APPLE FINAL CUT PRO: Apple Final Cut Pro X FCPX Debates FCP Legacy FCP Tutorials

Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰

COW Forums : Apple Final Cut Pro X Debates

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Bill Davis
Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 20, 2019 at 12:52:26 am

https://nofilmschool.com/switched-final-cut-pro-x-after-25-years

Creator of XinTwo - http://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery.


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Neil Goodman
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 20, 2019 at 2:39:05 am

For all the things he can say about FCPX that make's it better FOR HIM - I can make 5 cool videos about stuff thats only in Avid that makes it better FOR ME. Then some other guy is going to make a video about PPRO and Davinci and why those are better for him.

Whats more apparent to me now more than ever - with 4 badass NLE's on the market that are all fully capable, is that its coming back around to the focus on the "artist" and not the "paintbrush". Who cares what so and so is cutting on - is the work good?

Editors now have to put up or shut up because there are no excuses within either of the NLE's, and theres an insane amount of talent thats ambidextrous when it comes to the software available.

Not to mention - most of us Bill - still don't get a choice. To be blind to any of the offerings is just dumb at this point in the game. I could talk up FCPX until Im am blue in the face - no ones listening,.. I use PPRO daily at my job for the last 2 years - I don't like it at all and personally think its the weakest of the 4 at this point - no ones listening. I just gotta show up and cut better than the next guy.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 20, 2019 at 12:04:49 pm
Last Edited By Oliver Peters on Aug 20, 2019 at 12:11:10 pm

Well, it's easy to say he switched, but the real proof is whether he can make headway in using his now-preferred NLE on actual jobs that aren't projects totally under his control. Especially in series work - you use what the team has decided on.

It's also 8 years at this point and we are still pointing to a very small number of "conversions." Yes, I know there are large installation here and there. OTOH, there are quite a large number of post suppliers in all of the major markets around the world who readily field 80 to 100 Avid systems on long-form project rentals. And...those are often running on older hardware and software versions. FCPX has yet to come up with a competitive collaboration solution to challenge this.

So the story is nice - and thanks for posting - but isn't it just another drop in the ocean?

BTW - some of the selling points in his video are meh. For example, compound clips are not unique to FCPX. You can do the exact same thing in Premiere using nested sequences. Works the same way, except that the timing isn't messed up in the main sequence if you change the timing within the nest, which would be the case with the magnetic timeline and compounds in FCPX.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Herb Sevush
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 20, 2019 at 12:13:41 pm

Same old, same old. Could only get through two minutes of the "searching" segment before rolling my eyes. This guy may have been editing for 25 years but apparently he's never heard of organizing footage on timelines and pancake editing.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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greg janza
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 20, 2019 at 2:53:47 pm

Is there any way possible to bring this now completely meaningless debate to an end?

https://www.linkedin.com/in/tmprods
tallmanproductions.net


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Eric Santiago
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 20, 2019 at 3:24:36 pm

For my recent experience, FCPX topped Avid in pre-assembly.
A RED 8K project 30TB no timecode to boot.
It was fun using the sync option for two weeks after hours after data delivery.
Yep, they wanted proxies by next day :P
I know I'm a sucker for punishment.
Also of note, even if I did the 3 perf option in Avid, playback on the same system was brutal between 4K to 8K files using MC 2018.x.
As long as the files are on RAID, FCPX playback was butter :)


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Neil Goodman
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 20, 2019 at 3:19:04 pm

[Herb Sevush] "apparently he's never heard of organizing footage on timelines "

When I watch alot of these videos - the common theme is my life is changed when actually - most of these solutions already exist in other apps. They just didnt know where to look or how to be creative with the tool set

For example.

Keywords in FCPX - They are awesome indeed. No ones arguing that.

But in Avid I can simply drop a marker with the word "b-roll" or "close-up" or a whole sentence of dialougue, and that is now searchable and immediately called up with a click.

dont even need to use markers to achieve this but its one way to do it.


Another example:

Background Transcoding/ Rendering.

In FCPX nothing actually happens until you STOP working. Therefore nothing is really happening in the background.

In Avid - you have the option to let it actual do the transcode/render while you work - or it'll pause like FCPX when you work, and do the computing when the user is idle.

Somehow a 30 year old program implemented a better solution to background processing than FCPX that gives the user more options.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 20, 2019 at 3:38:30 pm

[Neil Goodman] "Somehow a 30 year old program implemented a better solution to background processing than FCPX that gives the user more options."

Not to mention something like PhraseFind!

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Eric Santiago
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 20, 2019 at 5:27:10 pm

[Neil Goodman] "Somehow a 30 year old program implemented a better solution to background processing than FCPX that gives the user more options."

IMHO it still doesn't take away the years I've had to struggle through that app :P
It is a user personal experience these days and some of us have the pleasure to use them all.


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Paul Neumann
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 20, 2019 at 5:43:19 pm

Not to mention - most of us Bill - still don't get a choice.

So, I have a new client that sent me a link to a Sharepoint site where they would like to have all project files dropped off at the end of the job.

They didn't ask. I didn't offer.

But the folders were labeled "Premiere Projects", "After Effects Projects", "Audition Projects", "Photoshop Files"....

You get the point.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 20, 2019 at 6:28:14 pm

[Paul Neumann] "Sharepoint site"

As an FYI - FCPX Libraries get messed up with these types of services. Definitely DropBox. If you send a Library, make sure to zip it first.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Oliver Peters
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 21, 2019 at 6:19:39 pm

The thing is, on its own FCPX is a wonderful editor. In a small workgroup, it can also be made to function in a quasi-collaborative manner through various workarounds. But it simply has too many holes for a lot of companies to make the switch. Interchange with other apps is worse and collaborative working methods are worse. Until that's addressed, these sorts of stories will continue to be outliers. Unfortunately the sad truth of our business is that processes work best when you restrict yourself to a single ecosystem.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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greg janza
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 22, 2019 at 3:17:32 am

A recent anecdote involving my wife illustrates a problem with the "FCPX is so awesome" approach to our business.

We recently attended a wedding in which we met a very nice gentleman who told us that his son is just starting out in his career as a video editor/shooter but that he doesn't have a lot of connections yet. My wife is a staff video producer and she hires freelance editors and shooters and so she asked for the son's contact info.

My wife had a phone interview with the son and during the interview, he informed my wife that he prefers working in FCPX. That's all well and good but all of the video work done in-house at her company is within the Adobe environment and so FCPX simply isn't an option for editors. My wife's company operates like many other media companies in that all video work needs to be done within the ecosystem of the company. The work can certainly be done remotely but it makes no sense to have it done in FCPX since the project will eventually go back to the company and a staff editor may revisit the project down the road.

My wife is still going to give this young professional a chance because his portfolio does indicate that he has talent but it'll be his responsibility to put his personal preferences aside and do his best to work in an environment that may not be what he prefers but which is a paid professional gig.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/tmprods
tallmanproductions.net


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Tony West
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 22, 2019 at 1:44:09 pm

[greg janza] "My wife is still going to give this young professional a chance because his portfolio does indicate that he has talent"

Question for you Greg, with so many young people starting to cut at a very young age in X (sometimes as young as 12) at what point do companies like your wife's start to adjust to field all that young talent, or do you chance having them out there on their own competing against your wife's company and chipping away at profits? I think that's a question that this industry will be looking at across the board. Up until this point companies have done what she is doing, have them come in and learn what's there, but does that change at some point?

Back in my day I had to wait until I was 18 and in college to learn how to edit. Now young folks coming out can have a decade of experience when they finish school.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 22, 2019 at 1:48:19 pm

[Tony West] "with so many young people starting to cut at a very young age in X (sometimes as young as 12)"

I think that's an assumption, which isn't supported quantitatively. Especially given the small market share that Macs enjoy. I run into way more young editors (early 20s) who know Premiere, but not X. If anything, Resolve is the NLE to watch out for.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Tony West
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 22, 2019 at 2:40:05 pm

[Oliver Peters] "I think that's an assumption"

I base things I say on personal experiences for the most part. I have a cousin who just showed me his work that was really impressive. He's 12. Anybody can go on youtube and see kids putting up X videos. That's not a secret.

In Greg's own story he mentioned that they are giving that young person a chance because he has talent. Talent built on his early use of X.

That's why I asked him that question.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 22, 2019 at 2:42:18 pm

[Tony West] "I base things I say on personal experiences for the most part. I have a cousin who just showed me his work that was really impressive. He's 12. Anybody can go on youtube and see kids putting up X videos. That's not a secret."

I'm not questioning that. Only that such anecdotal experience can't really be extrapolated to the industry at large.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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greg janza
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 22, 2019 at 3:06:58 pm

[Tony West] "In Greg's own story he mentioned that they are giving that young person a chance because he has talent. Talent built on his early use of X."

Both my wife and I try to give access to folks just starting out in the business because we both remember how hard it was to break into the business when we were beginning our careers.

I think what was notable about my wife's interview was how this young professional didn't focus his approach on how he could possibly contribute to the company's needs and adapt his skills to those needs. Instead, he put forth his preferences for working.

This is directly opposite of how I approached the business when I was starting out and how I continue to approach the business 25 years later. When I was starting out, I learned linear editing consoles because that's what post companies used and that's how I could get hired. I later learned Avid when I wanted to get into television production because that's what TV production companies used. And then I learned Premiere when I segued into corporate production because that's what virtually every corporate in-house communications department and outside post facility used and continues to use.

So yes, my wife is going to give him a shot but hopefully, other folks who are attempting to get into this very competitive business will approach job opportunities with an attitude of "how can I help contribute to a project and the overall future success of the company" instead of "this is how I prefer to work."

https://www.linkedin.com/in/tmprods
tallmanproductions.net


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Tony West
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 22, 2019 at 3:26:55 pm

[greg janza] "This is directly opposite of how I approached the business when I was starting out and how I continue to approach the business 25 years later."


I hear you Greg. Your approach mirrors mine almost completely and our paths are much the same.

Your experience that you saw in him are the same as what I see in other new folks coming in.

The industry has changed so much since we came in. You really had to be working for someone else to have a chance at making a decent living. You couldn't purchase the gear to shoot, let alone the suite to cut in and even if you did you had few places to put it when done. None of that is the case anymore.

I'm not saying I have the answers, just thinking out loud and wondering : )


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Neil Goodman
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 22, 2019 at 1:55:17 pm

[Tony West] "at what point do companies like your wife's start to adjust to field all that young talent"

If its true talent - like Greg's wife company they will fold them into their existing workflow. How many kids do you think will turn down a job because of the software? coming out of school, not many I suppose as well as they wouldnt be in any position to make demands about the software they use yet.

The people who have been able to implement change with X at certain companies seem to come from really pedigreed backgrounds and have proven themselves and gained a certain level of trust to do so.


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Tony West
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 22, 2019 at 2:49:47 pm

[Neil Goodman] " How many kids do you think will turn down a job because of the software?"

I don't think they will turn it down. I think they will take it but keep doing their own jobs on the side that over time bring them closer to competing with the jobs that they are offered.

Things might not change at all, and independents will just keep chipping away at production houses like it's been for the last two decades or more.


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Michael Gissing
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 3:58:08 am

No software is forever so all of us, young or old have to be nimble and adaptable. Those creative 12 year olds will not be using X in ten years because X will EOL before then given the way the software world works, AVID, Pr & Resolve might be gone by then too, who knows.

Stubborn preference for software is an available luxury when you are running the shop, not being an editor for hire. Expecting that software to stay the same or to remain the best fit is folly.


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Tony West
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 5:25:52 am

[Michael Gissing] " Those creative 12 year olds will not be using X in ten years because X will EOL before then"

You might be right but who knows. AVID's been around for 32 years.

I remember people on this page claiming Apple wouldn't make a new Mac Pro. In a bit they will have made two of them since those wrong predictions.

My main thought was what percentage of those12 year olds will be looking to work for someone else or themselves in the future.


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Bill Davis
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 7:35:42 am

Smile.

8 years on nearly.

And everyone here still saying exactly what weโ€™re we were posting 8 years ago.

Itโ€™s like baptist call and response.

Stasis.

It would almost be comforting, if the entire rest of the world hadnโ€™t gone through so much change in the same period. .

The cameras are shrunk and shooting 4-6k, even the cheap ones..
My lights are all run cool now.
Nobody I know invests in $4,000 wireless VHF lavs any more.
TV transmitters are nearly obsolete
Radio is functionally a dead business walking.
I have a VO booth in my garage where I teleport into video chats most weeks, watched in real time globally.
My cel phone has more raw video, audio and computing reach and connectivity than any TV station I ever worked with.
I have gigabit down AND up internet at a 10th the cost I used to pay for an audio only ISDN line.

And this forum is still is at the EXACT same place it was before all that happened. .

The Cheers bar of the internet, frozen in the Hi, Norm! era.

Not sure if thatโ€™s comforting or depressing.

It was just a story link. Not a poke in the eye. But these are apparently sensitive times.

Oh well.

Creator of XinTwo - http://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery.


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Herb Sevush
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 12:29:54 pm

[Bill Davis] "It was just a story link. Not a poke in the eye. But these are apparently sensitive times."

I've often thought that any sentence that contains the word "just", as in "just a story link," needs to be looked at closely. "Just" is often a con man's best weapon, employed to hide an important point behind a cover of irrelevance. It's "just" $99 dollars, it's "just" a few blocks away, we're "just" friends. Whenever I see such a sentence I immediately listen to it again without the "just" - as in "it was a story link." Yes it was, and it was the same sort of link you have been posting for the past 5 years. And it contains the same overstatement and hyperbole that we have all grown so used to. So if you're looking for the cause of this stasis you mention, you might want to look in a mirror.

[Bill Davis] "8 years on nearly."

And X still hasn't taken the world by storm. It's an important part of the post eco system, used by a significant number of editors, and fully capable in many workflows. But I'd argue that it is, after 8 years of exposure, still less significant in the overall post world than FCP 7 was when it was EOL'd.

Which shouldn't matter to anyone who is happily using it, but the distance between the proselytizing and the facts is a bit of an irritation, something less than a poke in the eye and more like a loose eyelash.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
---------------------------
nothin' attached to nothin'
"Deciding the spine is the process of editing" F. Bieberkopf


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Neil Goodman
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 1:48:26 pm

I think this forum has come along way in 8 years.

We have all accepted FCPX for what is. Seems like you are still searching for some sort of validation.


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Bill Davis
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 26, 2019 at 12:18:48 am

[Neil Goodman] "I think this forum has come along way in 8 years.

We have all accepted FCPX for what is. Seems like you are still searching for some sort of validation."


Really?

Seems to me the forum is a shadow of its former self.

I post something the slightest bit provocative and the same guys respond that I might have expected to in 2012, and with the same responses!

Meanwhile the other X hangouts are beehives of discussion with hundreds of threads and tens of thousands of active members worldwide.

Considering the head start we had here, this might have been closer to that by now, but alas. That ship sailed long ago.

And I have all the โ€œvalidationโ€ I ever needed.

My editorial tools are super fast and super reliable, just as I predicted over and over. My clients are happy. I have editing friends all over the world now. And get to live on top of a ridge in Southern California and get to enjoy an ocean breeze every afternoon coming through my windows while I work.

If I knew I would have ended up here, doing this, I wouldnโ€™t have changed a thing.

And I hope everyone else can say exactly the same.

I hope the AVID and Premiere Pro folk are all every bit as happy with their choices, and situations as I am with mine.

Life is way too short for anything else, really. .

Creator of XinTwo - http://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery.


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greg janza
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 26, 2019 at 3:16:51 am

"Seems to me the forum is a shadow of its former self."

That's mainly a result of people moving to the facebook professional forums.

"I post something the slightest bit provocative and the same guys respond that I might have expected to in 2012, and with the same responses!"

The question you might want to ask is why you're posting something provocative about FCPX in 2019. The video industry overall has incorporated it into the mix along with the Adobe suite of programs, Avid and Resolve and they all seem to co-exist just fine.

This argument about tools of the craft was once sleep inducing and at this stage, it's coma inducing.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/tmprods
tallmanproductions.net


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Bill Davis
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 29, 2019 at 10:56:31 pm

Because of stuff like this crap, posted a couple of days ago in a Reddit โ€œprofessional editingโ€ forum...

โ€œfrom the titanic to noahs ark. a tour of editors that the industry as a whole has left behind. An article that almost no-one will need.โ€

Happily, nowadays a post like that finally draws more negative feedback then positive โ€”but it was posted just the same.

There are still wide, deep pockets of editors out there with their thinking ossified at the state where X should only be seen as a useless little toy.

Why let that continue without challenge?

Creator of XinTwo - http://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 29, 2019 at 11:10:36 pm

Bill,

Without context, it's very hard to understand what this quote you referenced means:

โ€œfrom the titanic to noahs ark. a tour of editors that the industry as a whole has left behind. An article that almost no-one will need.โ€

Quite frankly, it sounds like an FCPX fan talking about Avid editors, more so than anything else. And honestly, if you are going to Reddit for civil conversation, you're probably in the wrong place.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Bill Davis
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 29, 2019 at 11:23:53 pm

Sorry, I didnโ€™t feel it was right to attribute it since it was met pretty negatively.
It was a comment in response to Michael Yanovichโ€™s article to which I referenced originally, but on a sub-reddit for pro editors.

It was clearly suggesting nobody does (or should) take FCP X seriously even today.

Sorry the context wasnโ€™t clear.

It was nice to see the comment gather pretty negative feedback from those who commented. But someone still felt comfortable publicly posting that, so there is clearly a good bit of that sentiment still being articulated.

Creator of XinTwo - http://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 30, 2019 at 12:31:40 am

"It was nice to see the comment gather pretty negative feedback from those who commented. But someone still felt comfortable publicly posting that, so there is clearly a good bit of that sentiment still being articulated."

The COW doesn't seem to be feeling well tonight, so quotes in replies aren't working correctly.

In any case, even with that context, that sentence from the post doesn't seem to make a lot of sense. But of course, finding people saying dumb things is a lot of what Reddit is all about. Not to mention that very few, if any, active professional film/TV editors working at the high end, ever really hang out at any public forum. Many of those actually have more experience with multiple platforms than you might think.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Shane Ross
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 26, 2019 at 9:41:19 pm

Bill Davis - "Radio is functionally a dead business walking."

Uh...hardly. It's still HUGE. Many many millions still listen to it. And not only talking music stations, just ask Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity...dozens of right wing pundits who have multi-million dollar contracts about how dead radio is.

You might see some of the future right, but man, are you off the mark here.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Bill Davis
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 29, 2019 at 11:13:41 pm

[Shane Ross] "You might see some of the future right, but man, are you off the mark here.
"


Perhaps.

But I do a fair bit of work with professional media buyers.
If you listen to the big radio advertisers for those โ€œpopulistโ€ radio shows youโ€™ll start to notice something.

Overall the advertisers fall on a VERY narrow spectrum.

Itโ€™s not generally the big companies looking to reach wide bands of the population and most CERTAINLY not those marketing to young buyers seeking to establish brand loyalty for the long run.

Those ad dollars look elsewhere.

Talk radio is also awash in โ€œanxiety brandsโ€ like gold and silver investments, etc, etc. products that appeal to older, more conservative buyers.

Nothing wrong with that, but when those ears age out and die off - what will replace them?

Said another way, is ANYONE speaking to the under 60 set via radio these days? Whereโ€™s the new Prairie Home Companion for the hip? I know mandolin genius Chris Thile is trying to help NPR move forward in that space - but thatโ€™s Public Radio. And maybe Brandi Carlile and the Highwomen, can help - but that landscape is pretty sparse when it comes to mining dollars via JUST radio.

Weโ€™ll see.

Just a

Creator of XinTwo - http://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 12:08:17 pm

[Tony West] "My main thought was what percentage of those12 year olds will be looking to work for someone else or themselves in the future."

With all due respect, working for yourself is such a pipe dream. Even if you are self-employed, you still have someone - like clients or the shop you work out of - to answer to. Not everyone will be a "YouTube star".

Look at high-end feature film and TV editors. They essentially work for themselves. Yet even there they only rarely can dictate a software preferences other than Avid Media Composer, since that's typically what's deployed and expected on those productions. And entire team workflows are built around that as a known quantity.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Tony West
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 1:01:25 pm

I don't know if you are aware of it or not but you contradicted yourself in the same post.

First you wrote....

[Oliver Peters] "working for yourself is such a pipe dream"

Then you wrote.......

[Oliver Peters] "Look at high-end feature film and TV editors. They essentially work for themselves. "

I disagree with both statements anyway.

I didn't think I would need to explain it with all the vets on this page but I guess I do. One example of working for yourself in this biz would be, you approach the same client that the production house approaches instead of the production house. There's nobody in-between you and the client.


[Oliver Peters] "Not everyone will be a "YouTube star"."

Ah..........yeah, who said they would? There is plenty of money to be made on Youtube without ever putting your face on there. People get paid these days to put commercials up there and on FB. Those weren't avenues before. Heck, are you sure you really make more money than some of the people that are shooting weddings these days? I mean, have you seen any of these people's stuff? A friend just showed me the "trailer" to their family member's wedding video. It was fantastic. The "Trailer", dude. I can only imagine how the actual video itself will look. It's a whole nother game out there these days, with all due respect.


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Oliver Peters
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 2:27:53 pm

[Tony West] "One example of working for yourself in this biz would be, you approach the same client that the production house approaches instead of the production house. There's nobody in-between you and the client."

Yep. I live in that world every day. It simply doesn't pan out for most people in reality.

- Oliver

Oliver Peters - oliverpeters.com


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Tony West
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 3:07:47 pm

[Oliver Peters] "[Tony West] "One example of working for yourself in this biz would be, you approach the same client that the production house approaches instead of the production house. There's nobody in-between you and the client."

Yep. I live in that world every day. It simply doesn't pan out for most people in reality."


You don't live or work in my town but if you ever want to come here I'll take you on a tour of shuttered post house buildings and ad agencies that were king back in the day that don't exist anymore. It's working out for plenty.


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Neil Goodman
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 3:43:21 pm

come out to LA, ill take you on a tour of brand new post houses and agencies. A new one pops up seemingly every day.


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Tony West
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 5:06:08 pm

[Neil Goodman] "come out to LA, ill take you on a tour of brand new post houses and agencies. A new one pops up seemingly every day."

LA? Should be, you aren't comparing LA to the midwest though are you?


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Neil Goodman
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 5:57:15 pm

no not comparing.

you provided an example of what its like where you are - this is what its like here. Not making comparisons but region by region you will see different trends. So when you say individuals may have an advantage where you are - Im saying they dont here.


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Tony West
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 6:11:06 pm

[Neil Goodman] "region by region you will see different trends"

Agreed, but are you saying that over all in the country large scale production houses are on the rise?

Large scale post house growth is out pacing small and independents across this country?

So many people obviously don't live in LA. My brother does and works in the biz out there so I get out there a lot.


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Neil Goodman
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 9:18:18 pm

nope definitely not saying all that.

Im not privy to whats happening in other markets and I know LA isnt the world but it is a major center of media, where people from all over the world come to work and production houses and agencies are popping up all over. Since you provided the status of the industry where you live - I figured Id give a glimpse into where I live. Not sure where you're getting the rest from?


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Tony West
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 24, 2019 at 6:10:52 am

[Neil Goodman] "Since you provided the status of the industry where you live - I figured Id give a glimpse into where I live."

OK, but I already know about where you live. There are like 4 million people in LA and not only do you have TV and video work, you also have a great deal of Feature Film work.

Most places in the country don't have feature film work so that's not really an equal comparison with the majority of people who do production work.

It's like saying there are a bunch of casino jobs in Vegas. Yeah, I would think so.

My brother works for Disney out there. He couldn't do what he does here. We don't have those types of opportunities in this market or in MOST markets.

I didn't do the Stanley Cup independently, that's not possible or what I'm talking about. I'm talking about small to mid clients.

[Neil Goodman] " Not sure where you're getting the rest from?"

The rest of what from?


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Neil Goodman
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 24, 2019 at 4:13:49 pm

clearly a miscommunication going on.. all good cheers.


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Tony West
Re: Looks like the FCP X forces converted another AVID editor. Wonder who gets the toaster prize?๐Ÿ˜‰
on Aug 23, 2019 at 6:27:44 pm

Steering it back to the actual video that was posted, what I found interesting about it is that it's a good showcase for what I have always said X's main strengths are.

If you have a timeline that has 30 "tracks" it's fast and easy to move things around within a complicated timeline.

If you have a project with 2 thousand items organization is key.

So if you are cutting something with 3 or 4 tracks and 20 items yeah, you can just drop stuff out of the browser without tagging or marking or however you like to do it in whatever program you use.

His examples are with complicated timelines and it was interesting to see someone from that angle talk about it.


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