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YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile

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Tarquin Douglas
YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 6, 2010 at 1:27:15 pm

Hi,

I have a 10 bit uncompressed AVI captured in on Premiere Black Magic at 23.98, 1920x1080

I need to trasncode this to a YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile with a .yuv extension.

I know Carbon Coder can do this but does anyone know if After Effects can handle this?

Cheers,

T


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Walter Soyka
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 6, 2010 at 2:30:19 pm

[Tarquin Douglas] "I have a 10 bit uncompressed AVI captured in on Premiere Black Magic at 23.98, 1920x1080. I need to trasncode this to a YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile with a .yuv extension. I know Carbon Coder can do this but does anyone know if After Effects can handle this?"

.YUV is neither on the list of supported input formats nor supported output formats.

After Effects could work with the uncompressed AVI if you install the Black Magic codec.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Tarquin Douglas
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 6, 2010 at 2:38:15 pm

Hi,

Do you know of any apps that could do this conversion?

Cheers,

T


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Dave LaRonde
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 6, 2010 at 3:01:02 pm

[Tarquin Douglas] "I need to transcode this to a YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile with a .yuv extension. "

Are you absolutely, positively sure about this? I could find NOTHING concering a .yuv extension, which in this case would be some sort of media container like .mov and .avi.

YUV is a color space used by almost every TV camera made. 420 can also be 4-2-0 Color Resolution, used DV in PAL countries. Furthermore, a definitive list of codecs yields no mention of "YUV420":
http://www.fourcc.org/

I recommend double-checking your required file specs and more importantly, the individual who specified this. That individual could also have gotten it wrong, and you're searching for something that doesn't exist.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Walter Soyka
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 6, 2010 at 3:05:30 pm

[Dave LaRonde] "Are you absolutely, positively sure about this? I could find NOTHING concering a .yuv extension, which in this case would be some sort of media container like .mov and .avi. "

.YUV is the opposite of a container -- it's just the raw data. No time code, no color space, no information about frame rate or raster size -- just a raw dump of the data.

It can be planar (all the Y for a single frame, then all the U, then all the V) or packed (YUV for each pixel).

To the original poster, I think FFmpeg can output planar YUV. I'm not sure if it includes a header or not, but it might be worth checking out.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Dave LaRonde
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 6, 2010 at 3:16:35 pm

Thanks, Walter, I learned something new today. I wonder what sort of application would use and more importantly, be able to reconstruct the data from such a file?

After I wrote this above, I did an additional search, and this cropped up:
http://www.downv.com/Windows-software-download/YUV-file-analysis
There could be something helpful in there. But I'm a Mac guy, so what do I know?

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Walter Soyka
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 6, 2010 at 3:38:10 pm

[Dave LaRonde] "I wonder what sort of application would use and more importantly, be able to reconstruct the data from such a file? "

The only real use for raw YUV that I can think of is as an intermediate format between special-purpose, naive, or homebrew tools.

It's trivially easy to read or write raw YUV data, but think of the disadvantages of not including the metadata with the data itself -- if you don't also know the frame size and frame rate, there's no way to determine it from the data itself! This is all exactly why we started using container-based formats in the first place. But hey -- at least it's intraframe!

Tarquin, I think we'd both love to hear more about your requirements for our own edification and future reference.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Dave LaRonde
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 6, 2010 at 6:45:21 pm

[Walter Soyka] "Tarquin, I think we'd both love to hear more about your requirements for our own edification and future reference.
"


Amen to that!

I'd be particularly interested to learn how the data in the file is intended to be used, and the type of application that uses it. It's it's fairly well know, it could crop up again, and it's good to know about such things.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Tarquin Douglas
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 7, 2010 at 11:26:39 am

Hi Guys,

Thanks for your feedback. I am doing some in house tests and will post to you both when I have a successful workflow set up...

Kind Regards,

T


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Tim Kolb
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 7, 2010 at 11:19:42 pm

I'm not familiar with a "YUV420-RAW" file.

Of course, it would be less confusing if the industry stopped using the term "YUV" anyway... it represents a bit of scaling math inside the analog SD NTSC protocol (it's not even in PAL SD). The worst part is that the term is applied generically to any color structure that isn't RGB these days.

These days we have Y'PbPr or in Betacam terms, Y'R-Y, B-Y in analog land and Y'CbCr in digital. Since "YUV" does not exist in any digital form as such, it becomes just strange to see it matched with color subsample designations like "4:2:2" or "4:2:0".

...but it persists as I've also seen YUV422 out there, which I think is sometimes called "uyuv"...

It's like try to sell Apple Juice by the "peck".









TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,


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Walter Soyka
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 8, 2010 at 12:04:20 pm

Well, technically, isn't analog NTSC Y'IQ?

Like you've said, YUV is almost always misused with respect to its actual technical definition, and I think you're absolutely right that it's basically coming to mean "non-RGB" -- it's becoming an industry shorthand for color encoding with one luminance and two chrominance components, regardless of gamma, scaling, or color difference axes. Misused technical terms are a pet peeve of mine because they have such precise meanings, but I'm trying to let it go...

To bring this back on topic, here's a link with some information on Y'UV420 planar image encoding:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YUV#Y.27UV420p_.28and_Y.27V12.29

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Tim Kolb
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 8, 2010 at 6:58:53 pm

I always thought that Y'IQ was a specific bit of voodoo where the 33 degree off-axis calculation along the Quadrature and Inphase axes (after inverting them) reduced bandwidth by formatting the color difference "grid" more along the lines of human visual acuity...but it was during transmission only.

To check myself, I did find a bit on Wikipedia that says that NTSC is Y'IQ, but it also says that PAL is YUV...

Y'IQ was around in the 50s and 60s...I'm not sure how things progressed. I never saw an exposed signal line up axis-inverted and 33 degrees out of phase along the Inphase and Quadrature axes on a vectorscope myself. I assume that the receiving end would have to "undo it" though...

The more I look at this stuff, the more I like serial digital...yeesh.




TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,


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Dave LaRonde
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 8, 2010 at 10:09:19 pm

[Tim Kolb] "I'm not familiar with a "YUV420-RAW" file. "

Well, the original poster did say he'd write back, so stay tuned. And reading your posts in this thread remind me in no uncertain terms that I'm no video engineer.

Not that I ever thought I was one, mind you.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Dave LaRonde
Re: YUV420-RAW Data file. NoHeaderFile
on Jul 8, 2010 at 10:24:19 pm

[Tim Kolb] "I'm not familiar with a "YUV420-RAW" file. "

Well, the original poster did say he'd write back, so stay tuned. And reading your posts in this thread remind me in no uncertain terms that I'm no video engineer.

Not that I ever thought I was one, mind you.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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