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"Teach" FCP Timecode Order

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Emory Dunn
"Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 9, 2010 at 5:41:29 pm

I have around 200 tapes that need to be re-digitised which by its self isn't too bad but the tapes were recored using (some of the time) time-of-day for the timecode and just to make things even harder some tapes use a 24 hour clock others use 12 hour. But the real catch is that I have clips already made (from when they were originally digitised into AVID) and I need to be able to reuse those same clips, which means just capturing the whole tape without the original timecode isn't an option.

So, what I'm wondering is if there is any way to "teach" FCP the order of the timecode on the tape so it knows that, for example, hour 1 comes after hour 12.


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Jerry Hofmann
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 9, 2010 at 6:16:37 pm

YOu don't have to teach FCP this... it already assumes that later TC is later on the tape... You should be able to just batch digitize the clips if all the TC on them is ascending in time. Doesn't matter where the TC starts.

Jerry

Apple Certified Trainer, Producer, Writer, Director Editor, Gun for Hire and other things. I ski.

8-Core 3.0 Intel Mac Pro, Dual 2 gig G5, AJA Kona SD, AJA Kona 2, Huge Systems Array UL3D, AJA Io HD, 17" MBP, Matrox MXO2 with MAX Cinema Displays


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Emory Dunn
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 9, 2010 at 6:23:57 pm

That's the problem; the timecode isn't always in order. I've had a couple tapes that go in this order: 11,12,1 or have hour 18 before 16 followed by 17.


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Jerry Hofmann
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 9, 2010 at 6:29:36 pm

Well, you'll have to manually put the tape in the correct hour code before you batch clips within that hour's code... no other way to do this I'm afraid. Sloppy shooters cause headaches like this for sure.

That said, if you want to start all over, the thing to do is copy the errant TC'd tapes first to get to a continuous TC source tape.

Jerry

Apple Certified Trainer, Producer, Writer, Director Editor, Gun for Hire and other things. I ski.

8-Core 3.0 Intel Mac Pro, Dual 2 gig G5, AJA Kona SD, AJA Kona 2, Huge Systems Array UL3D, AJA Io HD, 17" MBP, Matrox MXO2 with MAX Cinema Displays


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Emory Dunn
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 9, 2010 at 6:32:50 pm

That's what I've been doing, and it's a slow process but it works (until it runs into other timecode errors). Thanks for your help!


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John Pale
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 9, 2010 at 7:20:39 pm

Another thing that may be possible would be to give different sections of the tape different reel numbers

such as 5A, 5B etc. This keeps FCP from searching in the wrong direction for the timecode, as it thinks its a new tape. You might have to shuttle a bit, so that you are inside the correct hour on your "reel changes"..

I remember doing this a long time ago, and it made things go a bit faster.


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Matt Callac
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 9, 2010 at 7:28:13 pm

[John Pale] "Another thing that may be possible would be to give different sections of the tape different reel numbers

such as 5A, 5B etc"


I usually do this if there's some sort of timecode problem. It works well. Not sure how you'd accomplish this where you are right now...unless you already have noted somewhere which tapes have messed up TC.
-mattyc


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Emory Dunn
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 9, 2010 at 7:53:29 pm

That sounds like nice solution unfortunately I don't always know where the breaks are. And even then that might not always work since some tapes have two of the same hour (hour 1 at the beginning an then another hour 1 at the end). I'm basically just dealing with disastrous tapes.

Thanks for all the suggestion though, I might see if I can find a way to use them.


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John Pale
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 9, 2010 at 8:10:23 pm

Good God.

I might find the nearest bar, instead.

Hope you are billing by the hour.

J


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Matt Callac
Re:
on Jul 9, 2010 at 9:45:14 pm

I'd either sit down and scan all the tapes (or pay someone else to) making notes of every time the TC goes out of a normal numeric sequence. then incriment the tapes into parts. For instance notes on one tape
would say TC

11:00:00:00-15:00:00:00
Break
2:00:00:00-4:00:00:00
Break
1:00:00:00-2:00:00:00

then name each chunk as a tape so tape 001 would now be 001a 001b 001c.

then take your notes and modify the reel names in your batch list...and capture.

Unfortunately with your tapes that have multiple areas with the same TC...you'll have
-mattyc


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Jerry Hofmann
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 9, 2010 at 10:28:38 pm

LOLL

Jerry

Apple Certified Trainer, Producer, Writer, Director Editor, Gun for Hire and other things. I ski.

8-Core 3.0 Intel Mac Pro, Dual 2 gig G5, AJA Kona SD, AJA Kona 2, Huge Systems Array UL3D, AJA Io HD, 17" MBP, Matrox MXO2 with MAX Cinema Displays


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Jerry Hofmann
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 9, 2010 at 10:31:03 pm

Gotta tell you guys. If this was done right this capture would be done by now.

What a crock. I'm telling ya, I'd be talking to the client and telling him that it needs to be copied and re-logged from the copies. 200 tapes? Their log will help you still. It will be somewhat faster with it.

Jerry

Apple Certified Trainer, Producer, Writer, Director Editor, Gun for Hire and other things. I ski.

8-Core 3.0 Intel Mac Pro, Dual 2 gig G5, AJA Kona SD, AJA Kona 2, Huge Systems Array UL3D, AJA Io HD, 17" MBP, Matrox MXO2 with MAX Cinema Displays


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Matt Callac
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 9, 2010 at 10:43:40 pm

[Jerry Hofmann] "Gotta tell you guys. If this was done right this capture would be done by no"

haha adding insult to injury.


I haven't worked on a project with 200 sources in years...but now that I think about it It's always the most unorganized clients that have that many source tapes. why is that.
-mattyc


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Jerry Hofmann
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 10, 2010 at 1:16:14 pm

I can tell you why... it's just another example of people not being seasoned or trained well enough to do this correctly, and these same people are too lazy to spend the time to learn it. Thus they are disorganized too. Organizing is PART OF THE PROCESS of doing this ya know? (See: Shane Ross' DVD" sold here at the cow in the training link above).

It's all part of the syndrome that since you have a viewfinder, you're now a shooter, and since you know shooters, you're now a producer (course ANYONE can direct and light, right?)... cripes. I can't tell you how many times a client has come to me and said "we shouldn't have hired this kid, he obviously doesn't know what he's doing. Can you fix this?".. My reply has always been "You bet! we'll start by re-writing and reshooting".

Jerry

Apple Certified Trainer, Producer, Writer, Director Editor, Gun for Hire and other things. I ski.

8-Core 3.0 Intel Mac Pro, Dual 2 gig G5, AJA Kona SD, AJA Kona 2, Huge Systems Array UL3D, AJA Io HD, 17" MBP, Matrox MXO2 with MAX Cinema Displays


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Emory Dunn
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 10, 2010 at 3:39:28 pm

The sad part about this is the main guy who shot this is actually quite experienced, although I guess not quite as much when these were shot several years ago. The whole idea behind the TOD timecode was to make it easier to sync the multiple cameras after the fact. Part of the reason it's such a mess is because it was a documentary so it was pretty much "hey look, someones doing something: press record" most of the tapes aren't even full.

Although possibly the worst part about the entire thing is that I'm the (payed) intern that got all this dumped on, so I'm not even getting payed well for it.


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cowcowcowcowcow
Jerry Hofmann
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 10, 2010 at 5:31:41 pm

Golly, the guys who set you up to do this didn't want to do it themselves because they knew it was a world of hurt sort of job... THAT's what INTERNS are for I'm afraid. Do the grunt work that an expensive editor doesn't want to do and shouldn't actually be doing...

That said, talk them into dubbing the tapes and starting over. Bet it's just as fast, and more importantly, in the event the tapes have to be recaptured now or later, they can be done as they should have been in the first place. BTW to properly capture and log 200 hours of tape is going to take around 400 hours... so at least a month or more...

Remember this: shooters don't edit much... and they really don't care about post workflow problems. It's Shooters who came up with "we'll fix it in post"... ALWAYS bad, and saves them the work of doing it right in the fist place. Gotta say, I've seen a shooter live with a C-Stand in the corner, or a mic overhead, and said... aw they can just expand this in post and lose the problem... Yeah right. Let's cremate the video because the shooter was too lazy to do another take and move a C-stand? Cripes.

What's weird, is that it's editors who get them their next job. Shooters should understand this. It's the editor who to the producer or director says: "who shot this?" then if the reaction from the editor is that it's really awful, that shooter just lost some future work. If the editor says "it's wonderful", guess who gets hired again next time! The shooter gets another job and referrals... Shooters are way short sighted in general I'm afraid. The really good ones always keep the editor's job in mind. Always.

Jerry

Apple Certified Trainer, Producer, Writer, Director Editor, Gun for Hire and other things. I ski.

8-Core 3.0 Intel Mac Pro, Dual 2 gig G5, AJA Kona SD, AJA Kona 2, Huge Systems Array UL3D, AJA Io HD, 17" MBP, Matrox MXO2 with MAX Cinema Displays


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Emory Dunn
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 10, 2010 at 6:19:45 pm

Yeah, you've got it spot on. My boss is always saying "The reason you're here is because you are smart and know the software. If it were easy I'd do it myself."

The only problem with doing that (and it really isn't [i]that[/i] big of a problem is my boss wants to use the old clips he logged, but we did consider wiping the timecode and starting over. Luckily not all of the tapes are bad, there are some that have no problems and let me take a short nap :P

And yeah, as much as my boss calls himself a "shooter-editor" the extent of the editing he does is drop selects on a timeline, but luckily he is better about shooting so the editor doesn't have an aneurysm. But at the end of the day it doesn't matter how he shoots since he owns the studio.


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Jerry Hofmann
Re: "Teach" FCP Timecode Order
on Jul 11, 2010 at 2:28:44 am

Ya got that right.

Jerry

Apple Certified Trainer, Producer, Writer, Director Editor, Gun for Hire and other things. I ski.

8-Core 3.0 Intel Mac Pro, Dual 2 gig G5, AJA Kona SD, AJA Kona 2, Huge Systems Array UL3D, AJA Io HD, 17" MBP, Matrox MXO2 with MAX Cinema Displays


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