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Rotoscope makes 3D shadows disappear - *PROJECT FILE INCLUDED*

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Kyle Cox
Rotoscope makes 3D shadows disappear - *PROJECT FILE INCLUDED*
on Mar 31, 2013 at 2:25:18 am

**TO ANYONE W/ AFTER EFFECTS** I have my AE Project file included, could you please open it up and tell me how I can fix this?

Project File: 5749_gonzagakick3dhelp.aep.zip

Finished Render: 5751_heavyweight10linkedcomp072.mov.zip
(you guys wont have the footage I used so it wont show up in the project, would have uploaded it but it was over the 100MB max)

I have some awesome MMA footage and wanted to include some 3D text and make it look like a real 3D object in the video. I used a camera tracker to set the text in place, then used a light and a solid layer parented beneath the 3D text to cast a shadow on the ground behind the Text.

My next step was to create the illusion of the text being 'behind' the fighters, so that when the guy on the left finishes kicking, his leg travels IN FRONT OF the '3D Text' located near the lower left portion of the footage. For the most part, it worked great, and after rotoscoping the legs of the fighter on the left and placing them above the '3D Text' layer, I've successfully created this illusion.

However, one problem I'm having is that the moment the Rotoscope'd layer comes into existence, the shadows cast by my '3D Text' is lost (it disappears). I need someone more proficient than myself to open up my project (included in this post), fiddle around w/ my project and let me know how to fix this and/or what I did wrong!

If one of the guru's here could play around w/ my footage and fix this, I would be forever greatful. Hope to hear from you guys!

-Kyle


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Walter Soyka
Re: Rotoscope makes 3D shadows disappear - *PROJECT FILE INCLUDED*
on Mar 31, 2013 at 3:37:55 am

You cannot intermingle 2D and 3D layers -- if you have a 2D layer in between your 3D layers, it will break intersections and shadow casting.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Todd Kopriva
Re: Rotoscope makes 3D shadows disappear - *PROJECT FILE INCLUDED*
on Mar 31, 2013 at 3:58:22 am

There's more detail about Walter's answer here:
http://helpx.adobe.com/after-effects/using/3d-layers.html#3d_layer_interact...

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Todd Kopriva, Adobe Systems Incorporated
After Effects quality engineering
After Effects team blog
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Kyle Cox
Re: Rotoscope makes 3D shadows disappear - *PROJECT FILE INCLUDED*
on Mar 31, 2013 at 6:44:32 am

Thank you both for the responses.

I wonder then, how I might go about getting the effect I'm looking for (the rendered .mov, but with the shadows all the way through). Any ideas?

Originally I was going to place the fighters in front of the text using a different method than Rotoscoping. I saw it in a tutorial a while back, but for the life if me I CANNOT find it again, very frustrating!

The way he did it was by duplicating the video layer as I did in this version, only instead of rotoscoping the top layer, he used some sort of Luma Matte (or maybe a track matte? I'm not sure). He had the full video (2 guys standing in front of a white board, on either side) as the bottom most layer. The goal was to insert a business logo onto the blank white board behind them, with their torsos obscuring part of the logo (aka they are 'in front' of it). The next layer up he had the logo. The duplicated video layer went on top of the logo layer I believe, and he changed the color of the video so that the two guys were either all black or all white (can't remember which is transparent and which is opaque. But he made them opaque). Then he applied some sort of luma effect that 'cut out' the two guys from the rest of the video (because they were all white or black), then somehow (I think with a blending mode) he returned the two 'cut out' guys back to their original color, and wala, they were standing perfectly in front of the logo!

Some of the steps I listed above could be wrong, but this is what I faintly remember. I'm hoping it's enough of a clue for someone here to be able to tell me how something like this is done. Because when I search for 'place 3D text behind an object in video', or something similar, all I get is rotoscoping tutorials (very frustrating, because this guy's luma method was actually easier and better looking in his case).

Does this ring a bell for any of you vets out there?
Thanks for the help thus far,

-Kyle


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Walter Soyka
Re: Rotoscope makes 3D shadows disappear - *PROJECT FILE INCLUDED*
on Mar 31, 2013 at 7:06:21 am

[Kyle Cox] "I wonder then, how I might go about getting the effect I'm looking for (the rendered .mov, but with the shadows all the way through). Any ideas?"

Right now, your have a 2D layer (video on layer 3) in between your shadow catcher (layer 1) and the 3D text (layer 4). Move the 2D video layer up above the shadow catcher in your layer stack so all 3D layers are together.


[Kyle Cox] "The way he did it was by duplicating the video layer as I did in this version, only instead of rotoscoping the top layer, he used some sort of Luma Matte (or maybe a track matte? I'm not sure). He had the full video (2 guys standing in front of a white board, on either side) as the bottom most layer. The goal was to insert a business logo onto the blank white board behind them, with their torsos obscuring part of the logo (aka they are 'in front' of it). The next layer up he had the logo. The duplicated video layer went on top of the logo layer I believe, and he changed the color of the video so that the two guys were either all black or all white (can't remember which is transparent and which is opaque. But he made them opaque). Then he applied some sort of luma effect that 'cut out' the two guys from the rest of the video (because they were all white or black), then somehow (I think with a blending mode) he returned the two 'cut out' guys back to their original color, and wala, they were standing perfectly in front of the logo!"

You could do this with a luma key, or by making a high-contrast matte from the original footage with Levels or Threshold -- but these techniques rely on a big brightness separation between foreground (to keep) and background (to remove). It may work when the background is a whiteboard, but it's not usable in the general case.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Kyle Cox
Re: Rotoscope makes 3D shadows disappear - *PROJECT FILE INCLUDED*
on Mar 31, 2013 at 9:21:52 pm

Thank you very much Walter, worked like a charm!

-Kyle


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Kyle Cox
NEW PROBLEM: make rotoscope match my blending mode?
on Apr 23, 2013 at 2:24:55 am

Hey guys, I'm back, this time with a new issue on the same project. After you guys solved my problem, I decided to play with some blending modes to change the overall look of my composition.

FINAL RENDER:5892_gonzagakickcreativecow2.mov.zip

PROJECT FILE:5893_gonzagakick3dcreativecow.aep.zip

I settled on the 'Stencil Luma' blending mode, just liked the overall contrasty/comic look it gave the footage. My issue now is how to get my Rotoscoped layer on top to match the background footage (which has the Stencil Luma blending mode applied to it). You'll notice that in my final rendered video, as soon as the rotoscope takes effect (pants/legs of the fighter on the left), the colors no longer match the background footage. At the same time, I can't simply duplicate and stack my rotoscoped layer, then apply Stencil Luma to the top layer (like I did with the background footage). This effects my 3D font and everything else beneath it, giving an unwanted look.

I'm aware that my solution likely involves some kind of precomposition, but I've been toying with it and can't seem to figure it out on my own. I've attached my project file and my final rendered video so that you guys can look at my layers (and see the finished project) and perhaps tell me where I went wrong. If you have any questions as to what any of the layers are, etc, please feel free to ask (I say this because obviously, the media is going to be disconnected - this fight clip was much too large to upload).

Please let me know if you have an idea as to how I can apply this exact same 'Stencil Luma' look to my rotoscoped layer! Thanks for your help thus far,

-Kyle


PS: in case you're wondering what the rotoscope is for, it's to make the fighters appear to be 'in front of' the 3d text that reads 'TESTING' in the lower left portion of the frame (light purple).


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