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Preserving 60i look in 24p

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Joey Foreman
Preserving 60i look in 24p
on Dec 8, 2010 at 6:30:16 pm

My client's video was shot entirely in 24p except for one shot which was 60i, because he wants this shot to have the "video look". Does anyone know of a way to pull this off? The final edit is being done in Final Cut, in a 24p sequence. Of course just dropping the 60i shot into the sequence gives a herky-jerky look because of the dropped frames. I've tried using a nested comp with Preserve Frame Rate, as well as the Posterize Time effect, but still get the jerky look.
Is this even possible?


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Kevin Camp
Re: Preserving 60i look in 24p
on Dec 8, 2010 at 6:45:43 pm

if the destination is broadcast, then the 24p will need to get to 60i at some point. so you could add the pulldown to the 24p portion now, import it back in and then edit in the 60i (working, of course, now in a 60i timeline).

Kevin Camp
Senior Designer
KCPQ, KMYQ & KRCW


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Joey Foreman
Re: Preserving 60i look in 24p
on Dec 8, 2010 at 6:58:02 pm

Thanks, Kevin. For now the destination is dvd, with broadcast potential down the road.
Will Apple Compressor play nicely with the pulldown added file in converting to mpeg?


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Kevin Camp
Re: Preserving 60i look in 24p
on Dec 8, 2010 at 7:23:50 pm

it should, you just won't be creating a progressive dvd. i'm not sure that compressor cares if the material is progressive or not (i mean, it will compress interlaced and progressive, you just want it to maintain the frame rate and interlacing).

the dvd authoring software will care and should have a setting for progressive that you won't want checked.

Kevin Camp
Senior Designer
KCPQ, KMYQ & KRCW


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Preserving 60i look in 24p
on Dec 8, 2010 at 7:22:55 pm

[Joey Foreman] "y client's video was shot entirely in 24p except for one shot which was 60i, because he wants this shot to have the "video look". Does anyone know of a way to pull this off?"

Sorry, there is no way to do it. You'll have to engage in a little "client education". He's equating the "video look" to smooth motion.

Think about smooth motion as slices of time. If you shoot 60i, you have 60 slices of time, they're small divisions of time.

However, 24p is only 24 slices of time, 2 1/2 times FEWER than 60i. To fit in the same 1-second duration, they have to be 2 1/2 times longer than those 60i slices.

Thus, there isn't any way to retain the smooth motion he wants in a frame rate that does NOT support smooth motion.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Kevin Camp
Re: Preserving 60i look in 24p
on Dec 8, 2010 at 7:27:58 pm

i think he will be able to mix them if he adds the pulldown to the 24p first, but you're right... the 24p will then get somewhat jerky due to the stutter frames.

but it seems that everyone equates stutter frame movement to 'film-like' in video ;-)

Kevin Camp
Senior Designer
KCPQ, KMYQ & KRCW


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Joey Foreman
Re: Preserving 60i look in 24p
on Dec 8, 2010 at 7:31:05 pm

Confused. Film has pulldown added all the time for broadcast, and it doesn't look "stuttery".


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Preserving 60i look in 24p
on Dec 8, 2010 at 7:36:49 pm

Don't be confused. I goofed. Kevin's right.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Joey Foreman
Re: Preserving 60i look in 24p
on Dec 8, 2010 at 7:38:32 pm

Thanks so much, guys. I'll go that route.


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Preserving 60i look in 24p
on Dec 8, 2010 at 7:36:25 pm

Actually, Kevin, I wrote that post above in too much haste. You were wise to ask about delivery, I wasn't.

I think we both agree on the following:
  • For the 24p footage, edit in a 23.976 edit timeline, and export the result.
  • Add 3:2 pulldown to the result, creating an interlaced 29.97 file, aka 60i.
  • Create a 60i edit timeline, add the interlaced 29.97 footage to it, PLUS the footage originally shot at 60i.
  • Go to either DVD or broadcast.

Now, that's more like it, eh?

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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