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Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..

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Esther Casas
Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 12, 2012 at 3:41:02 pm

Hello everybody!!!
So, after doing long research and going through all the forums..I think I tried everything to solve a non-sync problem I have...and still can't figure it out, here is my story:

FCP settings: AppleProRes 422 2048X1152 audio: @24fps (animation project) audio 48KHz 16bit

exported OMF into protools, no problem, everything sync with a 2pop. My sound designer had protools also set up at 24fps. When exporting the final master mix as wav and also aiff (both at 48khz and 16bit (i was told 16 and 32bit will not make a difference, they were 32bit and switch to 16 just in case), the clip progressively is going faster...in the end is out of sync for about 8-10 frames!!!

I tried deleting audio files, then "easy set up" at 24fps (not selecting anything else in format options, quitting FCP and opening again importing audio again...and I also tried to change my setting from non-drop to drop in default timecode..and still same problem.Also tried changing the name of this audio files..nothing.

If someone has more ideas we will really appreciate it! we are on a deadline and can't figure this out!!!
THANK YOU!


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Thomas Alexander
Re: Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 12, 2012 at 4:14:15 pm

Please read this maybe it will help you.

http://forums.creativecow.net/readpost/8/1165599#reply_box


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Esther Casas
Re: Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 12, 2012 at 5:21:50 pm

Thanks Thomas, but this is not the same issue..mine is importing files from protools into FCP, which were exported from FCP...


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David Foster
Re: Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 12, 2012 at 7:31:40 pm

Could this be a 23.976 vs 24 fps problem? A lot of folks say 24p when technically 23.976 is more correct. Possibly a crossed signal here.

Dave


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Thomas Alexander
Re: Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 13, 2012 at 12:19:24 pm

Than there is a pull-up pull-down setting of the sound into the DAW and its ON. This is probably what cause you this and it pulls the sound up or down pitch wise and causes it to drift out of time. The reason the software has this option is for filmmakers to sync the film sync speed to the TV standard speed.

Check out regarding pull-up pull-down option and hopefully that solves your problem.

Thomas Alexander
Independent Cinematographer
Lightman Films
Nicosia Cyprus


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Michael Gissing
Re: Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 14, 2012 at 3:10:50 am

If your original file was tagged as 23.98 and you did the delete, set easy setup to 24 and then reimported the file without changing the file name, FCP will not change the frame rate. You need to get the file with name changed and copy the new file onto the computer. FCP keeps the file name to time code stamp somewhere so you must change then file name on a different computer and reimport.

Also FCP doesn't work properly with 32bit audio. 24 or16 are correct and sample rate should be 48khz for both file and sequence setting.

A quick test to see if you issue is 23.98 versus 24 is to change the audio speed to 100.1%. If it syncs then FCP is not flagging the file as true 24. Alternatively if you need to slow the audio to 99.9% to sync then your audio is correct but your sequence is 23.98.


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Esther Casas
Re: Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 16, 2012 at 6:21:36 pm

Michael! thank you! it worked out slowing down to9.99%, thanks so much!!!
:)
yes, 23.98 vs 24fps...animation world...


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Esther Casas
Re: Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 16, 2012 at 6:32:58 pm

Thomas! thank you,
so solved the problem by slowing down the audio to 99.9%, but out of curiosity... where is the "pull-up pull-down setting of the sound into the DAW" you are talking about? sorry if its abvious but can't find it..

love to see where....
thks again T!


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Thomas Alexander
Re: Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 18, 2012 at 11:02:02 am

Scroll to the bottom of the “Source Sample Rate” dropdown and you will see a category that says “48kHz (Pull Up/Down) Choose the appropriate setting which in this case is “47,952 – 0.1% Down (film to NTSC)”.

Thomas Alexander
Independent Cinematographer
Lightman Films
Nicosia Cyprus


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Esther Casas
Re: Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 18, 2012 at 2:15:09 pm

Thomas, are you talking about doing this in protools? sorry...just making sure..My sound guy has protools but i don't..
thank you!!


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Thomas Alexander
Re: Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 19, 2012 at 6:39:48 pm

Yes! This are settings for pro tools so you don't come across with the same problem again. Let your sound engineer know. He is not a filmaker and you are not a sound engineer so problems like that appear from time to time... ;)

Thomas Alexander
Independent Cinematographer
Lightman Films
Nicosia Cyprus


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Esther Casas
Re: Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 20, 2012 at 1:48:02 pm

I see, thanks T, will let him know!thks for all your help!
:)


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Thomas Alexander
Re: Audio files from FCP to Protools and back to FCP: wav& AIF out of sync!? tried everything..
on Oct 18, 2012 at 11:02:57 am

To do pull ups and pull downs in Pro Tools we use the Sample Rate Conversion (SRC) feature on the import audio window. For our examples we will assume your source and destination are all going to be 48k.

1. Make a new session at the bit depth you are working at. In the session setup window (command – 2 on the number pad) change your frame rate to 24.

2. Open the import Audio Window (shift-command-I) and choose the file you want to pull down.

3. Press the convert button, and check the box that says “Apply SRC” this will enable the “Source Sample Rate” dialogue.

4. Scroll to the bottom of the “Source Sample Rate” dropdown and you will see a category that says “48kHz (Pull Up/Down) Choose the appropriate setting which in this case is “47,952 – 0.1% Down (film to NTSC)”

5. Click Done and it will ask you where to save the file, and then it will import into your session. You know have a file that is 48k, but plays .1% slower than the original.

Thomas Alexander
Independent Cinematographer
Lightman Films
Nicosia Cyprus


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