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Mixed frame rates and resolutions

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Zacharie Saugres
Mixed frame rates and resolutions
on Oct 28, 2014 at 10:01:27 pm

Hello,

After being an enthusiastic reader of this site, I seek advice like others before me : I want to edit my first project, in Final Cut Pro 7 (because I use a late 2006 MacBook Pro under OS 10.6.8).

I have 2 different sources :
- one shot with an iPhone (1280 x 720) apparently at 23,984 fps, progressive (that's what MpegStreamclip says)
- the other with a AVCHD camera (1920 x 1080) at 25 fps, interlaced.

I guess I should first convert both sequences (to Apple ProRes or AIC) so they have the same resolution and framerate ?

I'll have to make a decision also if the whole project will be 1280x720 or 1920x1080. I'd say that the best would be to edit in 1920x1080 (progressive?), and when the project is finished it can be exported at 720 for web-publishing.

Any hints to a Final Cut newbie welcome (last time I did video editing, it was with tapes, live mixing desk, pre-roll etc !). The main question is how to make these different frame rates look good in the end, and in sync with the soundtrack that has been been recorded separately (on Audio CD, that's a concert).

I know it is possible to work with low-resolution videos (ProRes Proxy) before 'rendering' the project with the original material, I guess it would help my old computer. I mention it in case it changes the workflow you can advise me to follow.
Many thanks !


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Shane Ross
Re: Mixed frame rates and resolutions
on Oct 28, 2014 at 11:40:41 pm

[Zacharie Saugres] "I guess I should first convert both sequences (to Apple ProRes or AIC) so they have the same resolution and framerate ?"

Yes. PRORES...not AIC. AIC is lossy, a noisy codec. ProRes is best. Frame size doesn't need to match, you can mix that fine. But codec and frame rate need to match.

[Zacharie Saugres] "I'll have to make a decision also if the whole project will be 1280x720 or 1920x1080. I'd say that the best would be to edit in 1920x1080 (progressive?), and when the project is finished it can be exported at 720 for web-publishing."

If you are going to deliver 720p...why not edit 720p? Best to do that, than upconvert 720p to 1080p...then bring it back down to 720p. Just stick with 720p.

[Zacharie Saugres] "The main question is how to make these different frame rates look good in the end,"

The PAL footage...in Compressor, in the inspector...FRAME CONTROLS...turn that on, and set everything to BEST. And be prepared to wait a long long time for it to compress. Don't use MPEG Streamclip...use Compressor.

[Zacharie Saugres] "and in sync with the soundtrack that has been been recorded separately (on Audio CD, that's a concert)."

Please tell me it was recorded 48.1...if it's on a CD, guessing not...guessing 44.1. Convert to 48.1Khz...and hope it syncs.

[Zacharie Saugres] "I know it is possible to work with low-resolution videos (ProRes Proxy) before 'rendering' the project with the original material, I guess it would help my old computer. I mention it in case it changes the workflow you can advise me to follow."

DOn't do this. Unless you are working with camera masters that are professional tapeless masters, that you can use LOG AND TRANSFER to import the footage...don't do this. Your sources are going to be converted with Compressor...do not do the offline/online workflow when you do this. It's nothing but a big mess...and that's when you are highly skilled at what you do. New novice? Impossible.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Zacharie Saugres
Re: Mixed frame rates and resolutions
on Oct 29, 2014 at 12:24:49 am

Dear Shane,
thanks for your very informative comments, I feel I look in the right direction, thank you ! (also for telling me that the offline/online workflow isn't for me!)

I'm converting my iPhone rushes as described here :
http://www.edhart.me/2012/05/how-to-import-an-iphone-video-into-final-cut-p... (using the ProRes HQ codec), for the people who would read this page after a Google search.

[Shane] "Frame size doesn't need to match, you can mix that fine". OK, great, that means I leave the 1080 footage as is, and won't upscale my 720p shots before editing. Thus, I could deliver 720p in the end, OR / AND 1080 for a higher resolution finished product.

But, VideoSpec tells me that my AVCHD (1080) footage is interlaced > should I put it "as is" in FCP, or should I deinterlace it first using compressor (>25p) ?

And, you seem worried, but yes my master audio recording is 44,1 khz...


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Shane Ross
Re: Mixed frame rates and resolutions
on Oct 29, 2014 at 3:26:31 pm

[Zacharie Saugres] "I'm converting my iPhone rushes as described here :
http://www.edhart.me/2012/05/how-to-import-an-iphone-video-into-final-cut-p..... (using the ProRes HQ codec), for the people who would read this page after a Google search."


ProRes HQ is overkill for iPhone video. It's meant for high end camera formats...10 bit camera formats...liek RED, ALEXA, F55. The only thing you gain using HQ over ProRes 422 is file size. 50% larger files. Use ProRes 422...heck, this is for the web, use ProRes LT even.

[Zacharie Saugres] "But, VideoSpec tells me that my AVCHD (1080) footage is interlaced > should I put it "as is" in FCP, or should I deinterlace it first using compressor (>25p) ?"

Deinterlace it when you convert it. The web doesn't display interlacing properly...only TVs do.

[Zacharie Saugres] "And, you seem worried, but yes my master audio recording is 44,1 khz..."

Convert it to 48Khz and hope it syncs.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Zacharie Saugres
Re: Mixed frame rates and resolutions
on Oct 29, 2014 at 3:57:36 pm

Thanks Shane !

I found this quote from the manual :
“Selecting the Deinterlace setting causes the frame rate of the selected clips to double. For example, if the original interlaced clips have a frame rate of 29.97 fps, the deinterlaced clips will have a frame rate of 59.94 fps.”
So when I prepare my 1920x1080 25fps (interlaced) in Compressor, I should obtain 50p as a result, shouldn't I ?

> Then, that means my project settings should be 1920x1080 50p , not 25p, and that the second set of rushes (the iPhone video originally at 23,984 / 24 fps) should be converted to 50p as well, rather than 25 as I thought, right ?

thanks for your always informative answers !


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Shane Ross
Re: Mixed frame rates and resolutions
on Oct 29, 2014 at 6:10:22 pm

What? The COMPRESSOR manual says that? I've never had that happen. In the Frame Controls, choose DEINTERLACE, in other controls, make sure your frame rate is 23.98...not 29.97 because you are mixing this with 23.98. FCP doesn't mix frame rates well...you need to convert with Compressor. If you choose the frame rate, and deinterlace...no frame doubling will happen

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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