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Gamma confusion - is there a solution?

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adam taylor
Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 9:48:14 am

I'm finding myself getting more confused about the best way to deal with gamma when making wmv conversions.


I need to make wmv's for all my edits (i'd rather not, but i have no option!)...When i have looked back at the wmvs on pc's - they look fine, but when viewed on Macs they look dark. My clients use both systemsin their office so i cant use the excuse that their screen must be at fault!

I know its all to do with gamma differences between the operating systems but that doesn't really help me a great deal.

I tried gamma correcting within Compressor, and got a good match between my quicktime and the wmv whilst on the mac...but as soon as it gets to PC its all washed out.

Is there a way to encode the wmv so that it looks the same regardless of the viewers operating system?

Failing that - can anyone recommend a good quality codec (and settings) that will produce similar results across both OS's?

thanks in advance
adam

Adam Taylor
Video Editor/Audio Mixer/ Compositor/Motion GFX/Barista
Character Options Ltd
Oldham, UK

http://www.sculptedbliss.co.uk


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Rafael Amador
Re: Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 11:15:13 am

[adam taylor] ".When i have looked back at the wmvs on pc's - they look fine, but when viewed on Macs they look dark."
The problem has always been the other way: Things that looks OK in a PC, looks light and milky in the Mac.

Is nothing about the file: If you tweak the gamma to make it look lighter in the Mac, it will look even lighter in a PC.
Is about displaying. You need to have a look to the Mac screen gamma and also to the application that you are using to play the WM file in your Mac. If you are using QT, have a look to the Preferences.
Cheers,
rafael

http://www.nagavideo.com


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Michael Gissing
Re: Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 11:27:05 am

Make the wmv for the PC people and quicktimes for the Mac. You can't get one file to work on both.


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adam taylor
Re: Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 2:16:02 pm

rafael - the problem is not with my own system, but with the systems used by clients over which i have no control.

I am not told who uses a mac and who uses a pc, more pc than mac - so i send out wmv's.

I'm looking for a one file solution that is OS independent, but it seems that is just a dream.

rgds
Adam

Adam Taylor
Video Editor/Audio Mixer/ Compositor/Motion GFX/Barista
Character Options Ltd
Oldham, UK

http://www.sculptedbliss.co.uk


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John Fishback
Re: Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 2:53:15 pm

Rafael & Michael are both right. Unfortunately, this has been an issue from day 1. PC and Mac have different gammas. You can try to split the difference, but it'll be a compromise.

John

MacPro 8-core 2.8GHz 8 GB RAM OS 10.5.8 QT7.6.4 Kona 3 Dual Cinema 23 ATI Radeon HD 3870, 24" TV-Logic Monitor, ATTO ExpressSAS R380 RAID Adapter, PDE enclosure with 8-drive 6TB RAID 5
FCS 3 (FCP 7.0.2, Motion 4.0.2, Comp 3.5.2, DVDSP 4.2.2, Color 1.5.2)

Pro Tools HD w SYNC IO & 192 Digital I/O, Yamaha DM1000, Millennia Media HV-3C, Neumann U87, Schoeps Mk41 mics, Genelec Monitors, PrimaLT ISDN


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BJ Ahlen
Re: Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 2:57:48 pm

[John Fishback] "PC and Mac have different gammas."

Unless the Mac is running Snow Leopard which now uses 2.2 gamma like Windows to solve this problem.

Hopefully everybody will update to SL soon :O).


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adam taylor
Re: Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 3:05:22 pm

oddly, thats made it worse!

I never really had this problem until a few weeks ago although I have been running 10.6 since it came out, and every other flavour of mac before then.

Gamma issues on wmv's always seemed to be negligible...but over the past month or two, i have noticed they are suddenly much darker on my mac. My boss has also noticed, and he is not a video person, and has always been happy with whatever i sent him in the past.....we're both running 10.6!

I'm beginning to wonder if something in the flip4mac plug-in has changed during one of its regular updates.

Adam Taylor
Video Editor/Audio Mixer/ Compositor/Motion GFX/Barista
Character Options Ltd
Oldham, UK

http://www.sculptedbliss.co.uk


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 3:18:01 pm

[adam taylor] "I'm looking for a one file solution that is OS independent, but it seems that is just a dream."

No it's not. Welcome to Flash! But hopefully you can program a website too.

Start a private youtube channel.

Jeremy


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John Fishback
Re: Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 4:20:07 pm

While I haven't specifically tested this, why would Flash make a difference? It's still being viewed on screens with different gammas.

John

MacPro 8-core 2.8GHz 8 GB RAM OS 10.5.8 QT7.6.4 Kona 3 Dual Cinema 23 ATI Radeon HD 3870, 24" TV-Logic Monitor, ATTO ExpressSAS R380 RAID Adapter, PDE enclosure with 8-drive 6TB RAID 5
FCS 3 (FCP 7.0.2, Motion 4.0.2, Comp 3.5.2, DVDSP 4.2.2, Color 1.5.2)

Pro Tools HD w SYNC IO & 192 Digital I/O, Yamaha DM1000, Millennia Media HV-3C, Neumann U87, Schoeps Mk41 mics, Genelec Monitors, PrimaLT ISDN


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 4:26:30 pm

Flash is OS independent.


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John Fishback
Re: Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 4:37:59 pm

Every developer loves Flash since it will playback on many platforms regardless of the OS. But every computer's display will have it's local gamma, right? I just checked a Flash file playing back from YouTube on a Mac and a PC and they definitely play differently with the PC being darker.

John

MacPro 8-core 2.8GHz 8 GB RAM OS 10.5.8 QT7.6.4 Kona 3 Dual Cinema 23 ATI Radeon HD 3870, 24" TV-Logic Monitor, ATTO ExpressSAS R380 RAID Adapter, PDE enclosure with 8-drive 6TB RAID 5
FCS 3 (FCP 7.0.2, Motion 4.0.2, Comp 3.5.2, DVDSP 4.2.2, Color 1.5.2)

Pro Tools HD w SYNC IO & 192 Digital I/O, Yamaha DM1000, Millennia Media HV-3C, Neumann U87, Schoeps Mk41 mics, Genelec Monitors, PrimaLT ISDN


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 4:39:37 pm

Adam wanted a platform agnostic file, Flash is thus. Gamma issues aside.

And your mac still has 1.8 gamma if you're using Leopard.


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John Fishback
Re: Gamma confusion - is there a solution?
on Aug 10, 2010 at 5:58:23 pm

True.

John

MacPro 8-core 2.8GHz 8 GB RAM OS 10.5.8 QT7.6.4 Kona 3 Dual Cinema 23 ATI Radeon HD 3870, 24" TV-Logic Monitor, ATTO ExpressSAS R380 RAID Adapter, PDE enclosure with 8-drive 6TB RAID 5
FCS 3 (FCP 7.0.2, Motion 4.0.2, Comp 3.5.2, DVDSP 4.2.2, Color 1.5.2)

Pro Tools HD w SYNC IO & 192 Digital I/O, Yamaha DM1000, Millennia Media HV-3C, Neumann U87, Schoeps Mk41 mics, Genelec Monitors, PrimaLT ISDN


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