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25fps comp render to 24fps for NTSC blu-ray

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John Jarvis25fps comp render to 24fps for NTSC blu-ray
by on Aug 12, 2011 at 1:50:28 pm

Hi Folks,

I just can't seem to get a clear answer on this.

I need to create an NTSC Blu-Ray @ 24fps in Encore (to be played worldwide hence NTSC).

I have a comp in AE that is 25fps and has 25fps tiff renders from 3d. I also have voice over audio.

All I wish to do is render this out at 24fps with no loss in quality or frame rate judder.

I dont mind if the audio changes pitch slightly.

Do I simply just set the render settings to 24fps?

Thanks


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Kevin CampRe: 25fps comp render to 24fps for NTSC blu-ray
by on Aug 12, 2011 at 2:19:01 pm

this should cover it pretty well:

http://help.adobe.com/en_US/aftereffects/cs/using/WS8856A169-709B-443e-8E7A...

you'll want the step that preserves audio timing, and you won't need to set the render setting to render with fields and add a 3:2 pulldown (you'll just keep it at 23.976 progressive).

Kevin Camp
Senior Designer
KCPQ, KMYQ & KRCW


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John JarvisRe: 25fps comp render to 24fps for NTSC blu-ray
by on Aug 12, 2011 at 2:38:08 pm

Thanks Kevin.

That's interesting. I found that link but wasnt sure if the same applied to blu-ray, as people are saying that blu-ray is strictly 24fps.

Seeing as my source comp is progressive do I definately not need to set the fields and pull down?

I just rendered a load of PAL 720p videos in this way with fields ready for a NTSC DVD. Was the the wrong thing to do?

Thanks for your help.


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John JarvisRe: 25fps comp render to 24fps for NTSC blu-ray
by on Aug 12, 2011 at 2:51:00 pm

I also forgot to mention the comp in question is 1920x1080 progressive.


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Kevin CampRe: 25fps comp render to 24fps for NTSC blu-ray
by on Aug 12, 2011 at 3:25:17 pm

[John Jarvis] "as people are saying that blu-ray is strictly 24fps."

i'm pretty sure that bluray's 24p is still actually 23.976fps... i think it has to, due to the ntsc standard of 29.97fps, otherwise there would be a huge mess.

also, bluray supports 29.97i (or 59.94i, however you wan't to look at it) and 59.94p (for 720p).


[John Jarvis] "Seeing as my source comp is progressive do I definately not need to set the fields and pull down?"

if your destination supports progressive (and both bluray and dvd support 24p) then you wouldn't need to have ae render fields with a pulldown. however, since both support 30i, then it should still work if it did have a pulldown.


[John Jarvis] "the comp in question is 1920x1080 progressive."

sorry, i missed that you were asking about bluray... but the same basic time adjustment would work, you just don't need to use the dv presets, you'd use a 1080 frame size, but i'm nearly positive that the frame rate should be 23.976fps for 24p.

Kevin Camp
Senior Designer
KCPQ, KMYQ & KRCW


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John JarvisRe: 25fps comp render to 24fps for NTSC blu-ray
by on Aug 12, 2011 at 3:42:06 pm

Fantastic response Kevin - very very clear. Thanks for your help.

I'll bring the videos with the pull down into encore and see how it looks. If it looks dodgy i'll rerender without pulldown. It's annoying that I did use pull down, as they are taking a lot longer to render and they are about 5 mins each!

Thanks again.


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Kevin CampRe: 25fps comp render to 24fps for NTSC blu-ray
by on Aug 12, 2011 at 3:54:26 pm

glad to help... also, here's a link to a table that has the actual frame rates for bluray... i assume that this is accurate -- i hate the web for this reason, but it looks official and i supports my feeling that bluray still has to abide by ntsc standard frame rates (scroll down it just a bit):

http://www.hughsnews.ca/faqs/authoritative-blu-ray-disc-bd-faq/4-physical-l...

Kevin Camp
Senior Designer
KCPQ, KMYQ & KRCW


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Dave LaRondeRe: 25fps comp render to 24fps for NTSC blu-ray
by on Aug 12, 2011 at 3:57:42 pm

[John Jarvis] "If it looks dodgy i'll rerender without pulldown."

That's not how it's done: if you remove pulldown in AE, you do it in the interpret footage settings:
http://help.adobe.com/en_US/aftereffects/cs/using/WS3878526689cb91655866c11...
The only surefire way to remove the pulldown is on individual clips and not on an edited piece. An edited piece will almost certainly have clips whose in points start at different points in the 3:2 pulldown pattern.

Pulldown is almost ALWAYS removed before editing:
http://help.adobe.com/en_US/premierepro/cs/using/WS83633FE1-9FF0-48a2-A7B1-...

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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John JarvisRe: 25fps comp render to 24fps for NTSC blu-ray
by on Aug 12, 2011 at 4:50:15 pm

Sorry I think you misunderstood - I just meant if the pull down doesn't look write when I bring it into encore I will just rerender out of after effects as progressive. It's a 3d render so has always been progressive.


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Dave LaRondeRe: 25fps comp render to 24fps for NTSC blu-ray
by on Aug 12, 2011 at 6:05:09 pm

You're right: I did misunderstand.

To save yourself all sorts of grief, you can conform the image sequence to 23.976 and work in a 23.976 comp. NO ONE will be able to tell the 1 frame/sec difference. But it would most certainly be visible by putting 25fps footage in a 23.976 comp.

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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John JarvisRe: 25fps comp render to 24fps for NTSC blu-ray
by on Aug 12, 2011 at 6:42:34 pm

Thanks for the reply.

That would be best, unfortunately it's a very complex composite and took many weeks to produce so wouldn't fancy adjusting the actual comp. I will go for the standard retime option as you mentioned and live with the audio pitch change.

Thanks for your help.


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