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24 fps to 29.97 is this a big problem?

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Stephen Evans
24 fps to 29.97 is this a big problem?
on Aug 13, 2013 at 2:53:58 am

Hi, I began a project in 24fps that would eventually be for broadcast. Being a more traditional character animator, I had never produced anything before that needed to be 29.97.
So, before I began, I asked around to see if it's necessary that my project be at 29.97. Both sources said no it's ok to create animation at 24fps and then render to 29.97. I did the character animation at 24fps and my AE comps are also at 24fps.
When I test rendered at 29.97, I got an ugly result, misaligned audio etc. Please someone tell me there's an easy way out of this mess.
thanks!
stephen


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mathew fuller
Re: 24 fps to 29.97 is this a big problem?
on Aug 13, 2013 at 6:36:53 am

When u render it out you need to add 3:2 pulldown into it. Its in your render settings. It will give you a rendered framerate of 29.97.

If it is SD use lower field first. If it is HD you use upper field first.

You dont need to change the comp framerate just the render settings.

Bing. Done.

My Work:
http://www.morecompletefx.com


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Walter Soyka
Re: 24 fps to 29.97 is this a big problem?
on Aug 13, 2013 at 12:22:02 pm

[Stephen Evans] "When I test rendered at 29.97, I got an ugly result, misaligned audio etc. Please someone tell me there's an easy way out of this mess."

How did you do this test render? Once you add your comp to the render queue, you should just be able to change the frame rate in its render settings.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Stephen Evans
Re: 24 fps to 29.97 is this a big problem?
on Aug 20, 2013 at 4:56:04 pm

sorry, i meant to reply earlier to this and say thanks to you guys. it worked out well.
Am i correctly understanding that the slight bands/artifacts i see in my new export with the pulldown added are ok and that they have to do with me having a progressive monitor?
can i assume that i can hand this off to the editor and he will perform some kind of magic on it to convert it for broadcast and the banding will not be an issue?
thanks!
stephen


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mathew fuller
Re: 24 fps to 29.97 is this a big problem?
on Aug 20, 2013 at 6:04:19 pm

The "banding" you see is the interlaced frames. Yes it is normal. That's what 3:2 pulldown looks like.

Just make sure you added the right kind.

Upper field first for HD
Lower field first for SD

My Work:
http://www.morecompletefx.com


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Walter Soyka
Re: 24 fps to 29.97 is this a big problem?
on Aug 20, 2013 at 6:44:29 pm

Just FYI, the term "banding" refers to a totally different visual flaw, with a totally different cause. See this picture for an example:

Banding image [link]

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Stephen Evans
Re: 24 fps to 29.97 is this a big problem?
on Aug 20, 2013 at 10:21:07 pm

oh, i have that problem too.
i think i read that one solution is to apply a blur to it, true?


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Walter Soyka
Re: 24 fps to 29.97 is this a big problem?
on Aug 23, 2013 at 2:59:27 pm

[Stephen Evans] "i think i read that one solution is to apply a blur to it, true?"

No, blurring will not generally help banding. You need to dither [link] instead.

If your project is 8bpc, you can turn it up to 16bpc or even 32bpc. For 8-bit output from higher bit-depth projects, After Effects will apply some dithering for you.

Alternately, you can add a Noise effect with a low amount (<4%) to force a bit of dithering.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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