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Adobe Slow Your Roll Please

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Chris WalshAdobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 12, 2015 at 4:12:56 pm

I've become frustrated with intra-version incompatibility in CC 2014. Am tired of getting "project has been opened in a new version of Premiere and cannot be opened."

I love the updates to Premiere, but if the price of the update is that each new build kills project compatibility for any previous release then I need to find a new platform.

Yes, I know that we should all be using the latest release, but OS differences, editor preferences, and enterprise install limitations sometimes result in editors using slightly different versions of CC 2014.

So if a new release is going to kill compatibility, please warn me when I open it, the way you do with a CS6 or CC project. Or give me some easy way to create compatible versions of a project I plan on sharing.

Compatibility was and is my primary reason for using Premiere Pro. Regardless of other complaints, the biggest issue with FCP X for me was that it wouldn't import old FCP projects. I don't mind learning new software, I do mind rebuilding old projects by hand (as I did this am, in CS6, so I could hand off a template project to another editor).

The first time it happened I assumed it was my mistake. Now I realize it was by design. I just don't understand why it's necessary.

Chris Walsh

http://www.musicfog.com
Silver Spring, MD
Premiere Pro CC, FC7 & AVID
Former Windows diehard and edit*or


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David Roth WeissRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 12, 2015 at 5:19:34 pm

There, finally a calm, well-reasoned, balanced, and constructive criticism of the state of the Adobe's art as it stands today. The one thing I might inject here in defense of Adobe's development is that they are not playing in a static environment, Apple's constant changes to OS X, and the constant rewrites of drivers that requires, are a moving target that keep every developer behind the eight ball continuosly. So, the problems are not by any stretch all the fault of Adobe.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


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Ann BensRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 12, 2015 at 6:04:48 pm

Premiere has never been backwards compatible.

-----------------------------------------------
Adobe Certified Expert Premiere Pro CC
Adobe Community Professional


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David Roth WeissRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 12, 2015 at 6:19:04 pm

That's an over simplification Ann. There's more to this discussion, as we are no longer talking about major updates and upgrades as we have in the past, nowadays users are getting bombarded with a constant stream of upgrades (many of which are or seem mandatory) that are just one all to easy click away from creating a potential disaster, and there are no warnings to indicate a potential hazardous update vs. a simple non-hazadous update.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


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Ann BensRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 12, 2015 at 10:58:05 pm
Last Edited By Ann Bens on Feb 12, 2015 at 11:01:58 pm

No major update or upgrades the are all gradually but ....
For example CC14 is an seperate install from CC7 there for you could call it a upgrade.
You can open CC14(8.2) in CC14 (8.1) but you cannot open it in CC7 whatever version.
This was the same as previous versions such as CS6 or even CS3 for that matter.
You can open CS6.05 in CS6.0 etc.
Basically its all still the same. But you need to be very carefully in which version you start or save.
CC14 looks very much like CC7 so it very easy to make a misstake. Altough CC14 now has a blue UI.

Only recently AE offers an option to save in a previous version.

-----------------------------------------------
Adobe Certified Expert Premiere Pro CC
Adobe Community Professional


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David Roth WeissRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 13, 2015 at 12:25:12 am

Ann, the thread here is not about backward compatibility of projects, it's about updates that can all too easily screw-up a working edit station.

FYI, I am the #5 leading poster of all times here on the Cow, and for years I have been advocating that ALL users create a clone before unleashing any updates or upgrades to a working edit system. However, today upgrades and updates come at users much more often than ever before due to the new subscription model Adobe has adopted, and, as I said before, "users are only one all too easy click away from a potential disaster" that could render their edit stations dead in the water. At the very least, Adobe needs to add very conspicuous warnings to updates and upgrades warning users that they might encounter a whole host of issues if they click on the install button. Better yet, Adobe should coordinate with Apple and hardware manufacturers to insure that everyone is onboard with new drivers etc., BEFORE Adobe software encourages users to hit the install button for their upgrades and updates.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions


David is a Creative COW contributing editor and a forum host of the Apple Final Cut Pro forum.


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Walter SoykaRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 12, 2015 at 6:31:04 pm

After Effects only changes file format on major updates. Their minor feature updates do not affect project file compatibility. Ae CC 2014 v13.0 can open files last saved in Ae 13.1 and 13.2.

I think this is a very sensible approach, and that the Premiere team should adopt it, too.

The way to make sure your voice is heard is to file a feature request [link].

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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Dennis RadekeRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 13, 2015 at 11:11:46 am

[Walter Soyka] "After Effects only changes file format on major updates."

This is true as a rule for Premiere Pro as well. The exception to this was Premiere Pro 8.1. There were so many important new features that we wanted to get in that we had to make changes to the project file format that go around. That includes features like masking and transcode&consolidate, which I think we all would say were important additions.

But again, only major, full version updates do you generally expect a project file format change.

Dennis - Adobe guy


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Robert WithersRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 13, 2015 at 4:16:20 pm

Thank you, Chris. I switched from FCP7 to Premiere because Apple jettisoned the idea of compatibility of editing tools over time. And now have learned that Adobe is taking the same approach with the frequent revisions that change functionality and interface. I'm still using Pr 7.0.1 "2013" because of issues with 2014 and because issues with further "upgrades" echo all over the discussion groups with each release. Unlike some, my cinema projects don't develop as fast as Adobe's software. And I need to be able to access them over years, not months.

Documentation and training is a real problem too, since neither Adobe nor third parties seem able to keep up with the changes. Features and buttons appear and disappear, and you are more likely to learn about them through the grapevine than any other way.

Robert Withers

Independent/personal/avant-garde cinema, New York City


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Dennis RadekeRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 14, 2015 at 11:49:15 am

Robert,

See my note above in the same thread. We do work to have project files compatible at all times with a variety of options. I explain this year's exception above.

Cheers,
Dennis - Adobe guy


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Steve ConnorRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 15, 2015 at 9:05:34 pm

Adobe are obviously keen to show us CC subscribers that their pace of development has quickened so I'm not surprised this is an issue for some. I can't remember, is there a warning about project compatibility when you upgrade?


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Dennis RadekeRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 16, 2015 at 2:20:36 pm

[Steve Connor] "I can't remember, is there a warning about project compatibility when you upgrade?"

Yes, you're prompted to do a 'save as'


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Robert WithersRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 16, 2015 at 5:40:25 pm

Dear Dennis,
Thanks for your response.
I know you Adobe guys (and gals?) have good reasons for whatever your decisions are with the software and justifications for why you are right.
The feedback here is worth whatever it is worth to you, if only to give opportunity to justify your decisions.
What I've never heard from any Adobe guy or gal is a response like, "Hmmn, I understand how you might think that. Here's what we're thinking."
Point is, some of us don't agree with all the decisions. But the Adobe business model seems to be working quite well so there's no need to change, is there? And I'm a very "small" individual customer.
I post in these sessions more to interact with other editors than to expect to influence Adobe in any way.
Meanwhile, I'm working with Pr CC "January" 2014 for reasons stated above.
I hear Avid is known as a very stable NLE.
Best regards,
Robert

Robert Withers

Independent/personal/avant-garde cinema, New York City


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Dennis RadekeRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 16, 2015 at 7:36:28 pm

[Robert Withers] "The feedback here is worth whatever it is worth to you, if only to give opportunity to justify your decisions.
What I've never heard from any Adobe guy or gal is a response like, "Hmmn, I understand how you might think that. Here's what we're thinking.""


Hey Robert - Well first off, your opinion and input is always valuable to Adobe and to be fair I think to most software companies. I think Adobe has rightfully earned a reputation of trying to listen and respond to customer input as a whole. I would give a large measure of our current success to that very point! ;-)

We do understand how the pace of innovation (and by extension change) may be too fast paced for some and we are constantly trying to balance so many factors like this to make the very best software release we can at any given time. Inevitably, we can't please everyone and I do get where you're coming from.

To that end, we are focused on addressing some of what you say in upcoming releases. I'm sorry to say that I can't be more specific at this time, but I believe it will be good even if it is a bit invisible.

The other side of the coin for us is that if Adobe doesn't constantly innovate and address other customer concerns and feature requests, our competition will. I'm afraid it's a bit of a catch-22.

Customer will always come first, it's just that some customers want more innovation based on their current needs than others and that isn't likely to change in the foreseeable future, alas!

[Robert Withers] "I post in these sessions more to interact with other editors than to expect to influence Adobe in any way."

For sure! Yet, I would point out that folks like myself, Todd Kopriva, Peter Garaway and others lurk in these and other forums to provide assistance and take your input here as part of our overall commitment. Hopefully, the Cow's input positively affects Adobe products - I think it does.

Dennis - Adobe guy


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Robert WithersRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 16, 2015 at 10:43:30 pm

Thank you Dennis, I didn't mean to get up on a high horse. You and other Adobe folks have been very helpful in these discussions. There are a lot of things that work well with the software which is why I continue to use it.
All best regards,
Robert

Robert Withers

Independent/personal/avant-garde cinema, New York City


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Tim KolbRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 22, 2015 at 3:44:27 pm

The biggest thing to make this process easier would be to be able to rollback an update if it ends up throwing a wrench in the works...

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Video Producer at I-CAR




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Robert WithersRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 23, 2015 at 4:19:39 am

It seems like we can go back to an earlier version, but once we've opened a project in an "updated" version the files and project can't roll back. So I stay with Pr CC 7.0.1 for a long-term project, fearful of making unpleasant discoveries in the 2014 updates.
But that's the standard suggestion, right, don't update in the middle of a project.
I'm just grateful I was able to switch over from FCP to Pr CC in mid project without anything failing.

Robert Withers

Independent/personal/avant-garde cinema, New York City


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Ryan PatchRe: Adobe Slow Your Roll Please
by on Feb 16, 2015 at 8:40:15 pm

I completely agree!


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