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Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.

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Bronwyn Harvey
Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.
on Jan 6, 2015 at 7:23:47 pm

Hello All,

Again - not an uncommon question on compression techniques from DSLR to FCP to VIMEO.
My exports from FCP seem to be a bit more degraded than other peoples on Vimeo and I'm not sure what's potting here.
I have searched everywhere and am not a newbie to Editing but I'm worried I'm missing something.
The footage doesn't look terrible - It just doesn't look as slick as other films that come out of 5D cameras.

Here is my workflow - Can anyone spot anything amiss?

Footage shot on DSLR 5D. 1920x1080. 25fps

I convert the footage using MpegStreamclip and these settings:



Then I edit this footage on an FCP timeline with these settings:


It's worth noting here that I had to change the Field dominance to "None" as Final Cut was reading the footage as Interlaced and marking it as Upper(Odd) Apparently it does this (randomly assigns progressive footage as interlaced)
This change I also did in the browser to each clip. So the sequence is now seen as progressive again.

Then I export from the sequence using Quicktime (current settings)

I do a batch export in Compressor using these settings:
UNDER ENCODER:
File Extension: mov
Estimated size: 9.22 GB/hour of source
Segmentation on cluster disabled
Audio Encoder
AAC, Stereo (L R), 48.000 kHz
Video Encoder
Format: QT
Width: (100% of source)
Height: (100% of source)
Selected: 1920 x 1080
Pixel aspect ratio: Square
Crop: None
Padding: Preserve source aspect ratio
(L: 0, T: 0, R: 0, B: 0)
Frame rate: 25
Frame Controls On:
Retiming: (Better) Motion Compensated
Resize Filter: Statistical Prediction
Deinterlace Filter: Best (Motion Compensated)
Adaptive Details: On
Antialias: 0
Detail Level: 0
Field Output: Same as Source
Codec Type: H.264
Multi-pass: On, frame reorder: On
Pixel depth: 24
Spatial quality: 75
Min. Spatial quality: 25
Temporal quality: 50
Min. temporal quality: 25
Average data rate: 20.48 (Mbps)

And under Frame Controls in Compressor:



So if anyone fancies digging into that - perhaps someone somewhere will spot something! I hope so,

Thanks in advance...

Bronwyn


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Dave LaRonde
Re: Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.
on Jan 6, 2015 at 9:28:29 pm

Are you lighting your subjects, or using available light?
Are you color correcting and grading your completed edit?

Dave LaRonde
Promotion Producer
KGAN (CBS) & KFXA (Fox) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Bronwyn Harvey
Re: Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.
on Jan 6, 2015 at 9:54:57 pm

Hi Dave,

Thanks for responding.
The Cameraman is using available light and most of the shots are outdoors. Big Skies and buildings.

Yes I have graded the shots in Final Cut Pro. I haven't gone mad with the saturation or blacks or anything.

Stills seems like there's loss of information...


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Shane Ross
Re: Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.
on Jan 6, 2015 at 11:26:17 pm

Vimeo re-encodes anything you upload...so your compression is recompressed, by them.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Warren Eig
Re: Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.
on Jan 7, 2015 at 6:29:13 pm

Go to the App store and download the free utility 5DtoRGB this will solve all of your problems. If you want to do batch transcode to ProRes there is a paid version called 5DtoRGB Batch.

Warren Eig
O 310-470-0905


email: warren@babyboompictures.com
website: http://www.BabyBoomPictures.com


REEL: http://www.babyboompictures.com/BabyBoomPictures/Reels.html


For Camera Accessories - Monitors and Batteries
website: http://www.EigRig.com



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Bronwyn Harvey
Re: Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.
on Jan 7, 2015 at 11:07:08 pm

Thanks guys - Shane - This is even before I upload to Vimeo.

Hey Warren. Ok great thanks. So If I had to re-convert all the footage I have using this app and then relinked the timeline to that - in theory that should work?

What difference does this app make? What makes it special?


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Warren Eig
Re: Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.
on Jan 8, 2015 at 8:05:10 am

[Bronwyn Harvey] "Hey Warren. Ok great thanks. So If I had to re-convert all the footage I have using this app and then relinked the timeline to that - in theory that should work?

What difference does this app make? What makes it special?"


I'd recommend trying the free version and see the results for yourself. I would image if all the reel names and assets are the same name they should relink.

Again, it's free for the version that doesn't batch. Give it a try.

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/5dtorgb-lite/id502347425?mt=12

Warren Eig
O 310-470-0905


email: warren@babyboompictures.com
website: http://www.BabyBoomPictures.com


REEL: http://www.babyboompictures.com/BabyBoomPictures/Reels.html


For Camera Accessories - Monitors and Batteries
website: http://www.EigRig.com



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Nick Meyers
Re: Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.
on Jan 8, 2015 at 2:49:19 am

Warren:

how is this better than other solutions: MPeg Streamclip, or FCP itself?

Bronwyn:
as you are not changing the frame size or frame rate you don't need to use the frame controls.
not sure that will solve your particular issue.

Shane:
are you saying it's best to just upload an uncompressed version?
i thought (or hopped, perhaps?) that if one hit the Vimeo settings sweet-spot they did not re-encode


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Shane Ross
Re: Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.
on Jan 8, 2015 at 5:02:51 am

[Nick Meyers] "Shane:
are you saying it's best to just upload an uncompressed version?
i thought (or hopped, perhaps?) that if one hit the Vimeo settings sweet-spot they did not re-encode"


I've used the VIMEO presets in Adobe Media Encoder...and in Sorenson Squeeze...and Vimeo still "processes" the video. YouTUbe too...even when you use their exact specs to encode.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Warren Eig
Re: Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.
on Jan 8, 2015 at 8:03:22 am

[Nick Meyers] "Warren:

how is this better than other solutions: MPeg Streamclip, or FCP itself?
"


From doing comparative tests, the result look better with 5DtoRGB.

Warren Eig
O 310-470-0905


email: warren@babyboompictures.com
website: http://www.BabyBoomPictures.com


REEL: http://www.babyboompictures.com/BabyBoomPictures/Reels.html


For Camera Accessories - Monitors and Batteries
website: http://www.EigRig.com



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Bronwyn Harvey
Re: Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.
on Jan 8, 2015 at 10:45:27 am

Thanks Guys,

I have downloaded and will try.
With the settings in 5d to RGB - Which Decoding matrix do I use?
And should I change anything for gamma correction?

Also I am now thinking of changing to Premiere Pro for the upcoming edits.As Premiere can edit h.264 natively - Is it worth me converting using this software first and then bringing it in? Or better to just plonk it on the timeline?

Thanks for all the help!


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Warren Eig
Re: Canon 5D to FCP to Vimeo workflow - Still degraded after so many tries.
on Jan 8, 2015 at 6:05:37 pm

[Bronwyn Harvey] "With the settings in 5d to RGB - Which Decoding matrix do I use?"

If shooting HD REC 709, unless you shot flat then try RAW.

Do a test and compare.

Warren Eig
O 310-470-0905


email: warren@babyboompictures.com
website: http://www.BabyBoomPictures.com


REEL: http://www.babyboompictures.com/BabyBoomPictures/Reels.html


For Camera Accessories - Monitors and Batteries
website: http://www.EigRig.com



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