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Roto Brush Freeze

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Kris McCormicRoto Brush Freeze
by on Nov 30, 2010 at 2:23:47 am

Hey Everyone,

I'm finding that the new Roto Brush tool is quite awesome! However, I seem to have a problem finishing it up with the very last step. I've used the tool to get a nice roto that separates the foreground and background. Now as the last step, I hit the Freeze button. It does its thing but then shows both the foreground and background in the final comp as if no roto had taken place. If I unclick the freeze button, it cuts the background out like it should showing only the wanted foreground part and cutting out the unwanted background part in the final comp.

So, what am I doing wrong? Shouldn't hitting the freeze button just lock the roto? Did I miss a checkbox that says "actually cut the roto" or something? What is the correct last step?

Maybe the cached results are corrupt. Does anyone know where the cached rendered roto brush results are kept on disk? (My Google-foo seems to be weak today.) I could flush them directly there and then hopefully it would rebuild it correctly.

Thanks in advance for your help!

Phade.


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Chris WrightRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Nov 30, 2010 at 3:40:23 am

unfreezing roto was an ae update

http://technicolorsoftware.hostzi.com/


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Kris McCormicRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Nov 30, 2010 at 1:55:41 pm

Hey Chris,

Thanks for the reply!

My AE is fully up to date with all patches. My problem isn't really with unfreezing but with the actual freezing. On freeze, the effect does not show up; on unfreeze or before freeze, the effect shows up.

Any other suggestions? Thanks again!! ^_^

Phade.


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Walter SoykaRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Nov 30, 2010 at 3:20:03 pm

[Kris McCormic] "Now as the last step, I hit the Freeze button. It does its thing but then shows both the foreground and background in the final comp as if no roto had taken place. If I unclick the freeze button, it cuts the background out like it should showing only the wanted foreground part and cutting out the unwanted background part in the final comp."

Are you sure you're looking at the comp in the viewer, or are you still looking at the rotobrush layer?

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Kris McCormicRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Nov 30, 2010 at 3:25:51 pm

Hey Walter,

Thanks for the reply!

I am looking at both. I first noticed it when I hit freeze and then went back to my final comp. I had been checking it all along to see how it looked in both the roto view and final comp. After hitting freeze, the roto appeared to go away. Unclicking freeze made the roto come back in both the roto view and final comp view.

Do you know of a way to force rebuild the roto without recreating the roto from scratch?

Thanks again for your help!! ^_^

Phade.


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Walter SoykaRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Nov 30, 2010 at 4:50:02 pm

[Kris McCormic] "I am looking at both. I first noticed it when I hit freeze and then went back to my final comp. I had been checking it all along to see how it looked in both the roto view and final comp. After hitting freeze, the roto appeared to go away. Unclicking freeze made the roto come back in both the roto view and final comp view."

In the layer viewer -- do you the view set to "RotoBrush" and "Render" checked? Have you toggled the Alpha Boundary?

In the comp -- does the layer with RotoBrush applied have effects turned on? Is the RotoBrush effect itself also on? Do you have any other instances of that footage without the RotoBrush effect applied elsewhere in the comp?

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Kris McCormicRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Nov 30, 2010 at 5:43:34 pm

View set to: Roto Brush
Render checkbox: checked
Effect Controls: Roto Brush "on"
Comp Effects: "on"
Alpha Boundary: "on" or "off" no effect

There is another instance of the footage with roto brush applied. The footage is a single shot of actor crossing in front of a doorway (roto 1) and then seconds later entering the doorway (roto 2). Both 1 and 2 are separate sub-comps of a main comp (actor passes in front of object (another layer sub-comp) at doorway and then again). Could having roto applied in two places on the same footage in different sub-comps be the problem? If so, how do I fix that? (Import footage twice or something?)

The super weird kicker to me is that if freeze is off, the roto works great in the final comp (just chugs really slowly). Once freeze is on, there is no spoon, I mean, no roto.

Thanks again for the suggestions!! ^_^

Phade.


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Walter SoykaRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Nov 30, 2010 at 5:48:40 pm

[Kris McCormic] "There is another instance of the footage with roto brush applied. The footage is a single shot of actor crossing in front of a doorway (roto 1) and then seconds later entering the doorway (roto 2). Both 1 and 2 are separate sub-comps of a main comp (actor passes in front of object (another layer sub-comp) at doorway and then again). Could having roto applied in two places on the same footage in different sub-comps be the problem? If so, how do I fix that? (Import footage twice or something?)"

Do those two pieces of footage overlap in your timeline? Are you cutting roto on the top layer, but then seeing the background from a layer below? What if you solo one of the layers at a time?

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Kevin ReinerRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Dec 8, 2010 at 2:10:19 pm

I am having this same problem. I have read all the documentation on rotobrush and was able to do 3 clips with no problem (awesome tool by the way). However, on my forth clip, when I hit the freeze button, the matte path disappears and the background is no longer keyed out. And as Kris experienced, it reappeared when I unfroze. I am positive that I am using the effect correctly, something is wrong.

I tried trashing prefs and restarting the computer, but no luck. I am going to open a fresh project with only that clip and see if I get any good results.

Kris, did you ever get this resolved?

-Kevin

Mac Pro 2 x 3 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon
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Dual-channel 4Gb Fibre Channel PCI Express card
Dell Display (23" flat panel)
ATI Radeon HD 5770
AJA Kona LSi SD/HD capture card
Rourke 16 TB
Flanders 2460

SOFTWARE
Mac OS X 10.6.5
FCP 7
After Effects CS5
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All Trapcode Plugs
Zaxwerks Invig


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Kris McCormicRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Dec 8, 2010 at 8:47:21 pm

Hey,

I hate to say it, but I'm glad I'm not the only one with the problem. :-)

I ended up giving up and trying again with the same footage in a new comp and it worked the second time. My guess is that the cached render of the mask became corrupt in such a way that it would not use or recreate it when toggling the freeze button. Redoing the roto from scratch "fixed" it. Sounds like it's a "under certain rare conditions..." bug to me. Hopefully it will be recognized and fixed.

Sorry for the less-than-optimal answer. :-(

Kris.


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Walter SoykaRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Dec 8, 2010 at 9:15:54 pm

[Kris McCormic] "Sounds like it's a "under certain rare conditions..." bug to me. Hopefully it will be recognized and fixed."

I'd encourage you both to fill out bug reports to make sure that Adobe is aware of the issue:

https://www.adobe.com/cfusion/mmform/index.cfm?name=wishform

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Bart PopenoeRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Jan 5, 2011 at 10:04:26 am

I've used the rotobrush tool many times, (it's great!) but just encountered the same problem with the matte disappearing after applying the "freeze" button. I'd spent about four hours on my roto so I figured I'd try a couple of things before throwing the effect out and starting over.

I found that if I copied and pasted my footage (with the effect) into a new comp the problem resolved. Whew! I'm glad that worked!


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Kris McCormicRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Jan 5, 2011 at 1:08:42 pm

Hey Bart,

Excellent tip! I will be sure to try it if/when it happens again.

Kris.


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spencer snyggRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Jul 2, 2011 at 9:12:45 pm

I have the same problem, but when I try copying the layer into another composition, it still does the same thing. Anyone have any more clues/workarounds?


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spencer snyggRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Jul 2, 2011 at 10:56:43 pm

I just discovered a workaround..... In the timeline, you grab the ears of the video to shorten it down so it is not being shown where you have the roto. It is important that you shorten it from the tail not the head. If you have any video showing after the start of the roto, it won't do it properly.

Weird, I know. But.... C'est la vie.


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Or PazRe: Roto Brush Freeze
by on Oct 23, 2013 at 12:15:33 pm

Thank you for that workaround!
I'm having the same issue and it does help to "fix" it.



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