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Rotoscoping Programs?

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David ShapiroRotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 12:18:34 am

Hi,

After After Effects, what is the next best person rotoscoping program? I need one that works well with moving people.


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Herbie HumperdinkRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 1:44:00 am

Mocha. Part of After Effects. I dare anyone to say I am wrong. :)


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David ShapiroRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 3:02:57 am

Ok, look, stupid question here:

Where in the world can I find the main website about Mocha? or where can I download it? is it even free? or is it some supper expensive program?

(I've only heard about Mocha and never needed to look into it until now and Google isn't helping me at the moment.)


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Herbie HumperdinkRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 3:07:38 am

Mocha is a program developed by Imagineer Systems. It is bundled with adobe after effects since version CS4 (if my memory does not fail) It uses planar tracking technology instead of the standard point trackers.

It greatly simplifies roto work.

Take a look at this link:
http://tv.adobe.com/show/mocha-ae-planar-tracking-roto/

Peace and Love.


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Tero AhlforsRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 4:40:11 am

Silhouette is neat: http://www.silhouettefx.com/


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Tom DaigonRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 5:46:15 am

Another vote for Mocha here. Its powerful, well designed and FREE with CS6.

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
http://www.hdshotsandcuts.com





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David ShapiroRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 6:02:46 am

I've looked at Silhouette, but it looks like it works best with shapes, not people. Is this so?


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Walter SoykaRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 6:19:56 am

[David Shapiro] "I've looked at Silhouette, but it looks like it works best with shapes, not people. Is this so?"

In roto, people ARE shapes -- usually multiple shapes. You almost never want to animate a single mask over a person's outline. Instead, best practice is to watch the way they move and animate a set of overlapping masks. For example, you may have separate shapes for a person's hand, forearm, upper arm, torso, head, etc.

fxguide's The Art of Roto [link] provides a nice overview on the history of roto, basic roto technique, and software for roto.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Tudor "Ted" JelescuRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 10:24:46 am

I would go for Mocha as well.

Tudor "Ted" Jelescu
Senior VFX Artist


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Vishesh AroraRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 2:29:37 pm

I would also go for Mocha. Why to buy any other software if we are getting such a powerful tool for free with AE.

Vishesh Arora
3D and Motion Graphics Artist
Films Rajendra

Blog:
http://digieffects.wordpress.com

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Herbie HumperdinkRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 3:27:14 pm

At almost 1k. Why would you ever want to pay for Silhouette FX. Mocha is rock solid and it is part of AE.


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David ShapiroRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 3:31:56 pm

oh, I thought it was free.... what is the cheapest way to get Mocha by itself? (I don't have After Effects.)


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Tom DaigonRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 4:39:55 pm

You really need a compositing type of program like AE to really take advantage of Mocha. If you have something similar to AE then you can buy Mocha here.

https://webshop.imagineersystems.com/index.php?dispatch=categories.view&cat...

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
http://www.hdshotsandcuts.com





(Best viewed at 1080P and full screen)
HP Z820 Dual 2687
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Dulce DQg2 16TB raid


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Conrad OlsonRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 7:03:49 pm

If you don't already have After Effects, and therefore don't have Mocha already, and you are looking to buy a dedicated package for roto I would really suggest Silhouette. The tools for detailed roto are the best I've used. I've worked at Framestore and MPC and they both use Silhouette as their main roto package.

Admittedly I learned to roto in Silhouette, so I've always stuck to it and found roto in Mocha frustrating in comparison. I'm sure if I spent some time learning Mocha I could get used to it. The planar tracking is much better in Mocha.

I've written some roto tip on my blog, they are based on my experience in Silhouette but apply to all roto apps: http://conradolson.com/my-top-10-roto-tips

---

conradolson.com


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Walter SoykaRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 8:19:12 pm

[Conrad Olson] "If you don't already have After Effects, and therefore don't have Mocha already, and you are looking to buy a dedicated package for roto I would really suggest Silhouette. The tools for detailed roto are the best I've used."

Conrad, what are the big differentiators for Silhouette? It seems to come up in every serious discussion of roto, but I've never seen it in action, and I'd be curious to learn what it does best.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Conrad OlsonRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 9, 2013 at 9:52:55 pm

Just to put these comments in context; I have never done any really heavy roto in Mocha so I am mainly comparing Silhouette with Nuke. The Foundry is constantly improving the roto tools in Nuke and I haven't tried the new tools in the recent update Nuke 7.

Also, I never had to do any serious roto in the jobs that I used After Effects for so I can't really compare the two, but from what I remember of the roto tools in AE I wouldn't want to do much in there.


Silhouette is designed purely for roto and painting. This means that the interface, keyboard shortcuts and performance are dedicated to just that. Once you learn all the keyboard shortcuts (there aren't that many) it is much fast to work with than Nuke.

The snappy playback and various display modes (also with keyboard shortcuts) also makes it much faster to move through the frames and check your work as you go, which means it is much easier to spot and address boiling or jittery edges as you work.

My favorite tools though are the transform tools. These allow you to skew/scale/rotate whole shapes, or a selection of points. This helps you keep the points consistent relative to each other, which in turn speeds up the work and reduces boiling. There are tools like this in Nuke but the way they work in Silhouette are just better and faster, the skew tool especially.

The combination of the nested layers and the point tracking in Silhouette allows you to use tracking to speed up your work. They do have planar tracking too but the last time I tried to use it (which was a while ago now) it was useless. Apparently the latest version has improved the planar tracking. Again, Nuke has nested layers and allows you to apply tracking, but it isn't as fast.

The frame-by-frame painting is unmatched.

---

conradolson.com


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Tudor "Ted" JelescuRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 10, 2013 at 7:35:01 am

Except for the planar tracking it almost sounds like Commotion - that was an awesome roto and paint package years ago. Too bad Puffin Designs got bought out and Pinnacle made a mess out of it.

Tudor "Ted" Jelescu
Senior VFX Artist


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Conrad OlsonRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 10, 2013 at 5:32:10 pm

[Tudor "Ted" Jelescu] "Except for the planar tracking it almost sounds like Commotion - that was an awesome roto and paint package years ago. Too bad Puffin Designs got bought out and Pinnacle made a mess out of it."

I started at Framestore not long after they had phased out Commotion so I never got to use it. There were a few of the more senior members of the paint and roto team that would talk about it fondly.

---

conradolson.com


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Ross ShainRe: Rotoscoping Programs?
by on Jan 10, 2013 at 5:20:40 pm

To add to this thread, mocha v3 adds some features requested by roto artists:

transform tool to rotate, scale & skew points, shapes or groups
more shortcuts (nudge, diagonal nudge)
multi-select, group & fold layers
color code splines & fills
improved keyframe interface (dopesheet).

Hope this helps. So, mocha AE v3 which has some of the advanced roto features is an affordable upgrade from the bundled mocha AE v3.
View Chart: http://www.imagineersystems.com/compare-products

Best,
Ross

Ross Shain
Imagineer Systems
http://www.imagineersystems.com


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