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Elusive shadows

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John Nelson
Elusive shadows
on May 6, 2020 at 7:53:03 pm

Using a 'vintage' CS4 with a 2014 Mac mini/Yosemite.

I attached a light to the graphic and made sure it cast shadows. Made sure the graphic accepted shadows also. Made sure the background was slightly behind the graphic.

The first time I made adjustments the shadows worked normally. Later, I couldn't get it to work. Everything functions except the shadow. Not sure what I may have done to make it go away.

Thanks for your input.


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Eric Santiago
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 6, 2020 at 8:22:42 pm

display card issues?


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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 6, 2020 at 9:31:58 pm

Using a Samsung smart tv. Can't understand if it worked once why it won't work again...

KEEP ON KEEPIN ON!


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Walter Soyka
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 11:07:40 am

Maybe you've accidentally set the viewer in a draft mode?

A screenshot of your complete UI might help us diagnose your problem.

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 1:29:21 pm
Last Edited By John Nelson on May 7, 2020 at 1:46:47 pm

Here's a screenshot.

Thanks.



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Richard Garabedain
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 5:14:58 pm

well first of all there is a preferences window blocking the screen..and #2...i can see you are trying to use layer drop shadows, which is not what you want. you want a light that cast shadows. usually you do not need anything else


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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 5:59:29 pm

Here's the screenshot without the preference window.

As to the layers drop shadow, I was forced to use that in lieu of not having a light shadow.


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Richard Garabedain
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 7:56:20 pm

are you sure the light is in the right place. it looks pretty small in the distance..hitting (AA) will bring up all the light options for a layer. cast shadows is turned off by default..and make sure the lights falloff is none


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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 8:16:19 pm
Last Edited By John Nelson on May 7, 2020 at 8:19:17 pm

Here is another screenshot depicting more parameters: (I removed the drop shadow)



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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 8:28:42 pm

Just did a custom view and the logo is not shown, only the background. But on active camera view it is shown. Maybe I screwed up some other parameter???

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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 8:42:19 pm

Just did a different view and the logo is not shown, only the background. But on active camera view it is shown.



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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 8:48:44 pm

Opened a new comp with just light, background and logo. All 3D. No effects or layer styles; plain. Custom view does show logo but not shadow. Active view also does not show shadow.



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Richard Garabedain
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 9:45:22 pm

from a front perspective -27 is not enough to see a shadow, either increase the distance by hundreds or move your light


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Richard Garabedain
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 9:47:12 pm

but it could be your layer..try using plain text..or render out a png of the logo


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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 9:55:37 pm

Tried it with text.



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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 9:51:10 pm

Per your request I increased both. Still no shadow. Crazy...



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Richard Garabedain
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 10:02:17 pm

and the solid is set to recieve shadows? maybe try reinstalling ae?


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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 10:25:33 pm

The solid is set correctly. My concern is whether re installing AE will create more problems. Adobe is not supporting older software anymore and I am using Yosemite which should still accept AE CC4 but don't know if there's anything on my drive that would put a hitch in it...

May just go to "alternate plan B" and go back to layer styles... :{

Thanks for all your input.

KEEP ON KEEPIN ON!


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Walter Soyka
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 10:28:18 pm

Have you confirmed that you're not using a funky preview mode?

See this image:


Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 7, 2020 at 10:42:10 pm

Preview mode is Off. Don't know what else to try.

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Walter Soyka
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 8, 2020 at 12:17:38 am

Can you reduce the AEP and post it here so we can take a look?

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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Robert Müller
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 8, 2020 at 11:29:32 am

"I attached a light to the graphic and made sure it cast shadows. Made sure the graphic accepted shadows also."

So did you turn on cast shadows only on the light or on the object as well? You have to turn cast shadows on for both the light AND the object you want to cast a shadow. At least thats for me in CC, I don't know if there is that big a difference in CS4


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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 8, 2020 at 12:29:34 pm

Thanks for your reply. Yes, I have the shadows turned on for both the graphic and the light.

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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 8, 2020 at 12:27:00 pm

Sorry. I don't understand what you mean by 'reduce' the AEP...

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Eric Santiago
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 8, 2020 at 1:39:13 pm

[John Nelson] "Sorry. I don't understand what you mean by 'reduce' the AEP...
"


Reduce the project size and send as a package.


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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 8, 2020 at 3:27:20 pm

I apologize again for my misunderstanding. I have been an infrequent user and student of AE over the years but greatly appreciate these forums and tutorials to help in my video productions and other situations I encounter with operating systems.

Are you asking me to send you the entire project with all associated graphics, or, produce another project using just the one graphic with the solid background and light added? How would I include that graphic? Or should I make a new project with just a text, background and light?

The current project has several comps of different renditions of the graphic.

I'm running as fast as i can to catch up with all you experts but my sneakers need replacing...

Thanks again!

KEEP ON KEEPIN ON!


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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 8, 2020 at 7:40:50 pm

After playing around with it I tried deleting the 'layer styles' and, WA-LA! the shadow returned...

I'm sorry to put you all through this but much appreciate everyone's input and hope I'm not in the naughty room for too long. I may be back...

Thanks again!

KEEP ON KEEPIN ON!


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Eric Santiago
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 8, 2020 at 7:45:19 pm

Oh crap yes, that's an old bug.
I had to remind students not to use old school Photoshop Layer effects.
Most notable drop shadow.


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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 8, 2020 at 10:55:57 pm

An oldy like me that drove me crazy...

Thanks

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Richard Garabedain
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 8, 2020 at 8:49:28 pm

so i was technically right the first time...or my 2nd time


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John Nelson
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 8, 2020 at 10:54:05 pm

I lost count but you were helpful AND right!

Thanks

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Walter Soyka
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 9, 2020 at 10:50:52 am

Technically, this behavior where layer styles break 3D intersections (and shadow-casting!) is not a bug, it's by design.

Layer styles may look like effects, but they work like blend modes. Effects are rendered on the layer, then the layer is composited into the scene, but layer styles are different. They are blended directly with the layers below, almost as if they were a layer themselves. This allows you to do cool things like use different blend modes on the styles than you use on the main layer, but it also makes 3D intersections and shadow-casting meaningless.

This documentation applies to CS4, too:
https://helpx.adobe.com/after-effects/using/3d-layers.html#3d_layer_interac...

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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Eric Santiago
Re: Elusive shadows
on May 11, 2020 at 11:43:13 am

[Walter Soyka] "Technically, this behavior where layer styles break 3D intersections (and shadow-casting!) is not a bug, it's by design."

Thanks Walter.
Next time I get a chance to inform students I shall use this post as a reference.
I don't think I've ever read that anywhere in any form of document in regards to Layer Styles for After Effects.
I probably didn't dig deep enough thus calling it a bug :)


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