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Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!

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Christopher Targia
Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 4:17:55 pm

So, for some time now, if FCP is open for a while sometimes, when I hit play, i just get the infite color spinwheel. I go to force quit FCP and guess what, it doesn't quit, sure the windows may close, and it may ask me to report an error, but the blue light in the dock is still lit, and I cannot relaunch the program. I need to restart my computer. But guess what! That doesn't work either, it looks up during shut down! I need to hard shut down by holding down the power button then restart. I reinstalled FCS AND Mac OSX 10.5 and I am still having this problem, I have no clue what this is, I have also had this problem with other programs on seldom occasion such as Logic Pro 8.

Any help appreciated, I am totally stumped!

Specs-
2 x 2.8GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon (June 2008 Model)
10 GB 800MHz DDR2 FB-DIMM
Mac OSX - 10.5.8

Final Cut Studio 7(current update)


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David Roth Weiss
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 4:44:38 pm

Did you do a ground up reinstall to an empty disk?

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
http://www.drwfilms.com

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™


A forum host of Creative COW's Business & Marketing and Apple Final Cut Pro forums. Formerly host of the Apple Final Cut Basics, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.


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Christopher Targia
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 4:45:59 pm

No, I saw I had the option to keep my files, I figured this was better then backing everything up

================================================
MacPro Octo Core Intel Xenon 2.8Ghz 6GB DDR2 Ram
FCP 7.0.2
-I highly recomend el Gato Turbo264HD-


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David Roth Weiss
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 4:59:42 pm

You also keep all the problem files when doing that.

Get in the habit of making a clone of the old drive first, so you don't lose anything, then installing everything else from the ground up. Make sure you run Apple Software Update over and over until you see the massage that everything is up to date, for the OSm, then install FCS and do the same thing.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
http://www.drwfilms.com

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™


A forum host of Creative COW's Business & Marketing and Apple Final Cut Pro forums. Formerly host of the Apple Final Cut Basics, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.


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Alf Hanna
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 5:14:49 pm

try running disk first aid or disk warrior, which some folks here find useful. But DFA is free, with the os. You might find problems in your OS or your drive. Freezing at shutdown is more likely a problem with your OS or computer hardware than with FCP, I would wager.

And yes, David is right, a mirror of your drive using an external esata drive is how I manage it. I do it weekly. It's one of the better things that Apple does in their OS. Not as easy with Windows.

Alf


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David Roth Weiss
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 5:39:57 pm

[Alf Hanna] "a mirror of your drive using an external esata drive is how I manage it. I do it weekly. It's one of the better things that Apple does in their OS. Not as easy with Windows.
"


There's no doubt about it Alf, the ability to easily and inexpensively (for free) create bootable clones on Apple computers is one of the great properties that puts Macs way ahead of Windows machines.

Microsoft is a software only company that places its concerns about piracy over everything else. Apple knows you have to buy their computers to run their software, so they've adopted much more relaxed anti-piracy measures that make their software better, make cloning easier, and make running multiple boot systems a breeze too.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
http://www.drwfilms.com

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™


A forum host of Creative COW's Business & Marketing and Apple Final Cut Pro forums. Formerly host of the Apple Final Cut Basics, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.


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Andrew Rendell
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 5:23:48 pm

In my experience it's pretty rare for a problem to require reinstalling operating system and software (not exactly unknown, but unusual). More likely is corrupt media files or project. Try creating a new project and importing the media files into that (perhaps do a few at a time and see if there comes a point where you suddenly get a problem) and creating new sequences in the new project, don't copy sequences directly from the old project, copy and paste from the old sequences into the new ones. See how that goes.


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David Roth Weiss
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 5:49:43 pm

[Andrew Rendell] "In my experience it's pretty rare for a problem to require reinstalling operating system and software (not exactly unknown, but unusual)."

I agree with you Andrew. I think I only been forced to reinstall just once or twice since moving over to the Apple side over six years ago. However, some people who are plugin crazy or who download all kinds of freebies off the Internet wind up with many more issues than the rest of us. Having a fresh clone on standby at all times is the sure cure for just about all bad things that come our way, but very few users take the time to do that step, which could literally save their bacon.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
http://www.drwfilms.com

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™


A forum host of Creative COW's Business & Marketing and Apple Final Cut Pro forums. Formerly host of the Apple Final Cut Basics, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.


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Andrew Rendell
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 6:11:54 pm

I agree. I actually use a different computer for downloading stuff and get a bit neurotic over regular backups (by some people's standards).


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 7:11:13 pm

[Christopher Targia] "So, for some time now, if FCP is open for a while sometimes, when I hit play, i just get the infite color spinwheel."

Perhaps your external disk drives have spun down and FCP is waiting for them to catch up when you come back after sitting for a while. What kind of hard drives do you use for your scratch drives?

Make sure to turn that option off in your sys prefs (energy saver) and don't let the hard drives spin down.

Jeremy


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Christopher Targia
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 7:27:17 pm

Mainly I will use 3 eSata drives on a Raid 0 array, (because its fast!) and then back the stuff up at the end of the day, (because 3x chance of drive failure!!). But I know its not waiting for the drive to speed up because I have literally waiting for over an hour and its still waiting.

================================================
MacPro Octo Core Intel Xenon 2.8Ghz 6GB DDR2 Ram
FCP 7.0.2
-I highly recomend el Gato Turbo264HD-


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 7:41:46 pm

[Christopher Targia] "But I know its not waiting for the drive to speed up because I have literally waiting for over an hour and its still waiting."

But if there's a slip up, and FCP gets confused, it might cause a hang. I'd try turning off that option in the Energy Saver and see if ti helps you. FCP is pretty awful at keeping track of what it needs, and if you throw a wrench in the that delicate system...well...then it's busted. It's a quick 10 second suggestion that may or may not help you. I'd turn off your screen savers, too, and never let the computer sleep. Don't tell me your computer sleeps.

Jeremy


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David Roth Weiss
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 7:58:42 pm

It's right in the FCP manual, somewhere. It clearly states that all energy saving settings should be set to "never."

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
http://www.drwfilms.com

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™


A forum host of Creative COW's Business & Marketing and Apple Final Cut Pro forums. Formerly host of the Apple Final Cut Basics, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.


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Christopher Targia
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 9:09:31 pm

The only energy saver I use is putting the display to sleep, I don't put my computer to sleep or spin down hard drives. Thank you for your continued input.

================================================
MacPro Octo Core Intel Xenon 2.8Ghz 6GB DDR2 Ram
FCP 7.0.2
-I highly recomend el Gato Turbo264HD-


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 9:20:16 pm

[Christopher Targia] "The only energy saver I use is putting the display to sleep,"

Never is what the energy saver should be set for. Display or otherwise. See if ti works, if not, then the other advice you have received is solid.

Jeremy


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Christopher Targia
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 6, 2010 at 7:25:21 pm

Thanks for your inputs,

It's not a corrupt files, because it happens on multiples files, and sometimes even multiple programs, but FCP is by FAR the worst, happening multiple times a day! And I also found this problem happens regardless of what scratch disk I used, at first I thought it could have been a problem with my eSata Raid, but even a FW800 single drive got similar crashes.

I will go ahead and back all my crap up and redo everything, anything to stop this is crippling my productivity.

================================================
MacPro Octo Core Intel Xenon 2.8Ghz 6GB DDR2 Ram
FCP 7.0.2
-I highly recomend el Gato Turbo264HD-


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Phillip Van West
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 7, 2010 at 12:24:30 am

Have you done anything to check your RAM? TechToolPro will do this, but I don't know of any included utility that does...just a thought.

pvw

Phil Van West
Terra Nova Productions
Denver, CO
Video Production/Post-Production

Mac Pro 8-core 2.66GHz / 16GB RAM / OS 10.6.4 / FCP 7.0.2 / QT 7.6


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Douglas Villalba
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 7, 2010 at 12:41:28 pm

When ever I've had that same problem, eventually one of the drives in the RAID dies.
Do you use Enterprise or regular drives? I had the worst experiences with WD SE drives. These drives are not made to be used inside a RAID.
Do a Google search on the drive that you are using to see what comes up.

Douglas Villalba

http://www.advertising-villa.com

info@dvtvproductions.com

Chroma-Key - Studio, Decklink HD Extreme, HVX200, A1 & HV20. VDSLR, GlideTrack, Rails, GlideCam, Jib


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Christopher Targia
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 7, 2010 at 7:35:17 pm

Currently running RAM Test with Rember, lets see how that works out.

My current set up has a Raid 5 as my Internal Boot Disk. 4 500GB Drives with Mac Raid Card.

I just had Firefox crash in the same fashion, so my externals should have nothing to do with this, right? My Main starch disk is a software RAID 0 made up of 3 of these drives
http://www.amazon.com/AcomData-PureDrive-Desktop-External-PHD10000USE-72/dp...

there are all about 2 years old or so, and I have never had any problems with them, but only used them as usb drives for occasional backup until a few months ago when I set up the raid array.

I have additional FW800 Drives for backup

================================================
MacPro Octo Core Intel Xenon 2.8Ghz 10GB DDR2 Ram
FCP 7.0.3
-I highly recommend el Gato Turbo264HD-


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 7, 2010 at 8:06:24 pm

[Christopher Targia] "My current set up has a Raid 5 as my Internal Boot Disk. 4 500GB Drives with Mac Raid Card."

What? Why? You don't need this for a boot drive. I wouldn't recommend keeping a RAID5 for booting, it's just not necessary. For editing, yes, for a boot drive, not smart.

Try cloning your current config to ONE 1.5or 2TB dive and boot from that.


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Christopher Targia
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 8, 2010 at 2:52:31 pm

because that is how my IT guy here at the office set it up as 2.5 years ago, I didn't know enough about editing back then to tell him otherwise, So i have these 4 internal HDDs, an a raid card, how should I set it up? 1 drive as a boot, and the other three on raid 5 for main scratch disk?

also, i did the ram check, rember said it was all good. THank you!

================================================
MacPro Octo Core Intel Xenon 2.8Ghz 10GB DDR2 Ram
FCP 7.0.3
-I highly recommend el Gato Turbo264HD-


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Christopher Targia
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 8, 2010 at 3:25:18 pm

Also, can I boot off an eSata or Firewire drive? If I can, is that even a good idea?

================================================
MacPro Octo Core Intel Xenon 2.8Ghz 10GB DDR2 Ram
FCP 7.0.3
-I highly recommend el Gato Turbo264HD-


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 9, 2010 at 6:53:14 pm

[Christopher Targia] "Also, can I boot off an eSata or Firewire drive?"

Firewire, yes, but it's not recommended for editing due to the lag. You can do it to make or restore clones.

Jeremy


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 9, 2010 at 6:53:42 pm

[Christopher Targia] "1 drive as a boot, and the other three on raid 5 for main scratch disk?"

Yes, that's what I would do if you want to use the raid card.


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Christopher Targia
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 9, 2010 at 8:56:56 pm

Thank you for your response.

However I did some of my own research on the subject yesterday and came across this.

http://macperformanceguide.com/Mac-BootDriveDogma.html

I read over this and followed this advise

Using Firewire 800 as a boot drive
My Mac Pro boots from an external Firewire 800 drive in order to free up all four internal drive bays for the important stuff — a capacious and ultra-fast data volume.

A 10,000 rpm SATA boot drive would be trivially faster (see discussion above). It’s just not relevant.

I dedicate the Firewire 800 drive to system and applications. Furthermore, I partition it into a 64GB system partition, guaranteeing that the fast portion of the drive is used, minimizing seek time and maximizing data transfer speed. More

When all four internal Mac Pro drive bays are not needed, using one of the drive bays for a boot drive is convenient and preferable to an external Firewire 800 drive, but use a separate drive for your data. The same idea can be extended to use another drive (or two) for a Photoshop scratch volume: see Optimizing Photoshop Performance.




So I currently have my OS booting off my FW800 External. Is this a bad idea in practice? Should I go ahead with you suggested and use one of my internal drives? Should I hook this drive up to my eSata port?


I also found some interesting stuff about partitioning.

http://macperformanceguide.com/Storage-Partitioning.html

In theory it makes perfect sense, the outside of the disk will cover more disk space at the same RPM. However in my tests I have been doing my own tests and have been finding the read/write times are almost identical; although I am only doing it with empty drives so I am sure when these drives of gigs of data on them, that will change. Does anyone have experience with partitioning like this?

================================================
MacPro Octo Core Intel Xenon 2.8Ghz 10GB DDR2 Ram
FCP 7.0.3
-I highly recommend el Gato Turbo264HD-


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 9, 2010 at 9:01:00 pm

I'm sorry, Christopher, you are way way way way way way over thinking the importance of your boot drive.

The speed should be on your scratch drive, your boot drive does not need to be partitioned, segmented, 10K, whatever. It needs to be a normal single sata drive, 7200RPM is fine.

If you want to keep your RAID card as is, you can stuff another SATA drive in the extra DVD drive of your MacPro with a third party rail solution.

Jeremy


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Christopher Targia
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 9, 2010 at 9:36:05 pm

For some reason when I read this
Firewire, yes, but it's not recommended for editing due to the lag. You can do it to make or restore clones.


I misread and thought you said FW800 was not recommend for BOOT, my fault. I will keep it running like this thanks!

================================================
MacPro Octo Core Intel Xenon 2.8Ghz 10GB DDR2 Ram
FCP 7.0.3
-I highly recommend el Gato Turbo264HD-


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 9, 2010 at 9:51:23 pm

I would NOT use Fw800 as a boot drive for editing. That's what I am saying. Yes, you CAN boot from fw800, but I would not run my editing system this way.

Booting from a fw800 drive is useful for when you have to make or restore clones.

Here:

http://blog.macsales.com/684-installing-a-5th-hard-drive-into-a-new-mac-pro...

Put a new SATA drive in the extra MacPro DVD slot, then clone your current system to it. Then restripe your raid5.

Jeremy


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Christopher Targia
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 10, 2010 at 3:33:29 pm

Thank you for the advice, I will definitely do that, or atleast just have 1 internal as my boot and 3 for the Raid, however, as I downloaded and went to run carbon copy cloner, it crashed, and now it doesn't force quit!! this is the same problem I was happening before I reinstalled the OS, wth! what could be causing this!

================================================
MacPro Octo Core Intel Xenon 2.8Ghz 10GB DDR2 Ram
FCP 7.0.3
-I highly recommend el Gato Turbo264HD-


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 10, 2010 at 4:44:18 pm

[Christopher Targia] "this is the same problem I was happening before I reinstalled the OS, wth! what could be causing this!"

My hunch (a and it's just a hunch) is having your OS on Raid. Sounds like it's not agreeing very well.


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Christopher Targia
Re: Major FCP error, whole computer crashes!
on Dec 13, 2010 at 3:31:35 pm

My os is no longer on a raid, I have it on a single SATA HDD

================================================
MacPro Octo Core Intel Xenon 2.8Ghz 10GB DDR2 Ram
FCP 7.0.3
-I highly recommend el Gato Turbo264HD-


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