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Audio question in 29.97 timeline to 23,98

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Cristobal Hurtado
Audio question in 29.97 timeline to 23,98
on Jan 28, 2010 at 12:38:35 pm

Hello everyone, I've been looking through the post for an answer but can't find it, here's my doubt:

I have to conform a 29,97 DV NTSC offline sequence (FCP) to 23,98 1920 x 1080 for Onlining and 35 mm blow up. No problems with the video part (EDL and cinema tools), but my doubt is with audio. Can I just export the OMF from the 29,97 timeline and then put the stereo mix that the audio post producer gives me in the 23,98 timeline, matching the begining and end beep's? Is this possible? I have done several test with good results, but never for real on a 80 minutes project like this one.

many thanks in advance

jc


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Shane Ross
Re: Audio question in 29.97 timeline to 23,98
on Jan 28, 2010 at 5:06:08 pm

I'd ask the audio engineer this question. But I think it will be fine. audio doesn't have a frame rate. 23.98 and 29.97 both hit the SECOND and MINUTE marks at the same time...so should be fine.


Shane



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Mark Spano
Re: Audio question in 29.97 timeline to 23,98
on Jan 28, 2010 at 5:09:05 pm

[Cristobal Hurtado] "Can I just export the OMF from the 29,97 timeline and then put the stereo mix that the audio post producer gives me in the 23,98 timeline, matching the begining and end beep's? Is this possible?"

Yes, however a few things to take into account. You must give the audio mixer a 29.97 picture reference as well. The overall timing will be exactly the same (minutes and seconds are minutes and seconds). There is a huge caveat to this workflow, and that is that if there are any changes ever to the picture, the audio mixer will have a hard time conforming his already mixed session. If you're prepared to say picture is locked forever, then you can get away with this workflow.



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Cristobal Hurtado
Re: Audio question in 29.97 timeline to 23,98
on Jan 28, 2010 at 6:06:45 pm

Many thanks for the quick answers! :)

So this may work... I'll talk to the audio post producer, and make some test to be sure.
I know the issues that may come along if the pictures isn't locked, but we are so close to the deadlines that anything will help us. I know there's a software ( http://www.virtualkaty.com/ ) for conforming sound to picture changes, anyone has work with it?

once again thanks and success!!

Cristóbal Hurtado


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John Fishback
Re: Audio question in 29.97 timeline to 23,98
on Jan 28, 2010 at 7:21:05 pm

I've never used Virtual Katy, but have read a number of very positive posts about it. Search (be sure to include the Audio Professionals forum) on Virtual Katy and they should pop up.

John

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Michael Gissing
Re: Audio question in 29.97 timeline to 23,98
on Jan 28, 2010 at 10:28:05 pm


I had a job a few years ago that was shot HD @ 23.976 but the only way I could handle the sound post was with a standard def ref picture.

So the OMF was loaded into the system (dSP) into a 29.97 sequence. Importantly it was non drop to match the 23.976 sequence. It worked perfectly and the final mix matched back to the 23.976 sequence because real time was maintained. Changing to drop frame would have stuffed it up. Do a test because the audio post system may not like loading a 23.976 OMF into a 29.97 project.


Not sure how Virtual Katy would handle changes to frame rate. There was reversioning which I had to deal with. I used Cinema tools to make EDLs of both cuts in 29.97 from the 23.976 originals. I then used Editrace (which is an online service), to compare and make a change list. This is the same as Virtual Katy although it is only EDL based. You pay small fee for each EDL change list generated.

This made it frame accurate to reversion. The rules are simple- match real time, use reference pips at the head and tail of the OMF and the mix should be totally in sync.


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Cristobal Hurtado
Re: Audio question in 29.97 timeline to 23,98
on Jan 29, 2010 at 12:19:09 pm

Many thanks for the advices. Our audio post producer says it's ok with the workflow, and we made some tests and it's all in sync. I'll check edit trace, may help.


jc







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Michael Gissing
Re: Audio question in 29.97 timeline to 23,98
on Jan 29, 2010 at 11:14:54 pm


Its Editrace -
http://www.editrace.com/



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