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Premiere CC Lags with large projects

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David Busse
Premiere CC Lags with large projects
on Mar 30, 2015 at 5:57:39 pm

I have a problem with Premiere lagging. Specifically when playing a sequence Premiere will either not play at all or play back footage at 1fps with either laggy or no audio. Other times it will play the first clip fine, but once a cut happens it will hold on a frame for several seconds. Or I'll try to move the CTI(playhead) to another clip and it will not refresh the program monitor to the new clip. Sometimes the program monitor will not refresh at all and my only choice is to restart Premiere.

Usually this begins to happen once I get to the end of a given project. My workflow includes duplicating sequences many times and there seems to be some sort of threshold of sequences and their complexity that causes this to happen more often.

For the specific project I am working on now I filmed with an FS7 and an A7S. FS7 was recorded in UHD 10-bit 4:2:2 XAVC-I and A7S was 50Mb/s h264. There are 5 hours worth of interviews. Timelines are in HD and have the FS7 synced to the A7S along with separate audio.

Specs:
OSX 10.10.2
iMac Retina, late 2014
4 GHz Intel Core i7
32 GB 1600 MHz DDR3 (26 allocated for Adobe software)
AMD Radeon R9 M290X 2048 MB
Internal drive: 1 TB Fusion Drive with Adobe software installed
External drive: 1 TB 7200rpm USB 3.0 drive with working project files (This gets me transfer speeds of 100-140MB/s)
Renderer: Mercury Playback Engine GPU Acceleration (OpenCL)

FWIW when working with After Effects and using Adobe Dynamic Link Premiere will often crash on me...


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David Roth Weiss
Re: Premiere CC Lags with large projects
on Mar 30, 2015 at 7:50:27 pm
Last Edited By David Roth Weiss on Mar 30, 2015 at 7:53:34 pm

A single hard drive is simply not going to have the throughput to playback the heavy demands of video, especially a complex timeline. The hard drive subsystem of your NLE is one of its major engines, unfortunately seldom appreciated my most users, who simply fail to understand that a RAID with a great deal of extra overhead is NOT a luxury for smooth playback with video intensive applications, but a necessity.

Unfortunately, because most people in this business today are REALLY cheap (blame the democratization of video that has made it so difficult to make money), most discussions about media drives come at the matter from the standpoint of the minimum necessary requirements, never mentioning the enormous benefits of extra system overhead.

In summary, keep this important rule of thumb in mind: "Every time you double the number of spinning disks in a stripe set (a RAID), you effectively double the throughput."

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


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David Busse
Re: Premiere CC Lags with large projects
on Mar 30, 2015 at 8:16:12 pm
Last Edited By David Busse on Mar 30, 2015 at 8:17:04 pm

Thanks David,
Fortunately for me, we just finished constructing a RAID 10 server and are troubleshooting it right now so we will be off of single drives soon. I also ran a quick test using the server and the playback was definitely better.

In the mean time I also discovered that while working with this project Premiere was using 600-750% of my CPU. I am experimenting now to see if proxy files will help reduce that load on my computer.


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David Roth Weiss
Re: Premiere CC Lags with large projects
on Mar 30, 2015 at 8:30:42 pm
Last Edited By David Roth Weiss on Mar 30, 2015 at 10:03:11 pm

Proxies will help, but will not be necessary with your new RAID installed.

Actually, let me revise what I wrote above...

What are the specs of you sever? How many drives? Connectivity? How many client machines attached?

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


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David Busse
Re: Premiere CC Lags with large projects
on May 1, 2015 at 5:13:04 pm
Last Edited By David Busse on May 1, 2015 at 5:13:59 pm

Hey David, thanks for the response...I missed your revision originally.

I did some more experimenting and I ended up needing to create proxies for my 4k footage. Even when working off a RAID 5 that was connected through USB 3 my computer couldn't handle the 4k footage.

Specs:
FreeNAS 9.3 Stable
Xeon E3-1231V3 3.4GHz
16GB DDR3
4x4TB Disks + 1 Spare
Configuration equivalent to RAID 1+0 (mirror first, stripe second)
ZFS format + LZ4 compression
Dual 1GB ethernet links, bound together with LACP
Users: 1-3, but problems occur with even 1 user


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David Roth Weiss
Re: Premiere CC Lags with large projects
on May 1, 2015 at 11:49:27 pm
Last Edited By David Roth Weiss on May 1, 2015 at 11:56:38 pm

Hi David,

I think part of the issue is that you striped your array as RAID 10 - that's not recommended for video - RAID 0, 5, or 6 are the recommended RAID sets for performance, especially when 4K workflows are the goal.

For future reference, RAID 1 and RAID 10 are really best reserved for direct attached storage, and for files such as photos and documents, but not for the high throughput demands of video on a shared storage system.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


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David Busse
Re: Premiere CC Lags with large projects
on May 5, 2015 at 3:39:09 pm

Thanks David. I'll see about changing the RAID to one that is better for video.


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David Busse
Re: Premiere CC Lags with large projects
on May 13, 2015 at 3:51:47 pm

David,
I consulted with the guy who built the server and he said this:
"RAID 0/5/6 is designed for high capacity and throughput. RAID 1+0 was chosen to favor multiple users accessing the server at one time.

With a four disk setup, RAID 1+0 or 0+1 should outperform RAID 5/6 since it has four disks providing data instead of two or three. (There's no checksum/hash disk.) If the array was larger, say six or seven disks, RAID5/6 could be faster.

It doesn't really matter though - one of the server's disks (without any RAID) is faster than the network connection feeding your computer."


Though after running off my RAID 5 directly connected to my computer more I think that this could be a problem with my iMac not being capable of the type of editing I want to accomplish. I seldom go more than 20 minutes without Premiere crashing on me when working with 4k(proxy files or not) between premiere and AE.


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Jake Rose
Re: Premiere CC Lags with large projects
on Aug 14, 2015 at 9:59:21 pm

Is RAID really necessary anymore with the advent of PCIe SSDs? The specs of these new SSD's are so fast, it seems like why bother with the complexity of RAID anymore.


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David Roth Weiss
Re: Premiere CC Lags with large projects
on Aug 14, 2015 at 10:05:36 pm

What's so complex about RAIDs, and SSDs are still prohibitively expensive.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


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Jake Rose
Re: Premiere CC Lags with large projects
on Aug 14, 2015 at 10:08:25 pm

True...I guess I am always working on shorter projects where I can store footage on optical drives, but transfer what I am working on onto fast SSD's and I haven't had any issues.
I have never used RAID. Fast SSD's have worked well for me.


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Gerald Prost
Re: Premiere CC Lags with large projects
on May 3, 2015 at 11:37:08 pm

I wonder if your graphics card is contributing to your woes. I originally bought the Mac Pro and it had a lot of playback issues with multicam. I returned it assuming it was defective and got another one but I got the same result. I bought a MacBook Pro with an Nvidia card, now everything works dandy. Because you cannot swap out your graphics card, I don't know what to suggest. Obviously a RAID will make a difference but it may not solve all your issues. Gerry in Calgary.


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