so this does not directly effect me, but in the future, I'm not sure.


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Dave Jenkins
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 12:06:00 am

I just did a side by side of your video as I received my Retina MPB today. The image is a little more crushed on the Retina but it look a lot better than my 2008 MBP which the image looked washed out like the blacks were raised. There was more detail in the shot of the bowls on the table.

Dajen Productions, Santa Barbara, CA
MacPro Two 2.8GHz Quad Core - AJA Kona LHe
FCS 3 OS X 10.6 QT 10


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Daniel Frome
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 2:16:37 am

Yes, I'm curious about this as well. Regardless of people's personal opinions regarding apples pixel doubling technology in the retina display, it has proven to have excellent black levels as well as whites [both ends of the spectrum are among the best of any laptop ever [. It will be interesting to measure this more in the future.


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Brooks Tomlinson
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 4:20:42 am

Hey DaVe,
Sorry to bombard you with a question about your shinny new MacBook. But I have to know. Does the retina MacBook run the mercury engine in adobe premiere pro? (so when you start a new premiere project, does it give you the option to choose "mercury playback engine" in stead of a greed out "CPU playback" only)

If the answer is yes, did you intall the Cuda drivers?

Thanks,
Brooks

Brooks Tomlinson


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Jiggy Gaton
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 4:34:01 am

good questions Brooks. I am also wondering...also why all the Motion content was updated (As well as other apps) for the new display? What's that all about... perhaps you have to use updated content to get the most outta the new display... huh?

Phoenix Studios Nepal: A small A/V Production House in Kathmandu.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 3:24:43 pm

[Jiggy Gaton] "good questions Brooks. I am also wondering...also why all the Motion content was updated (As well as other apps) for the new display? What's that all about... perhaps you have to use updated content to get the most outta the new display... huh?"

So it looks better on the retina.

Small little GUI elements will appear soft and pixelated on the much higher res retina (they will look
scaled when not viewing in their native res).

FCPX was updated as well.

All applications will need it eventually.


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Jiggy Gaton
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 9:52:37 pm

[Jeremy Garchow] "Small little GUI elements "
whoa, wait. my Fcpx is at 10.0.4 which came out before the retina, and the only thing MAS wants to update is Motion content (1gb worth). That sounds like a lot more than GUI elements. Trying to download now, but MAS is super slow in this part of the world...but thx for helping me understand what this is all about...

EDIT: My MAS is broke... not seeing updates there, but on the store I see they exist...FCPX at .05... arg. But I get how small GUI elements would get messed up at 200+ppi vs. the old resolution.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 9:59:48 pm

Fcpx is now at 10.0.5. Need to update through AppStore for that one.

The content you are downloading is all the templates, backgrounds, generators, etc.


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Jiggy Gaton
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 10:02:17 pm

yes, thx, my mas is broke... i miss the old way of updating...

Phoenix Studios Nepal: A small A/V Production House in Kathmandu.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 10:03:44 pm

mas?


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Jiggy Gaton
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 10:51:23 pm

sorry, Mac App Store :) hanging out too much with apple wonks...

Phoenix Studios Nepal: A small A/V Production House in Kathmandu.


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Dave Jenkins
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 6:12:20 am

I haven't installed CS6 yet. I'll report back when I do but I don't have much experience with Premiere.

Dajen Productions, Santa Barbara, CA
MacPro Two 2.8GHz Quad Core - AJA Kona LHe
FCS 3 OS X 10.6 QT 10


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Jiggy Gaton
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 4:27:19 am

I just don't get it... batteries glued to the case and memory soldered to the board... what are they thinking? I guess they expect folks to just buy a new computer now every 2 years. But thanks for your review on the display... I have no problem with the current generation of displays... they look pretty darn good to me as is. especially when you connect a thunderbolt 27"er to it :)

Phoenix Studios Nepal: A small A/V Production House in Kathmandu.


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Brian Mulligan
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 12:22:52 pm

Did you run the video Native 720 or Full screen?

Brian Mulligan
Senior Editor - Autodesk Smoke
WTHR-TV Indianapolis,IN, USA
Twitter: @bkmeditor


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Don Scioli
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 1:45:49 pm

I ran the YouTube setting @ 720 and went full screen on the MacBooks through YouTube.


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Tapio Haaja
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 9:01:58 pm

BTW I guess you played Youtube through Flash player which isn't yet updated to support retina so at least with scaling there were some sort of double scaling involved. First Flash scales to 'old fullscreen' and then OSX pixel doubles outcome to Retina. I think it'd be fair to play video Quicktime Player which supports retina and scales accordingly.

Best
Tapio Haaja

On-Air Promotion Producer
http://avseikkailuja.blogspot.com/


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Rick Lang
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 11:22:29 pm

Tapio, I've been holding my breath for two days waiting for someone who has used Quicktime on the new MacBook Pro with Retina display. You're the first I've seen mention it. Would you be so kind to review this thread and respond to my last comment there near the bottom of the thread re QuickTime? Thank you so much fir your help.

Rick Lang

iMac 27” 2.8GHz i7 16GB


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Dave Jenkins
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 17, 2012 at 12:47:12 am

I just checked a file in Quicktime on the Retina dispaly and it look great. Very close to our broadcast monitor in color and contrast. However I did adjust the gamma in Squeeze when I compressed it.

Dajen Productions, Santa Barbara, CA
MacPro Two 2.8GHz Quad Core - AJA Kona LHe
FCS 3 OS X 10.6 QT 10


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Rick Lang
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 17, 2012 at 4:19:13 pm

Thanks for the note re Quicktime on the Macbook Pro Retina display, Dave. (I miss visiting Santa Barbara!)

So it looks like QT doesn’t pixel-double the contents when you want it to play actual size. That’s good news. If you have the time, it would be interesting to pause a playback while in actual size and then capture the window contents to see the pixel dimensions. Want to try that with a HD video? I’m hoping then the capture from QT’s frame would indicate a 1920x1080 image and not 3840x2160 pixels!

In my earlier post to Tapio to which you were responding, I just saw i neglected to copy the thread that I asked Tapio to review! The joys of using the iPhone to work in a forum where everything is so awkward to view. Here’s the missing thread:
http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/335/37157

Rick Lang

iMac 27” 2.8GHz i7 16GB


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Dave Jenkins
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 17, 2012 at 6:03:57 pm

[Rick Lang] "it would be interesting to pause a playback while in actual size and then capture the window contents to see the pixel dimensions. Want to try that with a HD video? I’m hoping then the capture from QT’s frame would indicate a 1920x1080 image and not 3840x2160 pixels!"

Hi Rick, So here is what's weird,
If I capture the desktop the size is 2880 x 1800
If I open a video in QT 1920 x 1080 it show up edge to edge of the screen as 1440 x 810
If I record the screen in QT the size is 1440 x 900
If I do a screen grab it captures a 1920 x 1080 image at 1920 x 1080

This is with the Display set to "Best for Retina display"

I think some of there program need updating, see images below

screenshot2012-06-17at10.21.11am.png

screenshot2012-06-17at10.33.18am.jpg

screenshot2012-06-17at10.47.15am.jpg

Dajen Productions, Santa Barbara, CA
MacPro Two 2.8GHz Quad Core - AJA Kona LHe
FCS 3 OS X 10.6 QT 10


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Rick Lang
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 18, 2012 at 12:09:21 am

Dave:
"If I capture the desktop the size is 2880 x 1800
If I open a video in QT 1920 x 1080 it show up edge to edge of the screen as 1440 x 810
If I record the screen in QT the size is 1440 x 900
If I do a screen grab it captures a 1920 x 1080 image at 1920 x 1080

This is with the Display set to Best for Retina display"

Thank you so much, Dave. So it is possible via the screen grab to get the pixel-for-pixel capture of the defined size of the video! Interesting that you did this with Best for Retina too. So no need to use the optional virtual screen with the virtual 1829x1080. It's certainly good news and I imagine if people chose to use the virtual screen of 1829x1080, the result will be the same for the screen capture. Actually once people understand when pixel doubling applies and when it does not, it will be useful to have these options. Your grab of the desktop showing 2880x1800 is correct of course because all the virtual screens really use the same physical dimensions of the actual display 2880x1800. It's important that defining a HD-sized video window in QuickTime for example can give one HD screen captures.

Rick Lang

iMac 27” 2.8GHz i7 16GB


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Dave Jenkins
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 16, 2012 at 10:55:47 pm

[Brian Mulligan] "Did you run the video Native 720 or Full screen?"

Both

Dajen Productions, Santa Barbara, CA
MacPro Two 2.8GHz Quad Core - AJA Kona LHe
FCS 3 OS X 10.6 QT 10


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Brooks Tomlinson
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 19, 2012 at 3:43:35 am

Dave, another question, have you tried smoke for mac 2013?

thanks

Brooks Tomlinson


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Dave Jenkins
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 19, 2012 at 5:56:07 am

Not yet, I have it but not installed. It's on the list.

Dajen Productions, Santa Barbara, CA
MacPro Two 2.8GHz Quad Core - AJA Kona LHe
FCS 3 OS X 10.6 QT 10


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Brooks Tomlinson
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 19, 2012 at 3:46:19 pm

Thanks Dave, let me know.

If you have some problems here are what the dev said at autodesk,

"Here’s something that you could try. Not saying it will work, but it might:
Go in System Preferences > Energy Saver and disable “Automatic Graphics Switching” at the top.
Please note that MAC OS Lion 10.7.4 and the MacBook Pro Retina line has not been certified by our team yet so it is not currently in in the “supported configuration’ list. There’s still a possibility thatthe trial will launch anyway, but the configuration is not certified yet."

if that doesn't work, if you have a external monitor, try launching smoke in "lid closed" mode. (where you have the lid closed on the macbook pro, and are just using the external monitor)

I want to buy one bad, but I want to learn the new smoke more.

Thanks again Dave,
Brooks
"I dream in 32bit float, don't you?"

Brooks Tomlinson


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Dave Jenkins
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 20, 2012 at 6:20:48 am

Hi Brooks, Smoke 2013 doesn't work on the Retina model. It crashes.

Dajen Productions, Santa Barbara, CA
MacPro Two 2.8GHz Quad Core - AJA Kona LHe
FCS 3 OS X 10.6 QT 10


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Brooks Tomlinson
Re: MacBook Pro Retina vs. MacBook Pro non Retina
on Jun 20, 2012 at 1:06:31 pm

Dave,
Thanks for trying man you are a rock star! Hopefully we will see some support for it soon.

Brooks

Brooks Tomlinson


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