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Color Space Managment/Linear Workspace Settings for .R3D Raw Grading in AECS6

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Matteo Ferreccio
Color Space Managment/Linear Workspace Settings for .R3D Raw Grading in AECS6
on Mar 29, 2014 at 4:50:08 pm

Hi everyone.

I am new to RAW workflow, so I can't get some things to work properly.
Issues about footage interpretation and color space managment.

______________________________________________________________________

I am working with .R3D 4K files (exactely as shot, no RedCine-X or other intermediary grading) in a AECS6.

Project set as:

workspace: sRGB-IEC61966-2.1 (*as I work on a LED monitor set as sRGB and project output is mainly monitors/internet)

depth: 32bpc

Linearize Worspace

-------------------
All .R3D are interpreted as:

Color Managment:
Assigned Profile: workspace - sRGB-IEC61966-2.1 (Linear)
Interpret as Linear Light: Off

Other Options:
"As Shot", color space: REDcolor, gamma curve: REDgamma
-------------------

Here's the problems and the doubts.

In the "other option" RAW preview, footage looks right, regardless of external settings such as "Interpret as linear light" set on or off.

Externally, like in Comp View, the only way the footage won't look overexposed is to set "Interpret as Linear Light" as "Off", which I don't really think it's right, as I am working on linear space.

Plus, the only color grading I am doing is, of course, in the "other options" window which let you adjust the RAW data. But, once hit "ok", footage looks always different than in the "other option" preview on which I am doing the grading. It always appears to have a little more brightness and less contrast.

Can anyone help me with proper settings or give me some RAW workflow informations that could be helpful?

Thank you so much,
Matt


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Walter Soyka
Re: Color Space Managment/Linear Workspace Settings for .R3D Raw Grading in AECS6
on Mar 30, 2014 at 1:07:24 am

[Matteo Ferreccio] "Externally, like in Comp View, the only way the footage won't look overexposed is to set "Interpret as Linear Light" as "Off", which I don't really think it's right, as I am working on linear space."

Don't try to match your footage to your working space. Your footage interpretation should match the footage. Interpret as Linear Light should only be on if your footage is actually linear.

It's the color management system's job to transform the source footage into the working space, and then the working space into the display and output spaces as required. You have to accurately describe your source footage to the color management system for this to work.


[Matteo Ferreccio] "Plus, the only color grading I am doing is, of course, in the "other options" window which let you adjust the RAW data."

Why not just do this in REDCINE-X?


[Matteo Ferreccio] "But, once hit "ok", footage looks always different than in the "other option" preview on which I am doing the grading. It always appears to have a little more brightness and less contrast."

Have you profiled your monitor?

When you enable color management in Ae by setting a working space, display color management is enabled by default -- meaning that Ae transforms colors in the comp window from the working space to the monitor's profile.

I do not believe that the RED preview window is color-managed, meaning this conversion wouldn't happen there. This will cause a discrepancy between the RED preview window and the comp viewer. If your monitor is well-profiled, then the color-managed comp viewer is correct and the unmanaged RED preview window is not.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Matteo Ferreccio
Re: Color Space Managment/Linear Workspace Settings for .R3D Raw Grading in AECS6
on Mar 30, 2014 at 2:46:10 pm

Many thanks for the explanations.

"Your footage interpretation should match the footage."

Ok, I'll do further research on the .R3D color space then.

"Why not just do this in REDCINE-X?"

Because I don't have it working in this machine right now. Plus, I wanted to learn how to manage the entire color grading process in AECS6.

"Have you profiled your monitor?"

My current monitor is set on sRGB color space.

--------
So, thing is basically to properly interpret the .R3D footage, regardless of Project Settings. Am I right?

Thanks,
Matt


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Walter Soyka
Re: Color Space Managment/Linear Workspace Settings for .R3D Raw Grading in AECS6
on Mar 30, 2014 at 5:31:57 pm

[Matteo Ferreccio] "So, thing is basically to properly interpret the .R3D footage, regardless of Project Settings. Am I right?"

Yes.



[Matteo Ferreccio] "My current monitor is set on sRGB color space."

I'm talking about using a probe to measure your monitor's response and build an ICC profile that describes it. If you haven't done this, then there's no way to know if display color management is showing you the right color or not. You're basically flying blind with no way to make critical color evaluation.

Given that, and given you are just outputting things in the same space they were input, color management isn't doing anything for you.

Also, given that the RED preview window doesn't seem to be color-managed, you are not able to accurately monitor your adjustments.

Unless you have a profiled monitor for display color management, or unless you're combining sources from multiple profiles, or unless you need to transform sources from one profile to a different output profile, color management will not do anything for you.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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