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Twixtor with 5D footage

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Joe Orange
Twixtor with 5D footage
on Sep 28, 2010 at 8:31:19 am

I ahve some 5d footage shot at 25fps which I want to slowmo and apparently Twixtor is a good way to go. Only I don't want any dropped or duplicated frames or any interlacing. Is this possible?

thanks


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Walter Soyka
Re: Twixtor with 5D footage
on Sep 28, 2010 at 1:09:38 pm

This is exactly what Twixtor is for. It'll calculate new intermediate frames for your slow motion shot, rather than simply duplicating the existing ones. RE:Vision Effects makes a demo available so you can try it out before you buy it.

After Effects uses optical flow (the same technique used in Twixtor) in the Timewarp effect.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Joe Orange
Re: Twixtor with 5D footage
on Sep 28, 2010 at 1:20:37 pm

Thanks for the helpful reply Walter.
If AE uses the same technique as Twixtor, where does Twixtor come into it's own?


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Michael Szalapski
Re: Twixtor with 5D footage
on Sep 28, 2010 at 1:41:21 pm

Twixtor does it better and gives you control over it. Most shots with faked slo-mo need to be controlled and AE doesn't allow that. Try the demo of Twixtor.

- The Great Szalam
(The 'Great' stands for 'Not So Great, in fact, Extremely Humble')

No trees were harmed in the creation of this message, but several thousand electrons were mildly inconvenienced.


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Twixtor with 5D footage
on Sep 28, 2010 at 2:53:03 pm

To add to these two knowledgeable gents' comments, keep this in mind:

There is no frame rate conversion software that can work miracles. It depends on how much you want to slow the image down. You may have no other recourse than to shoot at a high frame rate so you can play back at a normal frame rate.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Walter Soyka
Re: Twixtor with 5D footage
on Sep 28, 2010 at 3:07:08 pm

[Dave LaRonde] "There is no frame rate conversion software that can work miracles. It depends on how much you want to slow the image down. You may have no other recourse than to shoot at a high frame rate so you can play back at a normal frame rate."

I absolutely agree. I'd rather shoot 720p59.94, re-interpret at 23.976 fps (40% of the original speed) and upres to 1080p23.976 than shoot 1080p23.976 and interpolate frames to get the slow-mo. Optical flow can get blobby-looking very easily.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Twixtor with 5D footage
on Sep 28, 2010 at 3:28:22 pm

Oh, and here's another thing I forgot to mention earlier: that camera of yours records images in H.264. You should consider that to be an acquisition codec ONLY. You should change it to a different codec as you capture or transfer it.

Not only does H.264 throw certain video production applications into catatonia, it cannot withstand repeated rendering and rerendering. In such cases, the quality of your image will drop like a rock.

Maintain an H.264 workflow at your peril, especially if you intend to use Twixtor. I forget if you're using AE 10 or not, but if you aren't, it's absolutely imperative to convert H.264 footage.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Joe Orange
Re: Twixtor with 5D footage
on Sep 28, 2010 at 5:00:25 pm

Thanks guys.
What I'm trying to do is get the same slowmo effect I got from previously converting 5d footage shot at 30fps to 25fps via CinemaTools.
Post 5D firmware update my now 25fps footage def needs slowmo-ing.
Dave, it seems I have to convert these H.264 files into ProRes to get them to convet smoothly in AE?
and Walter my footage was shot at 1080, what can I do to avoid or minimize any quality issues that I'll come across?


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Twixtor with 5D footage
on Sep 28, 2010 at 6:28:34 pm

[Joe Orange] "Dave, it seems I have to convert these H.264 files into ProRes to get them to convet smoothly in AE?"

That's one reason. The best reason is that if you do NOT convert, your image quality runs the risk of going into the toilet.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Joe Murphy
Re: Twixtor with 5D footage
on Sep 28, 2010 at 9:09:56 pm

I have used twixtor trial on many occasions. Twixtor is a really powerful plug-in that can easily slow 60fps footage to as little a 3%. Reading a lot in numerous forums its almost as If people give up on twixtor stating, not to expect miracles etc.

My frustration with twixtor is the fact that there is no clear guide showing you how to neaten gloop / warp areas by applying the inverted matte masks, alternate source and vectors

59.94fps footage can be slowed down to almost perfect quality if the background is clean. My question / challenge to a member of the revisionsfx team is to demonstrate how to set up twixtor to dismiss a 'MESSY' background whilst slowing down the motion of an image in the foreground.

It is possible, you only have to look at a video on Vimeo called Canon 7d 1000fps, presenting images of a BMX at 15% or lower. Can someone please clearly/ simply demonstrate how to correct gloop areas as the manual states. The cost of twixtor at £350 is a steal, when you consider the cost of the equipment needed to record in super slow motion.

I can get near perfect slow motion between 3 and 15% % using a SAMSUNG R10 recording at 720p 50fps. With a better DSLR and a few neatening techniques I could demonstrate motion using twixtor that would sell this product over and over again.

There are simple tutorials with almost every plug-in apart from Twixtor why???


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Pierre Jasmin
Re: Twixtor with 5D footage
on Oct 15, 2010 at 11:41:25 am

Joe, we do have some video tutorials here on the cow and as well at help.revisionfx.com

For manual fix-up in Twixtor PRO what we have right now is some "sample projects" and hard to read documentation :).

Pierre
RE:Vision Effects



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