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Super Slow Motion with 30fps

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Faraz Mozafarian
Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 1, 2011 at 8:18:11 pm

Hi,

I have seen some videos recently where people have somehow created very crisp looking slow motion shots with 30fps footage. I mean it almost looks like they used a high speed camera. How do you achieve this without getting all the frame blending you normally would get?

is there a special filter or something?


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 1, 2011 at 8:41:06 pm

I really doubt that the footage was shot at 29.97. There simply is not enough information from frame to frame to create crisp-looking super slo-mo.

I would certainly believe that it was 29.97 footage, however. It would have been CONFORMED from a much higher frame rate to 29.97.

It's possible to get passable slo-mo from 30p. But SUPER slo-mo? Not a chance.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Faraz Mozafarian
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 1, 2011 at 9:00:32 pm

I have the raw footage that was used in the commercial. It is 29.97. I mean the footage is obviously not as crisp and clean as a high speed camera but still is way better than what you would get by just simply using Final Cut or AE's built in speed tools to slow it down.

Are you sure there is no filter or cheat that was used? I wish I had the actual commercial handy to post but I do not at the moment and I do not have the editors contact info to ask him.


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Brian Charles
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 1, 2011 at 9:35:23 pm

http://www.revisionfx.com/products/twixtor/

Might do it. Still nothing beats a high-speed camera.



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Dave LaRonde
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 1, 2011 at 9:55:22 pm

[Faraz Mozafarian] "I have the raw footage that was used in the commercial. It is 29.97."

I don't doubt you for a second; if you're making a spot at 29.97, you use 29.97 footage. But was that footage originally shot at a higher frame rate, and then conformed to 29.97? Knowing the provenance of such footage is the key.



[Faraz Mozafarian] "... way better than what you would get by just simply using Final Cut or AE's built in speed tools to slow it down. Are you sure there is no filter or cheat that was used? I"

There is frame rate conversion softrware. In AE, two popular ones are ReelVision's Twixtor and Magic Bullet. They work pretty well if you want to slow things down by a third, perhaps. They work by using motion analysis algorithms. There are various kinds of motion: the subject move, the camera moves, both subject and camera move, etc. In the plugin, you choose the situation that most closely matches your footage. Sometimes they do a good job, sometimes they don't... and they're expensive, to boot.

The best way to get smooth, crisp-looking slow motion remains shooting at a high frame rate and slowing the footage down.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Faraz Mozafarian
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 1, 2011 at 10:04:30 pm

No the footage was shot at 30fps. Using an old Sony HVX2000. I'm pretty sure those cameras are not even capable of shooting higher that that.

That's why I am so puzzled as to how the editor got the footage to look so crisp.

I found the edited commercial. I will post a preview of what I am talking about so you can see how slow he got it to look.


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 1, 2011 at 10:47:25 pm

[Faraz Mozafarian] "...the footage was shot at 30fps. Using an old Sony HVX2000."

You might be mistaken; I just googled that camera's maker & model number, and there's no such camera. However, Panasonic makes the HVX 200, and it's not all that old. It can shoot at 720p, and at 59.94 frames/sec. If you conform it to 29.97, you're at half-speed.

Using frame rate conversion software to slow it down to one-fourth or one-fifth speed, which may not be advisable but is not unheard-of, and suddenly you're ten times slower than normal.

But you still begin shooting at a frame rate twice that of normal.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Faraz Mozafarian
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 1, 2011 at 11:00:57 pm

I'm sorry my mistake. It is the Sony VX2000.


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Faraz Mozafarian
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 2, 2011 at 1:58:38 am

Here are the specs for this specific clip. I also have seen this done with footage shot at 30fps.

1920x1080
CODEC: HDV1080i60
FPS:29.97

How did they do this? It looks almost warped in some areas. It's hard to tell in this flash version but there is little to know frame blending at all. Looks like it was shot with a high speed camera.

Slow MO



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Dave LaRonde
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 2, 2011 at 2:07:25 am

That's gotta be a high-speed camera. The Sony camera you directed me to is a DV camera, and there is NO way the video from it would look that nice, especially when slowed down that much. I fear somebody's pulling your leg.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Faraz Mozafarian
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 2, 2011 at 2:13:35 am

No body is pulling my leg. I have the raw clips here on my hard drive which I personally gave the editor. I am 1000000 percent sure it was not shot with a high speed camera. 60fps at the VERY most. I know the person who shot these clips personally. He could never afford a high speed camera. haha.

It looks like it is some very clever work in After Effects. Maybe some rotoscoping, mixed with a warp/distort. I just would like to know how it was achieved.

But please believe me when I say that this was NOT shot with a high speed camera.


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Aleksandar Zahorodni
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Apr 8, 2011 at 7:53:19 pm

"I have the raw clips here on my hard drive which I personally gave the editor"
Why don't you just ask editor?
;)


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Walter Soyka
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 2, 2011 at 2:48:06 am

[Faraz Mozafarian] "How did they do this? It looks almost warped in some areas. It's hard to tell in this flash version but there is little to know frame blending at all. Looks like it was shot with a high speed camera."

This effect could actually be done with some clever use of stills. See the tutorial 3D from 2D Image using Displacement Maps [link] by this forum's own Tudor "Ted" Jelescu.

Warping (I call it "blobbing") is a typical artifact of motion compensation. Twixtor can produce some great slo-mo effects, especially with the Pro version and its advanced features like foreground separation and track point or spline guidance.

As Dave was saying, though, shooting 720p59.94 (which nearly any 720p camera can do) and reconforming the footage to 720p29.97 gives you an instant and perfect 50% slo-mo. It's great to use as-is, or as a starting point for further slowdown.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Jeremy Allen
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 2, 2011 at 5:24:24 pm

Funny, that tutorial is pretty much exactly what we're looking at here :)

But I think we're gonna need to see more of that footage to make a proper analysis ;)

---------------------------------------------
8core MacPro, 3.0 GHZ, 10GB RAM, OSX 10.5.8

C4D 11.5
AE CS5
FCP 7.0.3


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 2, 2011 at 5:30:51 pm

[Jeremy Allen] "...I think we're gonna need to see more of that footage to make a proper analysis..."

Perhaps not; the OP claims the footage was shot on a DV camera, one they stopped making in 2004. Have you EVER seen 4x3 DV footage that's been scaled up to 1920x1080 look any good? And then run through a frame rate conversion process? And look that good?

I, for one, don't think I need to see any more footage.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Jon Bagge
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Mar 6, 2011 at 4:01:24 am

I'm willing to bet money on that video being made from a still image using the techniques mentioned. You can see the footage is 'warping' rather than actually moving naturally.

--------------
http://www.jonbagge.net
Jon Bagge - Editor - London, UK
Avid - FCP - After Effects


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Rob Robertson
Re: Super Slow Motion with 30fps
on Nov 28, 2014 at 5:06:37 pm

Probably done with this:
http://www.videomaker.com/courses/17282-faking-slow-motion-timewarp-twixtor...


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