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1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?

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Matt Campbell
1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 8:29:03 pm

I need to downconvert a 1080i29.97, Upper Field first, ProRes file to SD. My plan was to just use Compressor to do this using ProRes and output to 720x480 center cut. Do I need to worry about field order? With the HD 1080 clip being Upper and SD being Lower field first, will Compressor do this field shift properly? Or how should I convert this?

I'm also just learning AE, but again, I'm not sure how to handle the shift from Upper to Lower.

OS 10.6.3, Mac Pro 2 x 2.66 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 16 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 8:34:42 pm

Yes. Make sure the input fields are set to upper when you import the clip to Compressor (click on the thumbnail), then set the output fields to lower in frame controls.

Jeremy


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Matt Campbell
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 8:40:34 pm

Thanks man. Just did one, only a :30 spot so it was quick, and it looks fine except for the logo at the end. It has a small bit of jaggies on on the edges. I've brought that new clip into Compressor and it checks out in the inspector as bottom first. Is Compressor the best way to do this with software, i.e. FCS 3 or will AE do a better job?

I'm also aware hardware is the best way to do this, however, my Intensity Cary does not. I'm still hoping for a Kona or at least a MXO 2.

OS 10.6.3, Mac Pro 2 x 2.66 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 16 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 8:42:34 pm

[Matt Campbell] "Thanks man. Just did one, only a :30 spot so it was quick, and it looks fine except for the logo at the end. It has a small bit of jaggies on on the edges."

On your broadcast monitor?


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Matt Campbell
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 8:47:44 pm

No, sad to say on my computer monitor. Still can't get approved for one of those either. All I have is a ref/client monitor, 40" Sony XBR 1080p TV.

So I'll assume that its okay then. Image is below if u wish to see. I had to cover the logo mostly, to protect the client, but you can see the last 2 letters.



OS 10.6.3, Mac Pro 2 x 2.66 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 16 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Matt Campbell
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 8:49:11 pm

Sorry meant to say, I assume that just the itnerlacing being displayed on a progressive computer monitor. So it should be good on a tube TV or SD broadcast monitor. Sound right?

OS 10.6.3, Mac Pro 2 x 2.66 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 16 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 8:53:23 pm

[Matt Campbell] "Sound right?"

Sure it sounds right, but it's hard to tell without seeing it in motion on a video monitor. If you upload a few second of full res video I can check it for you.

An educated guess would be that it looks good to me.

A really really down and dirty test would be to bring that sd file in to FC and put it on an Sd timeline. Set your viewer to 100% and play it. Despite the interlacing, does the motion seem natural? You did not hear this from me (and neither did you whoever is reading this) as a viable way to check your work without a monitor. Got it? :)

Jeremy


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Matt Campbell
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 9:05:51 pm

I got cha and would never use that as a true method of checking. However, it does look okay to me.

Below should be a snipit of the spot.

sample 1



OS 10.6.3, Mac Pro 2 x 2.66 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 16 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 9:08:09 pm

It's hard to tell from that file as I can't check it on a monitor. I'd need a zipped file with full res (not re-compressed).

Jeremy


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Matt Campbell
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 9:21:59 pm

my bad. try this.

1409_sequence1prores.mov.zip

OS 10.6.3, Mac Pro 2 x 2.66 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 16 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 9:29:53 pm

Yeah, you're all good. If you want to be technically proper, you should make the movie 720x486 for ProRes.

I wanna smore.


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Matt Campbell
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 9:33:31 pm

yeah i thought about that and am actually in the process of changing it now. thx

smore's rule. spot should air soon. keep an eye out for a composite decking spot.

OS 10.6.3, Mac Pro 2 x 2.66 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 16 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 16, 2010 at 9:35:22 pm

[Matt Campbell] "composite decking"

ooo, my favorite!


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KeeTat Tan
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 21, 2010 at 7:35:07 am

I would use none and change the sequence setting to none as well. This will hemp with the supers at the end. The footage should look fine except when there is a horizontal pan, which will look a bit jittery.
Hope this helps


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Matt Campbell
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 21, 2010 at 3:34:37 pm

I've already resolved this but thanks for your reply. question, why would you use none? this is a downconversion to Standard Def 29.97 for broadcast, which is interlaced, lower field first. None would be for a progressive sequence, which neither of these are.

OS 10.6.3, Mac Pro 2 x 2.66 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 16 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 21, 2010 at 3:43:00 pm

No offense, but it's the exact wrong advice.


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David Roth Weiss
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 21, 2010 at 4:59:28 pm

I agree with Jeremy...

BTW Matt, if the spot is reduced in size by 50% or more when it goes on the Web that will essentially deinterlace it.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
http://www.drwfilms.com

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™


A forum host of Creative COW's Business & Marketing and Apple Final Cut Pro forums. Formerly host of the Apple Final Cut Basics, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.


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KeeTat Tan
Re: 1080i29.97 downconvert to SD. Upper to Lower field?
on Dec 27, 2010 at 8:06:28 am

Sorry about that, carelessness on my part. we use none when it's a full graphics so I thought it might work with yours as well.
Panning is still a problem, and we usually add in a motion blur for it.

Cheers


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