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render multiple effects to one layer (trapcode particular)

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Ondrej Hanelrender multiple effects to one layer (trapcode particular)
by on Jul 16, 2012 at 11:46:05 am

Hi guys!
so I have this thing going on - I have two separate instances of particular on two separate layers and I would like to render them both into a single layer.

The target is creating paint splash effect, where I have two very different type of splashes going on (therefor two particular effects with very different settings). In general when you splash a paint onto a canvas it covers everything that is already on there.

That, however, is not possible with two separate layers, the top one will always be on the top (disrgarding Z position, thats just how the AE/particular works). I tried to put two instances of particular on one layer but that does not work (it always renders just the second one).

So I need a way how to output both effects to a single layer so that timewise splashes that are added later always cover those which are already there.

I can work around it by rendering splashes seprately and then composite them by splitting layers and using standard layer stack, I just wondered if there is a way how to output graphical data to a single layer. Also it would be a time saver as this animation is gonna have around 5 minutes.

I have digged around the internet but found nothing.

Thanks for any advice!


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John CuevasRe: render multiple effects to one layer (trapcode particular)
by on Jul 16, 2012 at 1:44:21 pm

Is your paint splash a custom particle? If thats the case you could put multiple paint splashes into your custom particle layer, as each particle is generated they will be layered on top of the previous sprites.

Here's a simple example project I made to illustrate the technique. In my example I changed the emitter to a box emitter with a z dimension of 0 and the emitter velocity to 0.

4406_customspritescs5.5.aep.zip

Johnny Cuevas, Editor
Thinkck.com

"I have not failed 700 times. I have succeeded in proving that those 700 ways will not work. When I have eliminated the ways that will not work, I will find the way that will work."
---THOMAS EDISON on inventing the light bulb.


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Ondrej HanelRe: render multiple effects to one layer (trapcode particular)
by on Jul 16, 2012 at 2:30:15 pm

Hi,
thanks for the answer. However this is not what I need - I have already quite complex setup for each particular instance using custom particles with nested animations - I am not just putting single particles on top of each other, I am emulating paint spill and splash effect (like Jackson Pollosk :). For better understanding I will post a screenshot.


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Darby EdelenRe: render multiple effects to one layer (trapcode particular)
by on Jul 16, 2012 at 2:22:38 pm

The latest versions of Particular include a Transfer Mode dropdown in the Rendering section of the effect. Use "None" on your first instance on a layer. After that you can use "Normal" in your 2nd instance, or another mode to blend the effects as though they were on separate layers.

Note that as with layer stacking, the last effect applied will always be blended "on top" of previous effects. The two particle systems will not interact in 3D.

Darby Edelen


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Ondrej HanelRe: render multiple effects to one layer (trapcode particular)
by on Jul 16, 2012 at 2:28:39 pm

Thanks for the trick... neat! however does not solve my issue.

I kinda need particles to interact in 3D space.... not exactly (the spolashes are all on one surface), but I just need newer splashes to cover older splashes no matter what instance of the effect they come from.


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Walter SoykaRe: render multiple effects to one layer (trapcode particular)
by on Jul 16, 2012 at 4:00:03 pm

[Ondrej Hanel] "I kinda need particles to interact in 3D space.... not exactly (the spolashes are all on one surface), but I just need newer splashes to cover older splashes no matter what instance of the effect they come from."

If you can't keyframe the emitter properties to make the changes you need, you will have to do each splash on a separate layer and composite them manually.

Multiple instances of Particular cannot cooperate, and Particular composites based on 3D location, not emission time.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Ondrej HanelRe: render multiple effects to one layer (trapcode particular)
by on Jul 17, 2012 at 6:30:46 am

Yeah I thought so, I just wanted to avoid that.

Therefor I was wondering if there is any way how to redirect ouput of one layer to another - like a general procedure applicable to anything - let's say something like bitmap data in flash - where you can just read the data and write them somewhere, no matter what it is.

I guess I will have to do some compositing tough. Thanks anyway :)


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Ondrej HanelRe: render multiple effects to one layer (trapcode particular)
by on Jul 16, 2012 at 2:39:59 pm

So here is the image:



- I have one system for spill paint (black and white) - using combination of keyframes and wiggle expressions to give it sort of a freehand spilly look. These are basic trapcode spheres.

- another system uses 30 different splash brushes as seprate particles each one of the with simple choker effect animation to emulate the paint spill when the splas appears.

- also third system is used for little black/white splashes (I totally forgot about that, but I dont think it makes any difference now)


So the obvious problem is that the spill paint (black/white) is always on top of splash paint (brown). I can't use just one effect (as I use in black/white spill - just changing the color) as the setup is very different for black&white / brown (and it is impossible e.g. to switch particle type and texture layer by keyframes).

I hope I am making more sense now.


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Darby EdelenRe: render multiple effects to one layer (trapcode particular)
by on Jul 16, 2012 at 8:28:41 pm

Everything you're saying makes sense but you still have to work within the limitations imposed by After Effects and Particular.

The only way to make a splash appear above another is to either layer it on top of the previous splash or use standard AE masking/matting techniques.

Darby Edelen


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Ondrej HanelRe: render multiple effects to one layer (trapcode particular)
by on Jul 17, 2012 at 6:31:03 am

I kinda thought so, just hoped that there is some trick I have been missing. Thanks anyway :)


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