mixed frame rate timeline?

mixed frame rate timeline?

by Matt Campbell

on Jan 19, 2010 at 7:59:48 pm

When editing mixed 23.98 footage into a 29.97 timeline, what is the process? Will FCP add in the proper pull-down to those 23.98 clips and leave the 29.97 material alone? Or should you simply edit using the mixed timeline and once you have picture lock, properly convert the 23.98 clips to 29.97 with 2:3:3:2 pulldown using AE or Compressor?

Same question for speed changes. Which I posted on about 2 weeks ago. Can or should you edit using FCP speed changes for picture lock, then export those clips to Compressor or Motion for the optical flow retiming and replace in a new timeline?

OS 10.5.5, Mac Pro 2 x 3 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 9 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card

Re: mixed frame rate timeline?

by Shane Ross

on Jan 19, 2010 at 8:11:36 pm

[Matt Campbell] "When editing mixed 23.98 footage into a 29.97 timeline, what is the process?"

Don't. Convert the frame rates to match. So whatever you have most of, or whatever you are delivering, convert the rest to match that.

[Matt Campbell] "Will FCP add in the proper pull-down to those 23.98 clips and leave the 29.97 material alone?"

FCP does NOT add the proper pulldown to 23.98 clips in a 29.97 timeline. It does 2:2:2:4 instead of 2:3:3:2. Just plain awful.

[Matt Campbell] "Or should you simply edit using the mixed timeline and once you have picture lock, properly convert the 23.98 clips to 29.97 with 2:3:3:2 pulldown using AE or Compressor? "

Convert BEFORE you edit. Trying to fix it after will be a nightmare. Trust me.

[Matt Campbell] "Can or should you edit using FCP speed changes for picture lock, then export those clips to Compressor or Motion for the optical flow retiming and replace in a new timeline? "

Do what looks good. If you like FCP's speed changes, use those. If you want better, go out. Do this WHILE you are editing, dont wait for picture lock.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: mixed frame rate timeline?

by Matt Campbell

on Jan 19, 2010 at 9:43:59 pm

That was quick. Thanks Shane. Just the type of detailed response i was hoping for. appreciate it.

OS 10.5.5, Mac Pro 2 x 3 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 9 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card

Re: mixed frame rate timeline?

by Rob Grauert

on Jan 20, 2010 at 2:51:05 pm

Shane,

I could be wrong, but I think if you are going out to a NTSC or PAL firewire device, FCP does add the correct pulldown:

I know you're into AJA and Matrox. Do their products not properly add pulldown if you output to something like BetaSP or HDCam?

Robert J. Grauert, Jr.
http://www.robgrauert.com

Re: mixed frame rate timeline?

by Shane Ross

on Jan 20, 2010 at 5:25:36 pm

You aren't wrong. That is if you have a 23.98 timeline populated ONLY with 23.98 footage. That will output to 29.97 via firewire with the proper pulldown.

But that is not what we are talking about. We are talking about MIXING frame rates on the timeline. When you add 29.97 footage to 23.98 timeline...or 23.98 footage to a 29.97 timeline... the proper pulldown is NOT added. FCP goes to 2:2:2:4. This is the problem. And this is why you need to conform to one frame rate before you start.

Or get Avid Media Composer 4.0 which mixes frame rates right.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: mixed frame rate timeline?

by Rob Grauert

on Jan 20, 2010 at 5:58:48 pm

Oooh. That makes sense. The manual doesn't specify that this option is for 23.98 footage and timelines only.

Well thanks for clarifying.

Robert J. Grauert, Jr.
http://www.robgrauert.com

Re: mixed frame rate timeline?

by Matt Campbell

on Jun 4, 2010 at 6:11:20 pm

I believe MPEG Streamclip will do the same thing FCP does and that's add in the incorrect pulldown. You'll need to use After Effects or even Compressor to convert to 29.97. I don't have AE so I use compressor. If you do, I'd recommend using the frame controls to help. Set the rate conversion to BEST. This may take a while if you have long clips. I don't, plus a beafy machine chews through them pretty quickly.

OS 10.6.3, Mac Pro 2 x 2.66 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 16 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card