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AE hangs when audio added to project and either ram or audio preview

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Greg SageAE hangs when audio added to project and either ram or audio preview
by on Mar 4, 2014 at 4:35:57 am

I've got a very complex project that all works fine as just video.

Just finished editing audio together in Logic. Outputted as both a 16 bit 48k WAV, and as a 16 bit 48k AIFF. Verified that project is set to 48k.

There are no other audio tracks.

When I hit ram preview or audio preview (.), it just hangs. A second or two to get going without the audio, and minutes with no end on sight with audio.

I tried loading those same wav and aif files into blank AE project, and they load. They're a bit slow, but they load and can be previewed.

I've got more than enough ram. I need to finish this project tomorrow, and it's come to a rather unexpected full stop until I can resolve this.

Again, there are no weird file formats or anything, just one single audio file as either a WAV or AIF at 16/48. Everything renders fine without the audio, and audio renders in a blank project.

thx


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Walter SoykaRe: AE hangs when audio added to project and either ram or audio preview
by on Mar 4, 2014 at 10:31:04 am

It's always helpful if you mention your Ae version, OS, and system specs, but here are a few questions and suggestions:

Is there any message in the info panel when you start the RAM preview?

Does this happen with all audio files, or just these?

Does it make a difference if you change the audio output device in Preferences > Audio Hardware?

Have you tried resetting your Ae preferences? (Press Ctrl+Alt+Shift (Windows) or Command+Option+Shift (Mac OS) while the application is starting.)

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Greg SageRe: AE hangs when audio added to project and either ram or audio preview
by on Mar 4, 2014 at 3:39:52 pm
Last Edited By Greg Sage on Mar 4, 2014 at 6:24:49 pm

AE cs6 v 11.0.0.378
Early 2008 Octomac 2.8Ghz
24Gb ram
OSX 10.8.2
All project data on one internal 7200rpm SATA drive
100GB disk cache on another internal 7200 rpm SATA drive
QuickTime™ Version 7.7.1

Thx... good items to check. Let's see:


Tried changing device from Duet (my audio interface) to internal... no change. Current buffer is set at 512. I've only ever used AE on this system, and it has always appeared to have a MUCH harder time dealing with projects once they contain audio. Never made sense to me since data rate is so much lower than video. Should my buffer be set higher or lower?

Tried switching in a different audio track... no change.

Tried a few times doing the three finger salute on opening, but I must've gotten something mixed up between using windows keyboard on mac system... since I don't see any notice or anything different in prefs once open. Will try again.

Project is set at 48k. Using stereo AIFF file at 48k, 16 bit that plays fine in Quicktime and previews ok, although sluggish as always when dropped into blank AE project. In current project, it hangs on spinning wheel trying to lock existing frames even when I turn the eye icon off for every single visual item. Buffer issue?

Only message I've noticed upon hitting ram preview is the "locking existing frames"... and then it just keeps going and going.

It is a very complex project with all the layers, but it's not that long, and I've got the ram to cover it... and it renders ok without the audio, so the audio appears to be bottlenecking the preview process somehow.

I can work just fine in the project with the audio in the timeline so long as I don't do anything that previews it. Waveform shows up fine, etc.

Possible Quicktime issue? Logic works fine, Quicktime plays things fine.

Not sure if it could be related in any way, but attaching screenshot of multiprocessing prefs.



edit: Just tried increasing audio buffer to 2084 and still hanging on "locking existing frames". It is a rather long bit of audio at just under 5 minutes. Does AE need to process it somehow the first time around?

update 2: hmmmm.... went into prefs and hit "Empty Disk Cache, and it took 5 minutes just to start emptying, and it's 10 minutes later now, and just over half emptied on the progress bar.


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Walter SoykaRe: AE hangs when audio added to project and either ram or audio preview
by on Mar 5, 2014 at 1:36:05 pm

[Greg Sage] "In current project, it hangs on spinning wheel trying to lock existing frames even when I turn the eye icon off for every single visual item. Buffer issue? Only message I've noticed upon hitting ram preview is the "locking existing frames"... and then it just keeps going and going."

So you never see the "Mixing audio" message in the info panel?

Do ALL audio files do this in this project, or just these? Can you process them elsewhere, like in Premiere or Media Encoder? Could you use AME to re-encode them, keeping them 48KHz 16-bit stereo?

Does the same thing happen if you export just a shorter chunk (10s maybe) of audio with the same pipeline?

Probably unrelated, but I think your memory reserved for other applications setting is pretty aggressive. I generally leave between a quarter and a third of RAM to other apps. I'd suggest 8 GB for your 24 GB system.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Greg SageRe: AE hangs when audio added to project and either ram or audio preview
by on Mar 5, 2014 at 3:42:32 pm

Memory settings changed.

Looking into some of the above. In the meantime, something very odd just happened. I tried rendering just a short bit, and it took a ridiculously long time to do ram preview, but it finally managed.

Audio was sped up, though... by roughly the amount if you recorded at 44.1 and played back at 48

Thoughts: I did accidentally record the audio at 44.1 into logic, but I set the output to 48k. I then looked at the file in finder, and it's labeled as being 48k, and plays fine in QT.

AE project is set to 48k... yet somehow it sure sounds like 44.1 audio being sped up to match 48k.

Can I output 44.1 in logic and do the sample rate conversion in Media Encoder?


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Walter SoykaRe: AE hangs when audio added to project and either ram or audio preview
by on Mar 5, 2014 at 3:49:21 pm

[Greg Sage] "Audio was sped up, though... by roughly the amount if you recorded at 44.1 and played back at 48"

Strange!


[Greg Sage] "Can I output 44.1 in logic and do the sample rate conversion in Media Encoder?"

Yes, you can. I think that'd be a good thing to try next.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Greg SageRe: AE hangs when audio added to project and either ram or audio preview
by on Mar 5, 2014 at 10:47:20 pm
Last Edited By Greg Sage on Mar 6, 2014 at 12:08:37 am

Yeah. Very strange... but discovering that doesn't seem to have helped. I don't see how to do it in media encoder since I don't see the output options I need. Seems geared more toward delivery media (mp3,etc)

QT pro appears to have the tools, though, so I transcoded to mono 48k.

No dice. Trying to render a 1 minute section at quarter resolution which can spit out a couple frames a second without the audio results in 10+ minutes of "locking existing frames" after which I lost patience.

In the meantime, I did manage to trash the prefs file. No help there either. I've tried buffer settings between 512 and 2048, and it doesn't appear to make any difference.

Prefs reset also undid the "render multiple frames simultaneously" options in the processing window... again, no help.

I also went into the prefs for my soundcard (duet), and set it independently for 48k. No help.

If I take the same 4:16 48k mono AIFF file and place it in a blank AE project, then hit ram preview, it says "Locking existing frames" for approx 1 sec, then plays, scrubs, etc... just fine.

If I remove the audio file from the timeline, there are no other elements that contain audio. If I hit ram preview at that point, the same 1 minute section says "locking existing frame" for approx 1 sec, then starts processing frames at around 2/sec.

I then tried converting a little 4 second clip using QT pro to 48k mono just like the offending file, and... after 5 minutes stuck on "locking existing frames", I gave up.

So... I tried taking the original offending audio file, and dropping it into a much smaller, simpler AE file... and it rendered a ram preview with no issues.

So... I tried taking the same clip, and putting it into another more complex layered and heavily effected AE project... and it hangs.

Tried opening another complex project that did work previously containing audio... and it hangs works, but only after a ridiculously long period of several minutes before it even starts rendering frames for a 30 sec segment.

I can't think of anything offhand that has changed about the system config. Maybe a botched install of QT that was then redone. Some kind of error message regarding Encore... but nothing about AE, Bridge, ME, etc.

Really scratching my head here.

It's clearly getting hung up on something having to do with processing the audio, and it's a problem with larger files, but I've never had this level of issues before... although audio has always seemed to be the thing AE was least adept at handling. There must be some sort of system setting, pref, or something that's making it choke on the audio.

Found this in another thread having similar issue of audio crippling ram preview:

"Wow! Found the solution, and nice little bug in AE. Thanks for the suggestion of testing out audio in other timelines - the audio worked - so it had to be the sequence. I went through all 456 shots and turned off the source audio, and now it doesn't lock frames - or only does for a fraction of a second. Looks like everytime you want to preview RAM AE wants to check EVERY audio clip in your sequence (even if you're not previewing it!)"

I don't thing there's any audio anywhere else, though. It's all keyframe animation of images... maybe there's a rendered .mov somewhere not being used. Going back and double-checking.


edit: Just tried audio audition only (.) and it's an endless spinning wheel.

Then tried decreasing default audio preview length from 30sec to 5sec. No change.

Then, tried suggestions found elsewhere like disabling disk cache and shutting down everything else, disabling multi-threading, and increasing ram set to AE. None of this did any good. Reset now.


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Charlie DeGrootRe: AE hangs when audio added to project and either ram or audio preview
by on Oct 28, 2014 at 9:08:37 pm

Just a heads up that I was having the same issue on Windows (MacPro hardware) with an M-Audio interface. For some reason unplugging and re-plugging the USB on my audio interface solves the issue. It will pop back up every few days, but doing the unplug thing works. I know it's a long-shot since you're using a different interface and you're on OSX, but couldn't hurt to try!


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