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Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?

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Peter Antoinetti
Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 14, 2020 at 2:22:21 pm

Dear Friends

Would you Please Help Me to pick the best editing question - premiere pro cc 2018 and why?

I have 3 different types of clips FROM 4 different cameras to be used for a documentary:

- 4K clips(Lumix)
- 1080p clips (Sanyo) and 2 different mobile phones)
- 1440x1080 clips from an old camera)

Option 1:
set the premiere pro CC 2018
(cannot use any later version of premiere because of one of the codecs from one of the old camera clips not supported)

project settings: 4K Lumix clips
and add all the other 1080p and 1440x1080 clips with the same 4K settings
(set to frame size to 4K)
output: 1080 at present (May use 4K output later on when I have access to the faster pc)

option 2:
project settings: 1080p settings
and 1440x1080 clips - -set to frame size to (1080p)
add the 4K clips -set to frame size (1080p)
output: 1080p at present (May use 4K output later on when I have access to the faster pc)

Question 1: Do the output quality differ at all in option 1 and option 2?
Question 2: is option 1 or option 2 less power needy for a slow pc when rendering out?
Question 3: What other differences are there when picking option 1 or option 2?
Question 4: Which option would you choose and why?
Question 5 : pros and cons of each method or any better suggestions please?


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Peter Antoinetti
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 15, 2020 at 12:23:30 pm

No one to advice please?


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Jon Doughtie
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 16, 2020 at 5:20:13 pm

If it were me, I'd try setting up the sequence to what I need for my final deliverable. That is, if I need a 1080i 29.97 finished product, that's the sequence I'd create and work from there.

That's just me.

System:
Dell Precision T7600 (x2)
Win 7 64-bit
32GB RAM
Adobe CC 2017.1 (as of 8/2017)
256GB SSD system drive
4 internal media drives RAID 5
Typically cutting short form from UHD MP4, HD MP4, and HD P2 MXF.


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Santanu Bhattacharjee
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 20, 2020 at 6:37:02 am

it is always better to have your sequence to the largest dimension of the various footage you have. you can always deliver to a lower format without losing quality ever. The fps changing during delivery though may cause some problems of sync or frame jumps.

Santanu Productions, Mumbai
The Swiss Army Knife for All Your Creative Needs


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Peter Antoinetti
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 20, 2020 at 12:13:57 pm

"Santanu Bhattacharjee
on Apr 20, 2020
it is always better to have your sequence to the largest dimension of the various footage you have. you can always deliver to a lower format without losing quality ever. The fps changing during delivery though may cause some problems of sync or frame jumps."

Thank you Santanu,
I have decided to get the sequence to the largest dimension (4K) and will "set the frame size" of 1080p s onto 4K timeline and render out to 1080p initially. Then, without changing anything on the timeline, I'll render out the same sequence to 4K when I get to a faster pc later on

So I'll do what you advised I believe.

I appreciate your advice and advising the same as I just did which is a confirmation of my recent decision.
I am happy that yours match what I just did, hopefully

all the best


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Santanu Bhattacharjee
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 20, 2020 at 1:22:04 pm

Thanks. And all the best.

"Then, without changing anything on the timeline, I'll render out the same sequence to 4K when I get to a faster pc later on"

Rendering to a smaller dimension takes more PC power than to the same dimension of the sequence. Since the CPU has to do more number crunching in scaling down the footage and all other ingredients, anti-alias them accordingly, etc...

Therefore, you will observe that rendering to a 4K does in lesser time than lower formats.

Santanu Productions, Mumbai
The Swiss Army Knife for All Your Creative Needs


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Peter Antoinetti
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 20, 2020 at 1:47:01 pm

Santanu Bhattacharjee
on Apr 20, 2020
"Rendering to a smaller dimension takes more PC power than to the same dimension of the sequence. Since the CPU has to do more number crunching in scaling down the footage and all other ingredients, anti-alias them accordingly, etc..."
Therefore, you will observe that rendering to a 4K does in lesser time than lower formats."

-- Very important point, I did not know that. Thank you for that.
-- I NOW have another point to decide.

My current laptop, I thought cannot handle 4K output. It actually takes longer to render out to 4K in my 3-4 min rendered test YESTERDAY

I thought I could get 1080p at my laptop (windows i7 8gb ram asus) easier without heating up, then I could have a 4K output at a faster pc later on.

I was wondering why it is taking longer to render out to 4K and heating up to 89C and less time for 1080p output when tested a 3-4 min test output?

any further advice please?


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Santanu Bhattacharjee
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 20, 2020 at 3:39:07 pm

"I was wondering why it is taking longer to render out to 4K and heating up to 89C and less time for 1080p output when tested a 3-4 min test output?

any further advice please?"

There could be other factors such as -
1. footage on a network drive.
2. There are more unmatched dimension footage in the sequence that you have stretched than native 4k ones.
3. 4K resolution effects or color grading...

Santanu Productions, Mumbai
The Swiss Army Knife for All Your Creative Needs


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Peter Antoinetti
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 20, 2020 at 12:06:04 pm

" Jon Doughtie
on Apr 16, 2020
If it were me, I'd try setting up the sequence to what I need for my final deliverable. That is, if I need a 1080i 29.97 finished product, that's the sequence I'd create and work from there."

Thank you Jon,
Finished product will be 1080p as well as 4K
So I tested 4 min output on 1080p and 4K timeline setting rendering to 1080p
The result byte size was pretty similar
And I will have 4K timeline setting rendering to 1080p for the time-being and render out to a 4K output later on in a faster pc


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Santanu Bhattacharjee
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 20, 2020 at 1:13:20 pm

Through my experience, I generally don't go by setting sequence to delivery formats. Reasons -

1. These days clients often ask for social media formats. Once I made a piece with lowly resolution and when the client changed his mind to a higher version, I had a lot of rework.

2. If you have bigger dimension footage than your sequence, you gain nothing in terms of system performance, unless you work on proxies.

Santanu Productions, Mumbai
The Swiss Army Knife for All Your Creative Needs


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Peter Antoinetti
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 20, 2020 at 1:54:48 pm

"2. If you have bigger dimension footage than your sequence, you gain nothing in terms of system performance, unless you work on proxies."

one more thing:

I aim to send this documentary to several festivals. So most ask 1080p and some ask 4K
So I initially need 1080p, amd later on 4K versions


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Santanu Bhattacharjee
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 20, 2020 at 2:31:18 pm

It all depends on the duration of your sequence and how complex the timeline is. If I were to anyway render complex, busy timelines, I would rather render 4K hi-quality once. Later take the rendered 4K output and simply convert to lower resolutions in Adobe media encoder, never come back to premiere.

Santanu Productions, Mumbai
The Swiss Army Knife for All Your Creative Needs


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Peter Antoinetti
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 21, 2020 at 5:06:06 pm

Thank you indeed Santanu,
I'm just sorting out the clips and could not get back to you as my feedback earlier today.

Here's the latest:

"by Santanu Bhattacharjee
on Apr 20, 2020
It all depends on the duration of your sequence and how complex the timeline is. If I were to anyway render complex, busy timelines, I would rather render 4K hi-quality once. Later take the rendered 4K output and simply convert to lower resolutions in Adobe media encoder, never come back to premiere."

That's an excellent idea to get 4K then reduce it when needed later on.
I may have to sleep on it since I don't have access to the fast pc at present.

One question on Adobe media encoder:
Does that still need the source files intact to reduce it or simply reduce the size of earlier output without the source files?

---------------------------------

""by Santanu Bhattacharjee
I was wondering why it is taking longer to render out to 4K and heating up to 89C and less time for 1080p output when tested a 3-4 min test output?

any further advice please?"

There could be other factors such as -
1. footage on a network drive.
2. There are more unmatched dimension footage in the sequence that you have stretched than native 4k ones.
3. 4K resolution effects or color grading...

Let me further clarify that :
Let's say
- render out to 4K (heat up to 89C and takes longer to render out)
- with the same clips, render out to 1080p (heats up not as high as 89C and rendering takes not as long)

I thought I confuse you earlier as it was not as clear as now hopefully.

Does that change you advice please?

All the best


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Santanu Bhattacharjee
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 21, 2020 at 6:39:52 pm

[Peter Antoinetti] "One question on Adobe media encoder:
Does that still need the source files intact to reduce it or simply reduce the size of earlier output without the source files?"


Not at all. I don't mean you take the sequence back into AME. You should take the output file. It has to reduce only the output generated for the first time. However, you should be careful to generate a hi-quality, h- bit-rate using a good codec. (not h264). Because further encoding will deteriorate the quality further. But using a hi-quality output as input will not lose much on quality because any way you are reducing the dimensions, that will reduce recompression artifacts.



[Peter Antoinetti] "Let me further clarify that :
Let's say
- render out to 4K (heat up to 89C and takes longer to render out)
- with the same clips, render out to 1080p (heats up not as high as 89C and rendering takes not as long)

I thought I confuse you earlier as it was not as clear as now hopefully."


What are your PC specs, please?

Santanu Productions, Mumbai
The Swiss Army Knife for All Your Creative Needs


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Peter Antoinetti
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 21, 2020 at 8:39:23 pm

"h- bit-rate using a good codec. (not h264)"

- - what do you advice / what output settings I should have?


" PC specs?"

- - pretty poor nowadays I should say:
13 inch ASUS laptop
Windows 10 (1903) do not want to update it further
I had slowness after updating, so I changed it back to 1903)
i7 -6500U
2.50 Ghz 2.59 GHz
8 GB RAM
250GB SSD


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Santanu Bhattacharjee
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 22, 2020 at 8:01:28 am

[Peter Antoinetti] "- - what do you advice / what output settings I should have?"

This depends on where your final deliverables are going. Higher the bitrate, merrier it is. If it's for broadcast, use uncompressed. But that will consume a huge amount of disk space. But if it is a long-form video, you can go with ProRes or DNxHD.



[Peter Antoinetti] "13 inch ASUS laptop
Windows 10 (1903) do not want to update it further
I had slowness after updating, so I changed it back to 1903)
i7 -6500U
2.50 Ghz 2.59 GHz
8 GB RAM
250GB SSD"


These days I am working on a laptop with similar specs. cannot go to my studio that is hardly a kilometer from my home due to lockdown restrictions.

But then I guess, I am able to render 4K footage (Sony M2T format) easily with similar specs. All I did was kept footage drive separate from OS and Cache. I installed a driver booster software that updates all hardware drivers. Use a common free PC clean up software like Ccleaner that is the light on the system and clears all unnecessary temp files in all nooks and corners of the system. This also clears up the registry. I also have minimum apps on my PC. Removed most startup apps.

Santanu Productions, Mumbai
The Swiss Army Knife for All Your Creative Needs


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Tero Ahlfors
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 22, 2020 at 9:41:50 am

[Santanu Bhattacharjee] " If it's for broadcast, use uncompressed."

No. If it's for any kind of delivery to some other company you'll need to ask for their delivery specs.


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Peter Antoinetti
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 22, 2020 at 10:18:05 am

by Santanu Bhattacharjee
on Apr 22, 2020
"output settings I should have?"

you can go with ProRes or DNxHD

It's for different documentary festivals with different requirements.
In general could be categorized into 3 rough requirements :

- preview copy: 1080p 6-7 mbps
- festival show copy: 1080p 1080p 10-25 mbps or
- 4K with higher mbps

would ProRes or DNxHD ok, and or any other spesific variations of ProRes or DNxHD?

"SPECS"
similar lockdown restrictions worldwide

" I am able to render 4K footage (Sony M2T format) easily with similar specs."

Would that be advisable for me too?

"Use a common free PC clean up software like Ccleaner This also clears up the registry.
have minimum apps on my PC.
Removed most startup apps"

same here, I use ccleaner as well as I recommend Ace Utilities and PrivaZer
I also removed most startup apps, including virus scanners and security soft-wares -after disconnecting off the net during editing or rendering


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Peter Antoinetti
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 23, 2020 at 8:34:27 am

Thank you again Santanu,

documentary festivals requirements for me to submit in general could be categorized into 3 roughly :
1- preview copy for pre-selection judging committee: 1080p 4-7 mbps
2a - festival show copy: 1080p 1080p 10-25 mbps or
2b - festival show copy for few fests: 4K with higher mbps


Considering the requirements for me for the festivals above
-What specific output settings I should have?
- If ProRes, DNxHD and 4K footage (Sony M2T format) ok, what specific variations of ProRes, DNxHD, (Sony M2T format) ?

all the best

antoinetti@gmail.com

antoinetti@gmail.com


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Santanu Bhattacharjee
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 23, 2020 at 1:48:55 pm

[Peter Antoinetti] "Considering the requirements for me for the festivals above
-What specific output settings I should have?
- If ProRes, DNxHD and 4K footage (Sony M2T format) ok, what specific variations of ProRes, DNxHD, (Sony M2T format) ?
"


Basically, you need a format that is re-editable.

Santanu Productions, Mumbai
The Swiss Army Knife for All Your Creative Needs


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Peter Antoinetti
Re: Premiere Pro CC 2018 rendering options please?
on Apr 23, 2020 at 1:57:24 pm

I appreciate your help very much.
all the best

antoinetti@gmail.com


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