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How would you go about producing this animation?

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Olly LawerHow would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 8, 2011 at 10:04:17 pm

I can think of a few ways, but not to prejudge what others think, what way would you go about it?







Kind regards,

Olly Lawer


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Angelo LorenzoRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 8, 2011 at 10:15:20 pm

Green screen with glass or acrylic laid on top. Green dry-erase marker. The actor adlibs the drawing to an already animated sequence of hand drawn images and computer drawn text and strokes. The actor's hand is then keyed and overlaid with the animation. Done deal.


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Olly LawerRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 8, 2011 at 10:23:12 pm

[Angelo Lorenzo] "Green screen with glass or acrylic laid on top. Green dry-erase marker. The actor adlibs the drawing to an already animated sequence of hand drawn images and computer drawn text and strokes. The actor's hand is then keyed and overlaid with the animation. Done deal."

OK. So just to be clear about it then.

1. When the hand comes in to adlib, won't that create a shadow, thus complicating the keying of the green?

2. You think all the images AND text are animated and not drawn?

3. Where the image seems to be 'drawn' you think shots (I guess high quality images taken on a high end still camera) where taken at various points of the drawing (without the drawers hand obviously) and then these inserted into the time-line in sequence until the drawing is complete?

4. The adlib hand is then matched to make it look like it is drawing it?

Sorry for all the questions!

Olly Lawer


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Kevin CampRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 8, 2011 at 10:39:33 pm

get a big white board, higher an illustrator and set up a digital still camera to shoot time-lapse.

then in post, zoom and pan as needed to keep the action in frame.

and at some point before the shoot, plan, plan, plan....

Kevin Camp
Senior Designer
KCPQ, KMYQ & KRCW


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Olly LawerRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 8, 2011 at 10:42:24 pm

[Kevin Camp] "get a big white board, higher an illustrator and set up a digital still camera to shoot time-lapse.

then in post, zoom and pan as needed to keep the action in frame."


This is what I was thinking to be honest, but the hand drawing would need to be adlib wouldn't it - otherwise the drawing wouldn't come across smooth like it does on this animation?

Olly Lawer


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Kevin CampRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 8, 2011 at 10:52:06 pm

with strong lighting and maybe clipping the highlights in post, i think you could get away with a light pencil sketch and have minimal masking out to do in post.

you'd also need to keep watching to make sure the artist keeps his/her head back....

Kevin Camp
Senior Designer
KCPQ, KMYQ & KRCW


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Mike MoonRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Jul 20, 2012 at 3:16:34 pm

Came across this just recently and was hoping someone else had something better than what I had planned. I haven't done this but thought of it too late and wished I did.

First we used non-reflective glass over green. However, we had some trouble with the refraction and the shadow doubling effect the glass gave. So we finally went with acetate over green. It was ok but the shadow the hand left was pretty harsh. Also it didn't key well and I'll tell you why.

With all green screen shooting, you want to make sure your subject is as far from the green as you can so you don't get as much spill and you can blast the green with light. Also no shadows. If we use this same concept to the hand drawings, it only makes sense that the artist should be drawing on a non-reflective glass table with the green on the floor. I imagine the table should be fairly large. I haven't exactly tried this yet but I'm betting everything that it would work perfectly.


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Dave LaRondeRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 8, 2011 at 10:43:36 pm

[Olly Lawer] "1. When the hand comes in to adlib, won't that create a shadow, thus complicating the keying of the green?"

Not if you build a rig above the chroma key background that holds the clear panel firmly in place. You'd also have to think about reflections of he hand. Excellent lighting, testing and a bit of rotoscoping are all key. I don't know if it's necessary to have a green marker.




[Olly Lawer] "2. You think all the images AND text are animated and not drawn?"

Yes. You'll note that in several places, the material being "drawn" on magically changes color although the marker keeps drawing.





[Olly Lawer] "3. Where the image seems to be 'drawn' you think shots (I guess high quality images taken on a high end still camera) where taken at various points of the drawing (without the drawers hand obviously) and then these inserted into the time-line in sequence until the drawing is complete?"

Or a meticulously-prepared series of Illustrator layers, where revealing the visible portions is animated. That's an extremely consistent-looking white background, which leads me to believe it's just that: a background, and not paper.





[Olly Lawer] "4. The adlib hand is then matched to make it look like it is drawing it?"

Yes. You'll notice the hand leaves the shot before the illustration ever moves. That way, it's easier to position the hand on the shot. Each chroma key shot is a prescribed action, no doubt rehearsed a time or two. Or ten. Perhaps even with the aid of the actual graphic being onion-skinned over the chroma key shot in a monitor to aid the director & talent. I doubt this was done just by rolling a camera and hoping for the best.

Kevin sums it up nicely: plan, plan, plan.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Olly LawerRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 9, 2011 at 12:23:04 am

[Dave LaRonde] "[Olly Lawer] "1. When the hand comes in to adlib, won't that create a shadow, thus complicating the keying of the green?"

Not if you build a rig above the chroma key background that holds the clear panel firmly in place. You'd also have to think about reflections of he hand. Excellent lighting, testing and a bit of rotoscoping are all key. I don't know if it's necessary to have a green marker.




[Olly Lawer] "2. You think all the images AND text are animated and not drawn?"

Yes. You'll note that in several places, the material being "drawn" on magically changes color although the marker keeps drawing.





[Olly Lawer] "3. Where the image seems to be 'drawn' you think shots (I guess high quality images taken on a high end still camera) where taken at various points of the drawing (without the drawers hand obviously) and then these inserted into the time-line in sequence until the drawing is complete?"

Or a meticulously-prepared series of Illustrator layers, where revealing the visible portions is animated. That's an extremely consistent-looking white background, which leads me to believe it's just that: a background, and not paper.





[Olly Lawer] "4. The adlib hand is then matched to make it look like it is drawing it?"

Yes. You'll notice the hand leaves the shot before the illustration ever moves. That way, it's easier to position the hand on the shot. Each chroma key shot is a prescribed action, no doubt rehearsed a time or two. Or ten. Perhaps even with the aid of the actual graphic being onion-skinned over the chroma key shot in a monitor to aid the director & talent. I doubt this was done just by rolling a camera and hoping for the best."


Sorry - just saw this - thanks. I think I get it now :)

Olly Lawer


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Olly LawerRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 9, 2011 at 12:25:11 am

On a note of price.

If one of you were to produce this for me, what would be the cost and what would you need from me?

Kind regards,

Olly Lawer


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Walter SoykaRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 9, 2011 at 2:28:59 pm

You can do it with a couple weeks of planning and a day or two of shooting if you hire the right talent [link].

Here's a good thread we did on this topic a couple months ago with some other alternative approaches:

http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/2/1001563

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Olly LawerRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 8, 2011 at 10:24:52 pm

PS - How long would it take to produce something like this?

Olly Lawer


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Angelo LorenzoRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 8, 2011 at 10:56:57 pm

Dave swooped in and clarified my answers.

How long would it take to produce something like this? I would say it'd take an artist and a digital editor about 3-4 weeks for something of this length. In my mind this encompasses dealing with a client so some time will be spent doing a few versions of rough edits/previsualization and so forth.

I guess I should say I've cheated a little bit. I bid a job for a perspective client who wanted the exact same thing about 8 weeks ago.


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Olly LawerRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 8, 2011 at 11:05:51 pm

Cool.

I'm still not entirely convinced I know how to achieve this. But I will mull it over - it is late :)

I get that you can take a series of still of the drawing as it is completed and zoom in. Easy.

Then when you add in the hand for the adlib, you need to match that up with the sequence of stills you are going to use when 'drawing' the object. So if, lets say a character for example, is animated from the stills into 4, 1. the left leg, 2. left leg + torso and left arm, 3. left leg + torso, left arm and head, 4. left leg + torso, left arm, head and right arm and leg. So the adlib hand needs to draw in THAT sequence, otherwise the hand/pen won't follow the sequence of stills - right?

Now, if I stencilled out the drawing on a white board and lit it well so you couldn't see it, it would be easy for the hand to come in and adlib in that sequence, but I would have to key out the hand manually. So the only way to do that would be to use a green screen, with glass on top and already have the drawing stenciled out in green pen which the hand adlibs. So then I can just key out all the green and place the sequenced still images below it - right?!

Olly Lawer


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Olly LawerRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 13, 2011 at 12:22:40 pm

Hi,

I would very much like to progress this idea.

There was a post here from Walter Soyka with a link to helping me find the right talent for the job, but I guess it was deleted for some reason?

Walter, if you read this can you email or direct message me instead if it breaks the rules of the forum to post it here.

Kind regards,

Olly Lawer


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Walter SoykaRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 15, 2011 at 3:10:31 pm

It's still here:

http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/2/1011097#1011131

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Olly LawerRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Dec 30, 2011 at 6:20:42 pm

Hi,

OK, so my test hasn't gone as well as I hoped!

I recorded a 2 minute voice over and then separated that into segments. I used an A2 white board in a studio with 4 Lowell Tota lamps with softboxes. I over exposed a little using F Stop 4. I started with white balance 2900k, but decided to change it to 3700k. This was a mistake as it change the animation to a yellowish background.

There were 7 segments and after each one I rubbed the board clean and started again for a new segment.

In FCP, I speeded up the drawings (I called them drawings, but I am no artist!) to fit the voiceover. All fine so far apart from the white balance error.

Then I created 7 new sequences and rendered out a QT file for each along with a still image for the last frame of each segment.

In AE, I laid out all the 7 files one after the other and placed the stills after the mov's so the last segment will stay on screen. I also masked each pre-comp and jigsawed the footage all together so I could animate the camera to go from one to the next and eye dropped the background to the white board.

However, although I can zoom in somewhat, I get two main issues:

- Slightly different shades between drawings, although no settings were changed and camera was locked off.
- When my hand comes in to draw, the shadow creates a nasty contrast from the other segments

To solve these problems I could possibly:

- Colour correct to make sure they are similar shades enough for people not to notice
- Shoot without the softboxes and try and minimise shadow even more

BUT - even with these things, I cannot see how it will get close to the animation I put in this post.

Here are some pics for clarity. Any help, much appreciated.





Olly Lawer


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Olly LawerRe: How would you go about producing this animation?
by on Jan 2, 2012 at 9:06:52 pm

Ah, thanks for that thread link Walter - looks good to see some other ways of doing it.

I've posted in that thread to see if Amanda picks up the thread and lets me know how hers went. Seems she was having a lot more success then me.

So i'm thinking I change my approach completely and go with this instead:

I'm thinking:
1. Draw the whole thing. Take a high resolution picture (still SLR camera).
2. Animate a hand doing some motions over an evenly lit green screen (tho not sure wether to draw a faint version of the drawing in green pen first or just some strokes)
3. Animate the drawing appearing using an animated mask
4. Animate the hand over the animation, possibly using a Write-On effect?

Does that sound feasible?

Olly Lawer


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