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digitizing beta - field order?

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Jason Brown
digitizing beta - field order?
on Dec 17, 2010 at 4:02:49 am

Hey Guys,

I'm going to pull in Betacam via MXO2 - curious about the field order setting.

Is the field order determined when you shoot? Or when you digitize?

The camera is an Ikegami HL-45W shot @ 720x486 anamorphic.

I know on an AVID Meridien that I used to work on, the field order was Lower Field First.

-Jason


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: digitizing beta - field order?
on Dec 17, 2010 at 4:11:59 am

All Sd codecs in FCP that are NTSC are lower field first. You capture card should take care of it if you use an easy setup.

jeremy


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Jason Brown
Re: digitizing beta - field order?
on Dec 17, 2010 at 4:17:58 am

sweet...thanks Jeremy!

:)


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Dave LaRonde
Re: digitizing beta - field order?
on Dec 17, 2010 at 5:27:23 am

[Jeremy Garchow] "All SD codecs in FCP that are NTSC are lower field first."

Well, all except 640x480, which was used extensively in Media 100's heyday. That was upper field first.

And it still is upper field first, although I doubt anyone would actually use that resolution any more. Certainly not in FCP, but there are still lots of that particular resolution floating around.

That's the trouble with the "latest and best" in Digital-Land: you never know when you're going to run across something that was the "latest and best" from a bygone era.

Targa Cine YUV, anyone?

Dave LaRonde
Sr. Promotion Producer
KCRG-TV (ABC) Cedar Rapids, IA


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: digitizing beta - field order?
on Dec 17, 2010 at 5:37:55 am

That's why I said in FCP.

640x480 in m100 is hardly the latest/greatest in digital land. If you have a "modern" capture card and are capturing NTSC video in to Fcp using apple codecs, it's going to be LFF. Better?


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Dave LaRonde
Re: digitizing beta - field order?
on Dec 17, 2010 at 6:18:10 am

Okay, tell you what: you're charged with working with digitized footage from the year 1994. What do you do in FCP? It could happen, especially in my line of work. I don't know about yours: perhaps you shoot everything new for each project. I do not.

I still have a great-looking shot of a Heisman Trophy from 1997 about which some longtimer might say, "Hey, don't we have that? We need it right now."

And THAT spells trouble. We are, after all, talking about Beta, the State Of The Art in the eighties. Not to mention 4x3 640x480 upper field-first video in the M100 codec.

Hey, a guy playing for Iowa could burn up the field next season. It could happen.


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: digitizing beta - field order?
on Dec 17, 2010 at 6:37:27 am

Uh. Ok. It's 2011. You would use something like OP is using that would capture to a LFF codec in SD/NTSC

Thats all I'm saying.

640x480 uff does not fit, although I appreciate your reminiscence of the old days.

They are gone. Unless you keep your Quadra around and capture to m100 to edit in FCP?

Come on dude. I know you dont.


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Rafael Amador
Re: digitizing beta - field order?
on Dec 17, 2010 at 9:41:41 am

[Jason Brown] "Is the field order determined when you shoot? Or when you digitize?

The camera is an Ikegami HL-45W shot @ 720x486 anamorphic."


In ALL analog format the "odd" fields are laid first .
So they would be de equivalent of UPPER FIRST.

When you digitize that analog picture, the field order you get, will depend of the Codec you choose.
Being in NTSC, all your capture options are codecs Lower-first: DV, DV50, 8/10b Unc, etc.

In Pal land would be different, with all the DV options Lower first, and all the 8/10b options Upper-first.
rafael

http://www.nagavideo.com


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Jason Brown
Re: digitizing beta - field order?
on Dec 23, 2010 at 2:05:58 pm

Just a thought I had this morning. I've not ever done any "up-converting" of footage with my Matrox. Would this be a good opportunity to do that? It will be coming into the Matrox through SDI and it's 16x9 SD.

Are there quality advantages to upconverting? Or is it a workflow benefit when mixing with HD sources?

-Jason


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