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Felix Gorbach
render very slow
on Sep 15, 2012 at 7:49:14 pm

Hi folks and premiere gurus,

I just upgraded my hardware and softwaretools to a hp Z820 workstation with 64 GB Ram an da Quadtro 4000.

Everything works realy fine - cuda works - nice. But when I import 10 bit dpx (720p, 25 fps) rendered files from resolve, the realtimeplayback even in 50% sized window just stucks.

Ok - no prob - I render, just like I did houndred times before. Premiere isn´t made for image sequences - and dpx is kind of new to premiere....

But when I start to render the entire work area - it just takes far too long. The speed is like with my old machine - When I fire up the task manager, the CPU Usage is at 10% - with 24 cores... RAM is at 11 GB from potential 64 GB. So it´s not the hardware that has the bottleneck I suppose....

I just can´t belive that premiere is not capable to use the full hardware in a version called CS6! Before CS, there was premiere 7 - so there are about 11 iterations of the app - and it´s not capable to use the given hardware to it´f full potential?

I´m pretty sure that I made a mistake in the preferences or so, cause I just can´t belive, that premiere is not able to do take the full advantage of todays machines.

Please help me to configure premiere !!

Best regards,

Felix


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Tom Daigon
Re: render very slow
on Sep 15, 2012 at 8:38:41 pm

I have almost the exact same system and had a similar problem. In 6.02 the Hyper threading was not working right with the CUDA. Read this link for a solution that got my Z820 back into the Supersonic speed mode. Look for EC Bownes posts.

http://forums.adobe.com/thread/1061522?tstart=120

Heres a selection of that thread...


63. ECBowen,
Sep 7, 2012 5:15 PM in reply to ComputerNovice25
Report

I think I have an idea what is going on now. It seems the new update has significantly optimized the Cuda block allocation going on in the background. When I was testing at 16GB of ram I saw far more fluctuation of ram usage going as low as 4GB on the same project that normally pushes 10 to 13GB with all threads active. When all threads are active the ram usage is staying relatively consistent at 8 to 11GB with far less flushing. However with far more ram available it seems the optimizations are triggering some Windows 7 ACPI Power management features that are shutting down cores as not needed even though the actual application really could use the processing to complete the task. Each system board has different ACPI sets that will adjust what Windows 7 does, how, and when regarding power management. This would explain why this is not consistent. This unfortunately is looking like a side effect of optimizations to the Cuda Player Memory allocation and not a bug. Lasvideo you may have to make those registry adjustments after all since this may not be fixable on Adobe's side.

Eric
ADK



At the thread Eric provides a solution to the problem that nails it.

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
http://www.hdshotsandcuts.com




(Best viewed at 1080P and full screen)
HP Z820 Dual 2687
64GB ram
Dulce DQg2 16TB raid


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Pierre Jasmin
Re: render very slow
on Sep 16, 2012 at 8:48:17 pm

Did you try just setting Power Options to High performance?

Control PanelAll Control Panel ItemsPower Options

I have seen this on another app with an ASUS motherboard and Sandy Bridge chips and AMD 7970 gfz running some other app, over 30% slowdown using Balanced Plan...

Pierre



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Pierre Jasmin
Re: render very slow
on Sep 16, 2012 at 9:28:47 pm

I see someone else on the thread you refer has the issue even with Power Management on

- Try the same with the nVidia Power Settings (in 3D settings)

Other things to try to see for trouble shooting:

- start a long render and disconnect the monitor cable from the computer (then windows won't think the screen has not been refreshed for some amount of time...) and see if it makes a difference in time it took to render.

- other troubleshoot idea: set the fan to manual so it's always on. Run test, any differences... actually this test only works if you can have a previous install to compare against (to see if this slows down the previous version).

- overclocking will require a larger power block

- note: depending on how things are internally implemented you do loose CPU compute power when processing with GPU as there is some thread management involved in controlling the gfx card. It's much more significative on a quad core then on a 12 cores say I noticed.

- I haven't tried recently (don't have dot 0.2 installed) but try to see if there is a difference setting the memory Preferences in Premiere to Favor Memory. This sometimes helped in the past to go faster.

Pierre



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Tom Daigon
Re: render very slow
on Sep 16, 2012 at 9:53:57 pm

HP

[Pierre Jasmin] "- overclocking will require a larger power block"

HP Z820 are based on the Sandy Bridge EP (Xeon) architecture and cannot be overclocked.

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
http://www.hdshotsandcuts.com




(Best viewed at 1080P and full screen)
HP Z820 Dual 2687
64GB ram
Dulce DQg2 16TB raid


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Pierre Jasmin
Re: render very slow
on Sep 16, 2012 at 10:05:25 pm

Not just to blame Microsoft, Nvidia, AMD, motherboard manufacturers, Adobe, Apple,... let's add Intel here.

This is sort of "adaptive" overclocking and will generate CPU variations.

http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/architecture-and-technology/turbo-bo...

There is some controls for that in Advanced Power Settings panel (and I think it can be turned off to see in the bios, however this should result in stable performance between runs but by slowing it down sometimes).



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Pierre Jasmin
Re: render very slow
on Sep 16, 2012 at 11:42:13 pm

The gist of my comment is graphic card drivers, os, processors, motherboard firmware,... and applications that do their best to load balance on top of that, and our computers ends up a bit like a microcosm of our power network - oh it's too hot, every body slows down, oh it's cold now everybody starts spinning away, oh now using too much power, oh... that is there is not really much work done at the level of coordination of power usage between components of a computer system aside perhaps battery life optimization on small portable devices with closed designs where the parts and standard workloads are known... the focus is all about power savings rather then power management let's say. It should really be directed by an operating system, I am not an expert but I don't think graphic cards driver for example pay much attention to ACPI in terms of thermal events... so it could be that HP firmware pays attention on the CPU side so only the CPU slows down even if the gfx card could for that particular workload run the same load with a lower bandwidth (i.e. run at a lower frequency)... which can end up harming the overall performance (i.e. even be faster with the gfx card off). An overkill PSU might help so it never gets above 80% load (so it stays cool and quiet, the firmware communication with ACPI does not see you are peaking usage close to PSU limit... although better ask an EE about that optimal value 80% is a value someone once told me :) ) or some people claim up to up to 20% performance gain with liquid cooling kits - never tried it, but could be an alternative is there is no room for a larger PSU?

Pierre



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Photos Cubano
Re: render very slow
on Oct 14, 2015 at 4:20:30 am

Hi may name is ray I was have the premier pro 2015 and it was very slow .
I follow you tips and it work .
but I don't Know how much so I don't burn may machine .
My Email is Cubanophoto@gmail.com
208 573 4928 cell .


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Dennis Radeke
Re: render very slow
on Sep 17, 2012 at 12:31:05 pm

[Felix Gorbach] "But when I import 10 bit dpx (720p, 25 fps) rendered files from resolve, the realtimeplayback even in 50% sized window just stucks."

One thing you might not be doing, though I'm not sure, is to playback your footage at a lower resolution. If you change your program playback from full to half, does that help improve your overall performance?

I ask because changing the window size to 50% isn't the same as setting the playback resolution to half (50%).

Dennis


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Felix Gorbach
Re: render very slow
on Sep 17, 2012 at 3:15:31 pm

Hy folks - thanks a lot for the tips!

I tried the regedit task - this made sence to me - but it didn´t help. In CPU Usage it´s about 3 to 5 % for my cores all together. No one is making it over this 5%.

I tried to change the power options - to hight performance - still no better result in CPU Usage.

I can understand that the manufacturers of different hardwareparts don`t care about the power consumption of an other device or that the cooling and heat issue nobody of the hardwareproviders cares about.

But I didn´t buy my machine at bestbuy for 400$. I spend in Europe 4750 € for this powerhorse. I bought this machine cause I wanted to eliminate issues like that. When I render in Cinema 4D for example, every CPU goes up to 100% for hours - no issue.

I don´t want to overclock my CPU´s, they are not slow. But Premiere uses them with only 3 to 5%. I`d be happy if premiere would use the CPU power like the other apps like Nuke or Cinema 4D - Full Power, fast - I like it. - but not with premiere - I´m a bit dissapointed.

Is it possible that my hdd is the bottleneck? I don´t had the money to invest in the SSDs.

Does anybody has experience with ssd and the performace with CS6?

By the way, Rendering to RAM Preview in AE - it´s the same - only about 5 to 10 % - and the render (make movie) it´s the same again.

I think I lostt the supersonic speed with CS6.

Sorry that I can´t tell other experiences so far. I can work, the programs don´t crash - that´s fine - and very important as well - but the rendering ist very dissapointing in comparison to other apps.


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Tom Daigon
Re: render very slow
on Sep 17, 2012 at 5:53:57 pm

The Adobe Mercury Playback Engine performs best when CPU, ram, GPU and Media IO (playback of hard drives) is maximized. My Dulce DQg2 has a 1100MB/sec. read and 1000MB/sec. write speed which works together with the other components to get the best performance from CS6.

The regedit fix basically got the Hyper Threading working correctly on my HP Z820, which is based around the Sandy Bridge EP Xeon architecture. What I was experiencing was the lack of the 16 HT working. That fix turned them back on all the time.

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
http://www.hdshotsandcuts.com




(Best viewed at 1080P and full screen)
HP Z820 Dual 2687
64GB ram
Dulce DQg2 16TB raid


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Felix Gorbach
Re: render very slow
on Sep 17, 2012 at 6:53:19 pm

Thanks Tom,

Will go through the regedit again to see if I did everything correct.

Thanks so much for your tipps and your time to answer.


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Tom Daigon
Re: render very slow
on Sep 17, 2012 at 6:57:33 pm

Certainly! Glad to help.

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
http://www.hdshotsandcuts.com




(Best viewed at 1080P and full screen)
HP Z820 Dual 2687
64GB ram
Dulce DQg2 16TB raid


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Walter Soyka
Re: render very slow
on Sep 18, 2012 at 2:14:23 am

Where is your DPX sequence located? Unless you have it on a high-performance RAID, this is almost certainly your bottleneck. A single disk cannot keep up with the data requirements for a DPX sequence, and if the computer can't get the frames fast enough, it will never play in real time or max out the CPU.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Jim Hoyle
Re: render very slow
on Oct 23, 2012 at 3:14:51 pm

Hi Felix,

Did you get the processors maxed out? Or even some performance gains? I am having a similar problem. On my previous 5 year old system, I don't think my CPU cores or GPU load were totally maxed out in Premiere Pro CS6. However, it was basically as fast if not faster for basic conversions as my new system is. In my new system the CPU usage is really low. Both when enabling or disabling CUDA in Premiere. When disabling CUDA in Premiere, the CPU usage goes 5% up and GPU load goes to 0%, but overall the speed is pretty much the same and very slow.

I have now
- Asus P9X79 motherboard
- Intel i7-3930K processor
- 64GB mem
- one SSD drive, rest fast hard drives
- PNY Quadro FX 3800 display card

Right now I'm doing a simple conversion from ProRes .mov to VP6 .flv. It takes forever. GPU load is 22% and average CPU cores usage is somewhere around 12%.


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Jim Hoyle
Re: render very slow
on Oct 23, 2012 at 4:26:45 pm

Additional information: I couldn't see any difference by tampering some CPU settings in BIOS. Also the hard drive is definitely not the bottle neck here. Windows 7 Resource Monitor tells me "Adobe QT32 Server.exe" reads only 4MB/sec when exporting, while my drives easily easily allow read/write at least 10 times faster than that.


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Walter Soyka
Re: render very slow
on Oct 23, 2012 at 7:33:14 pm

[Jim Hoyle] "Additional information: I couldn't see any difference by tampering some CPU settings in BIOS. Also the hard drive is definitely not the bottle neck here. Windows 7 Resource Monitor tells me "Adobe QT32 Server.exe" reads only 4MB/sec when exporting, while my drives easily easily allow read/write at least 10 times faster than that."

The hard drive may still be the bottleneck. Transfer speed is only one metric; IOPS (input/output operations per second) is another. Look at the disk tab of Resource Monitor during render. If the queue length graph is high, this means that there are many pending requests for I/O to the disk. In other words, the disk cannot fulfill discrete I/O requests fast enough (regardless of transfer speed) and they have formed a backlog that must be cleared before additional processing can occur. This can very easily occur with image sequences (loads of little files) versus movies (single big files).

Also, because Premiere Pro is 64-bit and the QuickTime libraries are 32-bit, Premiere cannot use QuickTime directly. To work around this, Adobe passes information from 64-bit Premiere to its 32-bit Quicktime helper process via the computer's network stack. This may introduce another bottleneck, which I'd think you'd be able to see in the Network tab. Renders to non-QT formats may be faster.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Jim Hoyle
Re: render very slow
on Oct 23, 2012 at 8:39:52 pm

The queue length is between 0.00 and 0.05. To me, that doesn't seem like the problem.

The export is extremely slow. I would estimate about 70% slower than my 5 year old system (where the biggest differences were motherboard and processor).


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Hidalgo Rabelais
Re: render very slow
on Feb 13, 2013 at 2:55:21 pm

Hi, just found this post having ecountered the same problem.

To me the bug seemed to be something with the footage and sequence settings.
It was a 4:3 project with a weirdo footage with something like 700x576, I was going to reframe it onto a 720 sequence.

After importing, as soon as I dragged the footage CS6 prompted me to choose between keeping the sequence setting or changing them in order to match the footage' ones.
If I kept my sequence settings the rendering time became insanely long, almost crazy and definitely unworkable with.

If I changed the sequence settings to match the footage's everything worked out smootly and without problems.
I know it seems crazy but that's what worked for me, hope it helps.


P.S.I am working with an outdated win7 notebook with a core2duo 2,53 Ghz and 4GB ram and all the footage onto a lacie1Tb with esata..so problems with rendering were expected but this seemed to be the matter with my setup.


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