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Rendering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over

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Ori Kuper
Rendering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on Apr 30, 2013 at 8:48:21 pm

Hello,
I used to always edit in PP, then bring the final file into AE for titles/particles/anything else, and then render a final file from within AE.

I'm trying now to work different; create a file in AE, render it as RGB million colors +, PNG codec Quicktime, and bring that rendered file into PP to put on top of my video (and then to hopefully render my final file from there).

1. if that's a wrong workflow to work with - please tell me now :)
2. if it's an OK workflow to work with - please tell me why i have a problem with the file that i render in AE: in my AE comp, there is a layer that includes some particles matt-ed with a fractal layer. Render from AE looks great for the titles, but when it sits on top of any dark video, it looks horribly 'dirty'. i believe that the problem is somewhere in the order of my layers, or different settings that i should use for them, or something specifically with the fractal layer. I just don't know what it is :( can you please look at my print screens here and tell me what you think?




Thanks,
Ori.


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Rendering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 1, 2013 at 2:25:35 pm

When you did the shot in AE, you might have applied a blend mode to make more realistic noise. Try it your alpha-channel noise clip in Premiere Pro.

Dave LaRonde
Former Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Ori Kuper
Re: ndering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 1, 2013 at 2:48:20 pm

Thanks Dave, yes I believe that at some point I did use blending for creating this particle/fractal layer, but can you please explain your suggestion per that blending mode and the Alpha in PP? I didn't understand what you meant in that part... Thanks, Ori.


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Dave LaRonde
Re: ndering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 1, 2013 at 3:01:05 pm

I don't know if Premiere Pro allows you to apply a blend mode to a video track in the timeline (Add, Screen, Multiply, Overlay Hard Light, etc.). If it does, apply it.

Your PNG quicktime noise clip rendered from AE has an alpha channel on it, right? If not, it should.....

And if Premiere Pro does NOT allow you to apply blend modes, you should do the whole shot in AE.

Dave LaRonde
Former Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Ori Kuper
Re: ndering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 1, 2013 at 3:13:01 pm

Yup my png had an alpah on it. Should I do anything special when bringing it into PP?


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Dave LaRonde
Re: ndering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 1, 2013 at 3:13:55 pm

You shouldn't have to do anything special...

Dave LaRonde
Former Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Ori Kuper
Re: ndering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 1, 2013 at 3:30:43 pm

Cool, so... Again, with what I have on these comps, what CAN I do to improve the situation and get rid of the 'dirt on my lens' look? I'm not near my com right now, but I believe you are right regarding the blending mode on pp layers (there is no such). Should I turn off our changing any blending node that iapplied to any layer in AE? Should I avoid from using any of them? I understand that this blending mode is the cause for my 'dirt on glass'...?


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Dave LaRonde
Re: ndering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 1, 2013 at 3:35:38 pm

Now you have describe in detail the look you're trying to accomplish. Without that, we're just spinning our wheels.

Dave LaRonde
Former Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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John Cuevas
Re: ndering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 1, 2013 at 4:06:53 pm

If you want to use that effect with for one particular shot, just bring that shot into AE and composite it with the blending modes, than render that out and import it into AE.

Johnny Cuevas, Editor
Thinkck.com

"I have not failed 700 times. I have succeeded in proving that those 700 ways will not work. When I have eliminated the ways that will not work, I will find the way that will work."
---THOMAS EDISON on inventing the light bulb.


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Ori Kuper
Re: ndering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 2, 2013 at 1:12:56 pm

Thanks John, It's not only 1 short shot... it's about 1.5 mins of video, on which i mostly gonna edit/work in PP, that's why i preferred to bring the titles/particles as a RGB+alpha file into PP and render it all from there at the end. if it won't work with different blending modes (or none) when i render in AE - i'll have to render the whole video in PP (as one shot), place the rendered mov file into AE and render a final file from there.

Dave - Sorry for any confusion. i'll try to simplify my problem here - all i want is just for the particles to show, whenever they fly over the bright parts of the fractal layer. for some reason after i render my comp in AE (QuickTime, NPG codec, RGB+,Million colors+) and bring it into PP, i get the 'dirt over lens' everywhere on the screen for the whole video(you can see it in the bottom screen shot on the left hand side). So i guess in that case it's not the look i desire to get, it's the look that i desire NOT to get ;)

Any ideas for what blending modes to use or PREVENT from using in my AE comp? in other words - what blending mode on my fractal comp is the one that creating the bad artifacts on my render?

Ori.


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Dave LaRonde
Re: ndering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 2, 2013 at 2:07:52 pm

You want this to show only on the bright parts, huh? Here's a good trick for that: in AE, use the shot itself as a Luma Matte... or Luma Inverted Matte, I forget which

In a precomp, put your shot with the particle effect. The particles will be all over. No sweat.

In the MAIN comp, add the shot. Duplicate it. Add the precomp in between the two footage layers. On the precomp layer -- you're working in the main comp, now -- go to the trk matte setting and use either Luma Matte or Luma Inverted Matte. On one of those selections, the particles wil disappear from the dark parts.

Dave LaRonde
Former Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Ori Kuper
Re: ndering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 2, 2013 at 2:57:21 pm

Dave thanks. That's exactly to problem - I DID use luma matt to show those particles only on the bright posts of the fractal, and in AE it all looks fine. It's only when I render it out of there as a quick time mov with png codec, that there are nasty' smirks' all over the frame :(


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Dave LaRonde
Re: ndering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 2, 2013 at 3:39:06 pm

So do like Johnny suggests and do the whole shot in AE.

Dave LaRonde
Former Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Ori Kuper
Re: ndering a particles/fractal comp in EA (QuickTime PNG). when shows in premiere - it has 'dirt' all over
on May 2, 2013 at 3:46:36 pm

Will do. I guess that's the only way for now... sticking to my old workflow -switching back and forth between Ae and Pp. thanks anyway, and i'll let you know if I find a solution...


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