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Canon C 300. Shooting slow motion at 720p/29.97p

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Daniel Whiteneck
Canon C 300. Shooting slow motion at 720p/29.97p
on Apr 7, 2015 at 4:09:30 pm

Conversation started today
Danny Whiteneck
7:56am

Hello all. I'm working on a TV show that shoots several different frame rates and resolutions.
We shoot the primary footage (interviews, reality, etc) at 1080i/ 29.97p which is how we've done the last 4 years.

For all the slow motion, specialty shots, we've been shooting 720p/ 59.94p which is conformed to 29.97p to create half speed slow motion. This is also
How it's been done the last 4 seasons.

Post sent me a spec sheet for the current season which requests to shoot slow motion at 720p/ 29.97p.
(which I didn't do because I was sticking with what we did in the past). Does anyone know if there's a way to get true slow motion using 29.97p? It sounds weird to me. I guess you could conform it to 23.98 but that wouldn't be much slower. Maybe it has to do with transcoding? I only ask because I shot 5 days worth of slow motion at 720p/ 59.94p (which I know they can use, and I've been doing it that way for 4 years with great results) but post called me out and said to the slow motion @ 720p/29.97? I would ask the editor but it's a really large show and I don't know any of the editors. I want to get a second opinion before I call thanks!


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Todd Terry
Re: Canon C 300. Shooting slow motion at 720p/29.97p
on Apr 7, 2015 at 5:04:05 pm

Well frankly that makes little to no sense.

Smooth true slow motion is, obviously, achieved by "overcranking"... that is, shooting at a frame rate faster than the intended playback. Obviously you know this, as you have definitely been doing it the "right" way.

If you are working in a 29.97 world (for post and playback), a mandate to shoot your slow-mo footage at 29.97 as well makes no sense. At all. Sure, you can slow-mo that footage, just as you can with any footage, by using it in post at a slower frame rate. But it won't be true smooth slow motion, of course, it will look like choppy slowed-down footage. The only solution to smoothing that out would be to use some frame-interpolation software (Twixtor, etc.) to attempt to re-create the "missing" frames, but those results are uneven at best and are usually good only for very specifically-shot and framed setups. The obvious "real" solution is to simply overcrank... and shoot at a faster frame rate. Which you have been doing.

I believe your mandate there comes from someone who doesn't know what they are talking about.

T2

__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com



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Rich Rubasch
Re: Canon C 300. Shooting slow motion at 720p/29.97p
on Apr 8, 2015 at 8:35:14 pm

But can't the C300 shoot 59.94p (full frames) at 720, and then conform to 29.97 thereby halving the speed with all full frames? I thought that is what was meant by 60fps at 720p. It is in fact overcranking if you are going to a 29.97 timeline. Even more so if you work in a 23.976 timeline.

Rich Rubasch
Tilt Media Inc.
Video Production, Post, Studio Sound Stage
Founder/President/Editor/Designer/Animator
http://www.tiltmedia.com


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Todd Terry
Re: Canon C 300. Shooting slow motion at 720p/29.97p
on Apr 8, 2015 at 9:20:38 pm

Actually, Rich is right... and I will freely admit that I was totally wrong when I said what they were asking for couldn't be done. It can be, and actually that's the way I do it all the time, myself. You can indeed give them slow-mo shots that are 29.97p. I just wasn't thinking right.

While everything I said is correct in theory, there are some things that are specific to the C300 that will satisfy everyone.

I just went and looked at my camera to make sure what I was saying is true...

This is the one thing that the C300 doesn't make totally easy, as there are a few menu hoops to jump through.

If you go into the menu under "Other Functions" (open the menu and select the icon that looks like a wrench) and set your frame rate to 29.97p... and then under "Special Rec" select "Slow & Fast Motion" and then under "Slow & Fast Motion" >> "S&F Frame Rate" set your rate higher, say 60fps, your end result WILL be a 29.97p clip that is overcranked by however much you set it.

That should satisfy everyone's requirements.

NOTE THIS: I personally always shoot bitrates of 50 Mbps 1920x1080 (under "Bit Rate/Resolution"). With those settings the fastest fps you can shoot is 30. If you want to go higher than that for slow-mo, you have to lower the bitrate/frame size. I usually duck it to 35 Mbps 1280x720.

Again, I was WRONG WRONG WRONG... freely admit it.

T2

__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com



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Daniel Whiteneck
Re: Canon C 300. Shooting slow motion at 720p/29.97p
on Apr 8, 2015 at 9:54:07 pm

Thanks guys, this has been helpful. I did now about the slow and quick function but I've never ised it on a show before. It turns out post is on a deadline as usual and they want it done within the camera to safe time in the edit. They just weren't very specific. In the future I'm going to use slow and fast at 29.97 and set the frame rate to 48 or 60. Thanks again.


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