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Canon 5D footage advice needed. Do I need to convert to Pro Res or is Raw ok for After Effects

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Mark Likosky
Canon 5D footage advice needed. Do I need to convert to Pro Res or is Raw ok for After Effects
on Sep 2, 2012 at 12:00:50 pm

I'm a shooting hundreds of exercises for a fitness app and have been dragging the raw footage into AE and then processing out as H.264 files.

They are then used on for iphone/ipad and android apps and soon will be on apple tv and youtube.

I've noticed a lot of noise when I use masks to extend the white backdrop and was wondering if there were other formats I should try in terms of conversions and/or output formats in order to get better quality all around.

If I stick to RAW from Canon and h.264, what are the best effects in AE to use for better management of noise?
So far the Auto Color has been pretty good seeing that the white background isn't perfectly lit.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Canon 5D footage advice needed. Do I need to convert to Pro Res or is Raw ok for After Effects
on Sep 2, 2012 at 6:35:21 pm

Knowing your complete workflow -- the software and their versions -- plus info about your computer & OS will help make a more accurate recommendation.

At the moment, all I can tell you is to avoid using H.264 in AE. You may not have to do this, but without more detailed info I would treat the codec like it was the ebola virus.

Feathering masks will help a lot in the kind of set extension you're undertaking.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Mark Likosky
Re: Canon 5D footage advice needed. Do I need to convert to Pro Res or is Raw ok for After Effects
on Sep 2, 2012 at 6:46:40 pm

Dave,

I'm using AE CS5 on a MBP.
Just signed up for the cloud but waiting till done editing this batch before I upgrade to CS6.

So are you saying not to bring the raw footage into AE?
Im outputting to h264 for them to use it in mobile apps and web.
I also make a 1440x1080 version cropped to fit their apps interface so AE is a quick way for me to customize each crop. Otherwise if I just create a separate output module as 1440, it comes out stretched.

I'm feathering my masks quite a bit but still see a little noise. Was wondering if there was a preset to reduce the pixelated noise


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Tero Ahlfors
Re: Canon 5D footage advice needed. Do I need to convert to Pro Res or is Raw ok for After Effects
on Sep 3, 2012 at 11:54:59 am

The Canon H264 files work fine in AE. I've had no problems with it.


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Mark Likosky
Re: Canon 5D footage advice needed. Do I need to convert to Pro Res or is Raw ok for After Effects
on Sep 3, 2012 at 4:39:31 pm

Tero,

I don't seem to have a problem with bringing them in either. Just getting a feel of what other people experience with dragging them right in.

What are your outputs usually?

Thanks
Mark


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Tero Ahlfors
Re: Canon 5D footage advice needed. Do I need to convert to Pro Res or is Raw ok for After Effects
on Sep 3, 2012 at 6:42:09 pm

[Mark Likosky] "What are your outputs usually?"

DPX, prores/dnxhd or uncompressed quicktime.


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Mark Likosky
Re: Canon 5D footage advice needed. Do I need to convert to Pro Res or is Raw ok for After Effects
on Sep 3, 2012 at 4:47:53 pm

Dave,

I feather the masks quite a bit but then the background starts to show up so I pull back. Once I'm done I notice a color change when I'm done so I'm trying to figure out how to get my original background to be pure white without making the person too contrasty and then the new color later blend better by also being pure white.

thanks
mark


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Walter Soyka
Re: Canon 5D footage advice needed. Do I need to convert to Pro Res or is Raw ok for After Effects
on Sep 3, 2012 at 2:31:28 pm

[Mark Likosky] "If I stick to RAW from Canon and h.264..."

Canon cameras can shoot images as RAW, but they shoot video as heavily-compressed H.264.


[Mark Likosky] "I've noticed a lot of noise when I use masks to extend the white backdrop and was wondering if there were other formats I should try in terms of conversions and/or output formats in order to get better quality all around."

With H.264 recordings, the damage is done in the camera. Transcoding the H.264 files to another format will not add quality (though it may make the files easier for certain applications to use).

I generally don't recommend using AE itself for H.264 output, because it doesn't do multi-pass encoding. You may get cleaner results using Adobe Media Encoder.


[Mark Likosky] "what are the best effects in AE to use for better management of noise?"

AE's built-in Remove Grain effect [link] is pretty good. I'm partial to Neat Video [link], and other third-party options include Red Giant Software Magic Bullet Denoiser II [link] and RE:Vision Effects DE:Noise [link].

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Mark Likosky
Re: Canon 5D footage advice needed. Do I need to convert to Pro Res or is Raw ok for After Effects
on Sep 3, 2012 at 4:44:49 pm

Walter,

Thanks for that advice. I figured the video would have to be compressed to create such small files (compared to when I shot with the Sony Ex-3)

Do you recommend Pro-Res 422 to use in AE? I've done that in Compresser but did not notice a big difference when using them in AE but maybe then again that's my output. Would you recommend using the Lossless setting when outputting?
Is Media Encoder then better than Compressor when dealing with output?

I did try Magic Bullet for some color tweaks so I'll try those out. Thanks for all the recommendations.


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Walter Soyka
Re: Canon 5D footage advice needed. Do I need to convert to Pro Res or is Raw ok for After Effects
on Sep 3, 2012 at 10:32:04 pm

[Mark Likosky] "Do you recommend Pro-Res 422 to use in AE? I've done that in Compresser but did not notice a big difference when using them in AE but maybe then again that's my output. Would you recommend using the Lossless setting when outputting? "

Right -- converting an H.264 file to ProRes does not increase its quality.

CS4 and below were absolutely horrid at handling H.264 -- you used to get all kinds of weird, glitchy renders. CS5 and above can handle H.264 without transcoding.

If you are going to compress elsewhere, you can output ProRes from AE and use that intermediate to make your H.264 deliverables with a multi-pass encode. This will give you higher output quality (in many cases, but not all) than using AE to compress H.264 deliverables directly.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Brent Dunn
Re: Canon 5D footage advice needed. Do I need to convert to Pro Res or is Raw ok for After Effects
on Sep 4, 2012 at 4:15:35 pm

DSLR's are not the best for keying. That's where your noise is coming from. Converting doesn't matter.

Brent Dunn
Owner / Director / Editor
DunnRight Films
DunnRight Video.com
Video Marketing Toolbox.net

Sony EX-1,
Canon 5D Mark II
Canon 7D
Mac Pro Tower, Quad Core,
with Final Cut Studio

HP i7 Quad laptop
Adobe CS-5 Production Suite





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