FORUMS: list search recent posts

Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch

COW Forums : Apple Final Cut Pro Legacy

<< PREVIOUS   •   FAQ   •   VIEW ALL   •   PRINT   •   NEXT >>
Max Huggett
Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Sep 14, 2009 at 10:58:24 am

Hi Guys

I have been following a tutorial that shows how to easily conform from 25 frames to 24 using Cinema Tools. Unfortunately, the tutorial didn't really go into depth regarding fixing the audio pitch.

In FCP7, can i adjust the pitch before i render, and when i conform, the pitch should be now normal? If so, is there a magic number i should adjust a PAL project to? Or do i have to go into an audio program and do it there? I have 7 hours of audio to change and am not sure of the best and most efficient way to address this.

Thanks for any help.
Max


Return to posts index

Peter Brewer
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Sep 14, 2009 at 11:51:51 am

You could try using the audio stretch tool in soundtrack pro. That changes the length of the audio track but retains the original pitch.

Peter Brewer
http://www.peterbrewer.net


Return to posts index

Max Huggett
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Sep 14, 2009 at 12:10:35 pm

Would that be a quick process of just bringing the audio off the QT, or would it bring in the video aswell?

I quickly tried changing the pitch in Soundbooth yesterday, and it natural pitch, it was going to take over 8 hours to render 1 hour of footage on a 8 core machine

Cheers
m


Return to posts index


Rafael Amador
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Sep 14, 2009 at 12:49:52 pm

[Peter Brewer] "You could try using the audio stretch tool in soundtrack pro. That changes the length of the audio track but retains the original pitch. "
This would let all the audio out of sync.
Max, audio is not my strong at all (I wonder which is my strong if I have any) but sure somebody will chime in with the answer.
rafael



http://www.nagavideo.com


Return to posts index

Max Huggett
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Sep 14, 2009 at 1:09:15 pm

Cheers Rafael

I have just opened my video in Sountrack Pro and played with the pitch settings. It was probably something that i was doing but it sounded like there where 2 voices, rather than 1. Not what i was after at all.

In the project window, i selected the pullup feature and it brought it back to its original sound, but i don't know if that is just a display setting only and not able to be rendered out.

Any audio pros care to advise how i would render out my audio and would compressor be able to take 2 individual files and join them into 1.

Thanks alot


Return to posts index

Jeremy Garchow
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Sep 14, 2009 at 3:37:47 pm

This is why I use Compressor to do my conforms.

BUT, that's not to say I haven't used Cinema Tools and let the pitch ride. No one will know except you and a few others.

Jeremy


Return to posts index


Michael Gissing
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Sep 15, 2009 at 12:12:42 am

[Jeremy Garchow] "No one will know except you and a few others."

I hope that's TIC Jeremy. Although few people regard audio as important, it is actually more important and vastly cheaper to perfect than pictures. A lack of regard shows ignorance, something I wouldn't expect from experienced advisors on a public forum.

Please search this forum as I have answered this question so many times.


Return to posts index

Jeremy Garchow
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Sep 15, 2009 at 2:49:54 am

Yeah, every dog has his day, and today must be mine. Someone else accused me of not being a professional today. I guess it's the way it is. But let me ask you this? Why is it that process is exactly how many many film to PAL conversions are made? Simply slow down the footage 1 frame per second and let the pitch go with it? I was just watching the special features on a movie from the US on a bluray the other day and one of those special features was a UK based tv show that was interviewing the director at a screening. The voice of the main character is highly recognizable, but guess what? It was obvious they were playing back 24 @ 25 and accepted the pitch down because that main characters voice was noticeably lower to me. Do you think anyone in that theater noticed? Maybe you would have, maybe someone from the US might have, but I can pretty much gaurantee that most of the people that walked out if that screening didn't say, man that audio wad pitched down .4%. I am sorry you took offense, but I stand by my work. I have done many 24 @ 25 conversions, and never once had a complaint. Recently, I have started to use Compressor to conform as the pitch stays the same for producers that watch both versions on their computers.

Jeremy


Return to posts index

Rafael Amador
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Sep 15, 2009 at 3:08:25 am

As cameraman and video-editor, I would go to the "conform" (let the pitch correction for the audio guy) instead than to the "Standard Conversion" (Compressor).
With the Conform you end up with the same picture you started, pixel by pixel.
With the Standard Conversion you end up with nothing of the original film. Risky when working with compressed material.
Cheers,
rafael

http://www.nagavideo.com


Return to posts index


Michael Gissing
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Sep 15, 2009 at 8:34:40 am


Pitch correction should be applied but externally using proper software. I have a slight gripe with the slow down or speed up that is being commonly used to go from 25 to 24 or 23.976 to 25. I sat through a restripe of a doco recently with the director, having sped up the final mix 4.1% to match the 23.976 to 25 speed up for the BBC version.

The director was horrified at what a mere 4% did to the pace of his edit in spite of the fact that the pitch was corrected. It changed the feel of the show and we were both amazed at how subtle timings of pauses after important dialog became shortened by the speed up. Perhaps we were the only ones to really notice the difference, but if that had been combined with all the music being 3/4 of a semi tone sharp and the female narrators voice becoming higher pitched, I think the audience would have found the program uncomfortable.

I know it is a typical thing that what looks best wins over sound, but I do not like this approach to standards conversion, even though I have MPEX3 software which does an amazing job of speed change with correct pitch.


Return to posts index

Jeremy Garchow
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Sep 15, 2009 at 12:44:40 pm

I hear you on all those fronts, Michael. That's why I said that only you and a few others will know.

I agree, there are better ways to do it, but for fast, easy and cheap, a simple conform is the best option.

Jeremy


Return to posts index

Jeremy Garchow
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Sep 15, 2009 at 12:40:37 pm

[Rafael Amador] "With the Standard Conversion you end up with nothing of the original film. Risky when working with compressed material. "

Hi Raf. There's a conform function in Compressor. It's not the same as Cinema Tools, but it's there. No frame blending, no frame interpolation, what goes in is what comes out, just 1 frame per second slower.

Jeremy


Return to posts index

Trevor Allin
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Oct 3, 2009 at 8:11:01 am

Hi

I am just beginning this process. I have 16 hours of video and audio to convert from 25fps to 23.98.

I am at the beginning of the learning curve. I have got as far as conforming my video file (which contains audio) in Cinema Tools and wondering why the audio is out of Sync.

My back is against the wall for releasing this as a commercial project in the US. (im in the UK)

I would be incredibly grateful if you would not mind sharing with me the workflow i should use, and how I get my audio back in sync.

Thanks!

Trevor


Return to posts index

Jeremy Garchow
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Oct 3, 2009 at 3:12:55 pm

Are you adding this footage to a currently 23.98 project? If not, edit @ 25 and do the conform on the final edit.


Return to posts index

Trevor Allin
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Oct 3, 2009 at 4:10:38 pm

Hi

I have finished editing in FCP, which is in 25p 1280x720. I want to make a 23.98p DVD(s) for US release.

When I conform in cinema tools to 23.98 the audio is out of sync.

I want to use the CT conform feature if possible as it keeps my graphical work smooth. When I do the conversion in compressor it ends up jerky.

Thanks

Trevor


Return to posts index

Jeremy Garchow
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Oct 6, 2009 at 4:30:32 pm

[Trevor Allin] "I want to use the CT conform feature if possible as it keeps my graphical work smooth. When I do the conversion in compressor it ends up jerky. "

Sorry, I have been away and am now back.

In Cinema Tools, you duplicate your 25p self contianed movie, open it Cinema Tools, click to confrom button, and change the framre rate to 23.98. The audio will get pitched up and resampled.

Jeremy


Return to posts index

Trevor Allin
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Oct 6, 2009 at 5:06:47 pm

Hi Jeremy

Thanks for this. I am experiencing weirdness on a profound level at the moment with CT. Very frustrating.

When I conform a Prores file the audio is out of sync. When I conform an AIC it works 70% of the time and the other 30% it slows the whole thing down by about 70% (video and audio).

Life would be so less stressful if things just worked!

Thanks

Trevor


Return to posts index

Jeremy Garchow
Re: Conforming from 25 to 24 with Cinema Tools - How to fix audio pitch
on Oct 6, 2009 at 5:29:04 pm

Right click the movie and choose Open with > CInema Tools. Then click the conform button and choose 23.98.

It shoudl just work and work instantly.

Maybe try deleting that export and reexport a new self contained 25p movie.

Jeremy


Return to posts index

<< PREVIOUS   •   VIEW ALL   •   PRINT   •   NEXT >>
© 2018 CreativeCOW.net All Rights Reserved
[TOP]