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Using Plural Eyes the right way

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Sascha Engel
Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 2, 2013 at 12:29:39 pm

Hallo Everybody,

first of all a Happy New Year to all of you!
I have a Q regarding the software Plural Eyes. I just shot a movie in the states (DP) of which I am also the editor.
We shot on a Mark lll and recorded the sound separately on an AUDIO DEVICES recorder, so I have hundres of MOV Video and WAV sound files.
Even though I am very good at syncing, I do not wanna do this to myself manually, so I want to give Plural Eyes a shot.

What would be the best way to do it? Edit the movie with on board sound first, then put the sound files of the Sound Man in the time line? Will it be able to match, even though in the Sequence I just use bits of the the full clip? Or better to sync up first all footage from the browser? And if that's the way, how to techically do that?
Thanx for any advice!
I am dealing with about 900 clips, shot with Mark lll, Panasonic TM900 & a Sony MiniHD Cam. The footage I first transcoded with Log & Transfer Tool.


Thanx.

Sascha


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Roli Rivelino
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 3, 2013 at 8:06:13 pm

As long as you have corresponding timecodes Plural Eyes sorts it, so edit with onboard first and then get Plural to do its magic. Test it with a couple of random minutes first just to make sure.

http://www.rolirivelino.com/

System
Mac Pro 2.8Gb quad core
8Gb RAM
1x 320Gb 7200 hardrive
1x 1Tb 7200 hardrive
Nvidia Geforce 8800 512mb Graphics card
1x 1Tb external WD 'My Book' eSata

Equipment
Panasonic AG-HVX 200
Firestore FS-100


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Sascha Engel
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 5, 2013 at 9:08:09 pm

Hi Roli,

can I ask you for a more detailed explanation?
What do you mean by corresponding Time Codes? I Have a slate and clap before each take, but the Audio recorder and the Mark lll had no synced Time Codes.
So you would edit with the onboard sound, and then throw the right sound clips in the rough are of the Video and let PE sync it then?
I am not sure, I fully understood your workflow.

Thanx if you could elaborate more.


Sascha


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Andrew Drachman
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 7, 2013 at 6:43:44 pm

Hi Sascha,

I have used PluralEyes for every project I've edited that needed to have the audio recorded externally. I've found the best way to use the correct audio is to sync everything up beforehand, and edit using the better audio already synced.

It may take some time to sync a lot of footage, but I think it would ultimately take less time than syncing the audio post-edit (especially if your are jumping back and forth chronologically).

Andrew


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Roli Rivelino
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 7, 2013 at 7:09:37 pm

Hi Sorry for the delay Sacha, have been away. I think my answer is now defunct anyway as Andrew has more experience with it than me. I just used it once for a short project; I'd go with his answer.
+

http://www.rolirivelino.com/

System
Mac Pro 2.8Gb quad core
8Gb RAM
1x 320Gb 7200 hardrive
1x 1Tb 7200 hardrive
Nvidia Geforce 8800 512mb Graphics card
1x 1Tb external WD 'My Book' eSata

Equipment
Panasonic AG-HVX 200
Firestore FS-100


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Sascha Engel
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 7, 2013 at 8:16:00 pm

Can you explain, in a step by step way, how to connect all the master clips with the WAV files and also how I could safe & merge those as one clip then - if it's not too much asked.
Thanx.

Sascha


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Andrew Drachman
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 7, 2013 at 10:07:47 pm

I am unsure what you mean by master clips and not all of my external audio is done in .wav format; so I will describe my syncing process. Also, keeping in mind that the majority of my editing has been done in either Premiere Pro or Final Cut 7, I can't be certain the same steps would work in FCPX (although I can't imagine it would be very different).

1. Import all media that needs to be synced
2. Create a sequence (or project in FCPX) and label it so I know that it is my sequence that will be synced (I put "PRESYNC_PROJECTNAME" to identify my pre-Pluraleyes sequence).
3. Drag all video from one camera angle to the sequence IN CHRONOLOGICAL ORDER. For separate camera angles, you want to use separate tracks. Camera A all goes on video on track 1, camera b all goes on video track 2, etc. Make sure all of the audio from these cameras go on their own separate tracks as well because that is what Pluraleyes uses to sync everything up.
4. Bring the externally recorded audio on to it's own separate track.
5. Export the sequence as an XML to be brought in to Pluraleyes and make sure that the matching sequence is correct.
6. Check off the necessary boxes (Clips are in Chronological Order, Try Really Hard, etc.)
7. Press sync, pull in the synced clip in to your editing program and you should be all set.


In terms of making sure the clips stick together, I either group them within the program or move clips with caution when editing. I like to keep all of my audio tracks (even if I don't plan on using them) and mute them just in case the natural audio is needed.

Andrew


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Sascha Engel
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 8, 2013 at 12:18:25 am

Thanx for your time for the detailed run through.
Another Question: Does that mean, I can also somehow merge them so I have a new "subclip" in the Browser, which is containing the synced Audio clip, so I can use them in different Sequences if needed?

Thanx.

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Andrew Drachman
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 8, 2013 at 2:39:13 am

Not that I know of. I just copy and paste when I want to do that.


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Sascha Engel
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 8, 2013 at 8:36:20 am

But your workflow, needs to make already a decision of shots and putting it roughly into the right order in the TL.
But let's say I have 7 takes from the same scene and I have no idea yet, how I wanna edit it, but I'd like all the master clips in the Browser to be paired, synced and merged with the right audio files, is there a way to do that?

Thanx.

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Andrew Drachman
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 8, 2013 at 4:55:04 pm

Once all of the audio is synced, I duplicate that sequence just for reference. Because I do not know how to create a synced sub clip, I am able to go back to this duplicated sequence when I need to pull something from it.


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Sascha Engel
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 8, 2013 at 6:10:36 pm

Hi Andrew,

just to make sure I got you right: You are putting ALL the clips of your project in a chronological order on the TL, drop all the audio under it, more or less in the right place and then you export this as XML (which I think, you do not have to do, you can just choose the right SEQ from out PE). Once PE synced, you get the result in an own TL Sequence in FCP and then you use this as sort of Browser to work from and pick your clips?
I have more than 700 clips! I do hope, that there is also an easier way. I hoped, you could somehow import all, video & audio, into the Browser of FCP, select all the clips and give a command to PE to sync all of them.
Or is that only my wishful thinking taking over me?

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Andrew Drachman
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 11, 2013 at 3:01:23 pm

Hi Sascha,

Do not worry about lining up the clips before you export the PRESYNC sequence, PE will do that for you.

I do believe you have to export as an xml so you have something to open with PE (at least definitely with premiere pro). Once PE has done the job, you import the synced XML clip back in to your program and open it up as its own sequence. At that point in time, I duplicate the synced sequence (so I always have something to refer back to) and begin editing.

Andrew


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Sascha Engel
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Jan 8, 2013 at 12:20:50 am

..and it was good for FCP 7 - I do not use FCPniX - only Premiere and 7.

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Rob Mitchell
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Aug 22, 2013 at 5:30:50 pm

Hi Sascha,

If I understand your point about merging or 'subclips' correctly. One way is to Link the now-synched rushes with cmd-L or Modify/Link on the Menu in FCP 7. (I don't know about X?)
Select the synched clips on all the relevant tracks. (eg Video+Camera audio+GoodAudio) and press cmd-L or Menu-Modify-Link. Then when you select and manipulate one of the tracks, all will be selected. Thing is tho, you would have to do this one synched set at a time as it were. You can not select loads of clips and Link. I don't think

Another way might be to use the sequence itself for editing. ie. Pull the synched sequence into another (let call it the Master Editing sequence) and edit on the Master sequence using the synched sequence as a clip. Everything will remain in place as it was on the timeline when you bring it in as a clip. I haven't tried using that but it does work in principle. And it may be easier if you have lots of lots of footage rather than linking up all the synched clips individually. No doubt some organisation would be required to make the most of this workflow.

I know this answer is some 8 months after your query but it may help someone else. Be also interesting to know how you got on anyway.
R


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Samuel Enblom
Re: Using Plural Eyes the right way
on Sep 27, 2013 at 8:45:10 am

I just really feel like I need to add a few short things to this thread.

I believe you would get the results your looking for if you also export with "Create merged clips" (You do this in the exporting process of plural eyes.) This will give you two sequences, 1. with audio synced to the video with the original audio contained and 2. A sequence with the video and only the sound from the audio recorder.

As mentioned above, you can link your clips (cmd + L).

What I like to do, to "guard myself up" incase plural eyes screws up (which happens time from time) Is to duplicate the replaced-clips sequences and use it as a station from where I pick up clips. By doing that you can always go back and use the same timeline-timecode to find your original audio.

I hope I made myself clear enough!


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