ADOBE PREMIERE PRO: Tutorials Forum Articles Podcasts Basics Forum Creative Cloud Debate

Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere

COW Forums : Adobe Premiere Pro

<< PREVIOUS   •   FAQ   •   VIEW ALL   •   PRINT   •   NEXT >>
Michael BudaySony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Sep 21, 2015 at 8:49:28 pm

I'm going to be shooting a large amount of material at 4K, most likely using the Sony FS7 and the XAVC-I codec @23.98fps. I'm wondering if anyone has worked natively in this format with Premiere Pro. I would prefer not to transcode all the footage, so staying in this format would be ideal if there are no major gotcha's.

Anyone gone down this road?

Thanks,
Michael Buday


Return to posts index

David Roth WeissRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Sep 21, 2015 at 10:47:54 pm

Premiere CC has no issues with the various Sony XAVC codecs, but you'll need a pretty beefy RAID if you want seamless playback without dropping frames and if you want to see things at 1/2 or full resolution.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist & Workflow Consultant
David Weiss Productions
Los Angeles


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


Return to posts index

Michael BudayRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Sep 21, 2015 at 11:08:20 pm

Thanks David. Any suggestions on minimum specs for a RAID setup to support 4K XAVC-I?


Return to posts index


paul colinRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 2, 2015 at 12:06:09 am

Hey Guys
I'm having a terrible time with XAVC-I 1080 24p footage from the FS7 in PP CC2015.
It plays OK but when I attempt a simple extract or lift from the time line. No go! It just doesn't work.
I recorded Pro Res 422 (with extension back)and laid it in a time line and everything worked.
I need some help here. Am I overlooking something?



Return to posts index

David Roth WeissRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 2, 2015 at 12:25:03 am

I discussed issues working with XAVCi in Premiere with Adobe's Al Mooney - it's definitely not working as it should, and Al and his team are looking into it. How long before it's fixed is anyone's guess, but Adobe has been pretty good at these things once they know lots of users are having issues.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist & Workflow Consultant
David Weiss Productions
Los Angeles


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


Return to posts index

Jon CollinsRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 2, 2015 at 12:07:43 pm

Interesting to hear. I hit a brick wall last week. The Adobe guys spent 2 days going over my setup with 4 screen shares, phone calls and support threads. Shooting on FS7 editing on IMac 5K. They couldn't work out the problem. I eventually figured out PluralEyes was rearing it's ugly head again and despite being years since corruption issue were first spotted, PluralEyes had somehow corrupted not just the project but also all the media caches too so no other projects would play back.

The senior engineer I talked to at Adobe said there was 99% chance that what I was suggesting couldn't happen, but after deleting the media cache, all was good in the other projects. The corrupt project is all but a write off.

Anyway, might be worth deleting the media cache files if you keep encountering issues.

Cheers,
Jon

Jon Collins - Videographer


Return to posts index


paul colinRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 2, 2015 at 1:09:02 pm

Thanks David!
One more thing . . .
As an attempt to patch the situation I placed some XAVC-I clips in a ProRes422 sequence and everything worked smoothly as far as working with the clips (extracts, lifts etc.)
But what am I losing or gaining by placing the native clips in a ProRes enviornment. I don't think it's transcoding the clips or maybe it is.
Your thoughts.



Return to posts index

Jon CollinsRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 2, 2015 at 1:13:59 pm

Hi Paul,

Setting the sequence to ProRes 422 is a standard thing with all my sequences. ProRes has always run much more happily on a Mac than Premiere's MPEG format so I would advise you to do the same thing with all yours. I found this tip out when managing a production team at an agency and we found that this cut our crashes by at least 90%.

Cheers,
Jon

Jon Collins
Director // Editor // Motion Graphics


Return to posts index

paul colinRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 2, 2015 at 1:27:42 pm

Hey Jon,
The questions: are those XAVC-I clips being transcoded just by placing them in the 422 sequence?
Thanks!



Return to posts index


Jon CollinsRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 2, 2015 at 3:03:02 pm

Hi Paul,

Not entirely... by setting a sequence to ProRes, Premiere will only render previews in ProRes. So if for example you stick a bit of a grade on there and some transitions, Premiere will render the necessary media to ProRes with effects on to playback usually on the fly. When you export (unless you enable the "use previews" option which is not recommended), Premiere will use the original linked media, so in this case XAVC-I, for export.

Cheers,
Jon

Jon Collins
Director // Editor // Motion Graphics


Return to posts index

paul colinRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 2, 2015 at 4:13:24 pm

Thanks Jon
I thought so I didn't think it was transcoding the clips.
So it looks like we will just have to wait for Adobe to catch up to make the use of XAVC-I footage entirely enabled in Premiere.



Return to posts index

David BaudRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 29, 2015 at 7:01:26 pm

You may want to consider re-wrapping your XAVC footage instead of transcoding and see if your system can handle it better. The advantage of re-wrapping is that you keep the original camera compression, but you put it in a more standardized container like Quicktime (as far as Premiere Pro is concerned). Transcoding to ProRes will be certainly less demanding on your system, but it is time consuming and take much more space on your hard drive (4-5 times the original file size in my experience). Also in my workflow, I color grade in Resolve, and re-wrapping allowed me to resolve some issues with round-tripping...

For re-wrapping I use EditReady from Divergent Media... very good software and customer service (I don't get any benefits for saying so;-)

Good luck,

David Baud
Post & VFX
KOSMOS PRODUCTIONS
Denver - Paris
http://www.kosmos-productions.com



Return to posts index


paul colinRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 29, 2015 at 9:17:50 pm

Hey David,
Excuse my inexperience but how does one rewrap the XAVC-I codec. I'm familiar with transcoding, but as you pointed out I don't really want to do that (re: ProRes 422)
Please explain the rewrapping process.
Thanks!
Paul



Return to posts index

David BaudRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 29, 2015 at 11:53:26 pm

Paul,

I am not sure I understand your question... sorry if I am already talking about things that you know. A video file format is made up of a container (Quicktime, AVI, MXF, MTS,... etc) and a codec (MPEG-2, MPEG-4 (H.264 being a subset), ProRes, etc...) Camera manufacturers traditionally have their own file format (using their own container and optimizing the codec for recording their images). Sony for example uses MXF files on their latest digital cameras.

The idea of re-wrapping in post is to change the way the file format is written in the camera, to a more common container used in editing, like Quicktime (.mov). The codec still stays the same with your file: there is no transcoding but most Mac programs will be able to "understand" that .mov file.
Because MPEG-4 decoding can be computer process intensive, not all computer configurations will be equal as to read such file.

I believe Divergent Media has more information on their blog regarding this process.

I hope this helps a little;-)

David Baud
Post & VFX
KOSMOS PRODUCTIONS
Denver - Paris
http://www.kosmos-productions.com



Return to posts index

paul colinRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 30, 2015 at 12:18:14 am

David,
Thank you for your thoughtful reply.
My question was not totally coherent. But it points to your statement "The idea of re-wrapping in post is to change the way the file format is written in the camera, to a more common container used in editing, like Quicktime (.mov)."
My question is: how does one change the way the file format is written (to.mov for example) in post? In other words what steps do I take to accomplish this?
Hope I have been clearer this time. Also thanks for the Divergent Media blog tip.
Best,
Paul



Return to posts index


David BaudRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 30, 2015 at 12:24:03 am

Editready is the software I use to accomplish the re-wrapping.

David Baud
Post & VFX
KOSMOS PRODUCTIONS
Denver - Paris
http://www.kosmos-productions.com



Return to posts index

Kent PopeRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Sep 26, 2015 at 4:44:17 am

I shoot FS7 4K footage and edit in Adobe CC2015 with an nVIDIA CUDA GPU (very important) with my i7 8 core 12mb RAM computer. It hangs at full resolution, stutters at 1/2 resolution, plays fine at 1/4 and 1/8. I occasionally get audio & video clock out of sync errors (video hangs, audio keeps playing) and hitting the spacebar to stop has no immediate effect (wait for it.....). My system is self-built. If you can afford it go with Xeon processors and a Quatro CUDA card, fast FSB, lots of memory, oh heck just go over to the VideoGuys website. They have details on GREAT DIY systems. Mine is based on one of theirs from three years ago and was screaming fast with multiple layers of BCC until I started throwing 4K at it.


Return to posts index

Tim KolbRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 30, 2015 at 1:28:10 pm

The only caution with re-wrapping...the camera media containers are cross-platform and other containers may not be...at least with all payloads. It's always a good idea to keep the original camera format files as a backup.

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Video Producer at I-CAR




Return to posts index


Steve ConnorRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 30, 2015 at 4:34:41 pm

I'm really hoping that the next PPro release will have better XAVC handling.


Return to posts index

David Roth WeissRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 30, 2015 at 5:03:59 pm

The developers are aware of the issues, which I understand are shared by those using Resolve. So, hopefully there will be a fix on its way sooner rather than later.

Meanwhile, I'm going to try rewrapping using EditReady, and I'll report the results here afterward.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist & Workflow Consultant
David Weiss Productions
Los Angeles


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


Return to posts index

Michael BudayRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 30, 2015 at 5:39:15 pm

Thank you everyone for the advice. Here's where I am now at the moment, and take into account I'm on the latest version of OSX El Capitan, which may be having negative effects:

a) FCP-X: Works flawlessly with XAVC-I/MXF. Immediate and VERY fast import, no transcoding (as long as the Sony MXF plugin is installed). Everything is amazingly snappy and fast at 4K. My only issue is, I cannot get around the very different FCP-X workflow and don't have time to learn it.

b) Premiere Pro CC 2015: Obviously some very weird problems with the UI on El Capitan and XAVC-I/MXF is unpredictable - sometimes snappy, other times sluggish, so abandoning Premiere for now.

c) Avid Media Composer/Symphony: XAVCI/MXF via AMA actually works fine. It's a little less snappy then media transcoded to DNX, but it's perfectly fine for editing - not seeing any playback hiccups or issues even with multiple effects stacked up. All other media from other formats was transcoded to a 4K/DNX format.

d) Resolve: Works fine natively in MXF, but the editing tools are too crude, so not a serious contender.

So, I'm moving forward with Avid and I start cutting today - so no turning back at this point ;-)

FYI, I did try rewrapping MXF > MOV with EditReady and there was no difference with Premiere.

- Best,
Michael


Return to posts index


Kent BeesonRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Nov 30, 2015 at 10:37:01 pm

yes waiting for ADOBE but even when I use the latest AJA system test for my new G-Tech Studio XL 24TB monster raid 5, I get not great performance as you can see, using XAVC codec at 4K



Return to posts index

Michael BudayRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Dec 1, 2015 at 3:44:57 pm

Well, Adobe released the latest versions of CC 2015 today, and I'm pleased to say that Premiere on El Capitan is now is as fast as FCP-X - lightening fast with 4K and native Sony XAVCI/MXF media.

A little too late for me however -


Return to posts index

chris kingRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Aug 11, 2016 at 5:19:20 am

Yes. Adobe Premiere Pro now cant deal with XAVC codec fine. The way I work my XAVC files in Ppro is to change XAVC to MPEG-2 or other editing friendly format. Click here, you can get some clues for editing Sony FS7 XAVC in Premiere Pro.


Return to posts index


Young monicaRe: Sony FS7 and XAVC-I Codec in Premiere
by on Aug 10, 2016 at 8:53:13 am
Last Edited By Young monica on Aug 10, 2016 at 8:55:59 am

I found a related tutorial on Google which may give you some clues. Good luck!


Return to posts index

<< PREVIOUS   •   VIEW ALL   •   PRINT   •   NEXT >>
© 2016 CreativeCOW.net All Rights Reserved
[TOP]