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1920 X 1080 vs 1440 X 1080

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Dustin Tooks
1920 X 1080 vs 1440 X 1080
on Nov 17, 2010 at 6:56:57 pm

Have some footage from HV40 for doc I am directing. Not an astute technical guy so please forgive if question very basic.

Cannon's specs say.

Tape: HD/DV (16:9) mode: Approx 2.07 Megapixels (1920×1080)
DV (4:3) mode: Approx 1.55 Megapixels (1440 x 1080)

When I bring into final cut pro it captures it at 1440 X 1080. So it is capturing 1920 X 1080 HD image to DV tape at 1440 x 1080. Then when I bring it into my system mixed with other footage shot on other cameras at 1920 X 1080 does the Cannon footage just make Apect ratio and size adjustments to compensate? Is this a big adjustment?

I know story is king BUT just wondering.


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Brian Louis
Re: 1920 X 1080 vs 1440 X 1080
on Nov 18, 2010 at 10:47:10 am

The video on a HV40 is shot with a 1920x1080 image sensor, it is then via DSP converted to the tape format "HDV" which is 1440x1080, this is to achieve the proper bandwidth to fit on the tape.

[Dustin Tooks] "Then when I bring it into my system mixed with other footage shot on other cameras at 1920 X 1080 does the Cannon footage just make Apect ratio and size adjustments to compensate?"
The Canon footage doesn't do anything, its up to the software you are using to edit with if it will use mixed formats and convert them to a particular Project setting. EX: I use Grass Valley Edius with a project setting of 1920x1080 60i and I mix interlaced, progressive, and anamorphic HD


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Dustin Tooks
Re: 1920 X 1080 vs 1440 X 1080
on Nov 18, 2010 at 10:00:19 pm

Forgive me, but what is DSP?
Also, what is point of capturing 1920 X 1080 and converting it to 1440 X 1080?
Thank you very much for your knowledge.


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Bob Dix
Re: 1920 X 1080 vs 1440 X 1080
on Nov 18, 2010 at 11:32:47 pm

Can't help with DSP, but,the Canon High End camcorders do record at 1920 x 1080p and saves PAL at 1440 x 1080i which is the High Definition standard . We use a Canon HV20 which does that and produces an anamorphic 1920 x 1080 i video, so I am advised.We use a Canon 5D Mark II which records at 1920 x 1080 p and when viewed on a Sony Bravia HD Tv Full HD, (if you can see any difference), I can't.

The edited output from Premiere Pro is the same as using a HDMI cable when using Pro HD tape or Blu-ray recorded at H.264 compression and or mpeg-2 HDV.My impression is Tape has a slight edge ?

Ps . You do not convert the pixels, it is automatically done in camera . The anamorphic widescreen 16:9 effect is un- noticable and automatic,Premiere Pro produces a Cineform avi HDV file ; the High Definiton video over the past 5 years are all broadcast quality.

Freelance Imaging & Video
AUSTRALIA


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Bob Dix
Re: 1920 X 1080 vs 1440 X 1080
on Nov 19, 2010 at 2:44:03 am


******


http://www.donferrario.com/ruether/Canon_HV20-HV30.htm


This may be worth a look Re : Operation of Canon HV40 ? ****

Freelance Imaging & Video
AUSTRALIA


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Brian Louis
Re: 1920 X 1080 vs 1440 X 1080
on Nov 19, 2010 at 11:20:11 am

DSP = Digital Signal Processing

[Dustin Tooks] "Also, what is point of capturing 1920 X 1080 and converting it to 1440 X 1080"
You are not capturing 1920x1080, you are taking the 1920x1080 video from the image sensor and via signal processing downconverting it to a format(HDV) that has the bandwidth to fit on tape used.
If you want to get the full image sensor output matrix(1920x1080) you need to get a video capture card like Black Magic Design's Intensity Pro, or Intensity Shuttle, Matrox's MX02 series capture devices, or AJA's capture devices that allow you to capture live video(not tape, using the camcorder as a camera head) via the HDMI output from canon camcorders or other camcorders that have the approriate sensors that have HDMI available.

To fully understand whats going on I would read the links below on HDV, M2T(transport stream), and the Blu-Ray disc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDV
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M2t
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu_ray#Media_format


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Bob Dix
Re: 1920 X 1080 vs 1440 X 1080
on Nov 19, 2010 at 10:39:19 pm

@1920 x 1080 through HDMI you have very accute eyesight, I cannot see it. The out put from both cameras are the equivalent of or better than High Definition Broadcast signals 1920 x 1080 in PAL Australia ? '>Agreed, but, if you can see the difference on a Full High Definition Monitor of a Canon HV20/30/40 and direct connection of the High Definition from a Canon 5D mark II @1920 x 1080 through HDMI you have very accute eyesight, I cannot see it. The out put from both cameras are the equivalent of or better than High Definition Broadcast signals 1920 x 1080 in PAL Australia ?

You can tell the difference in SD but, a lot of USA material shown on High definition channels in Australia is not HD with perhaps the one exception , sports telecasts, golf etc. even some movies would not pass VHS muster let alone Tv soapies.?

Freelance Imaging & Video
AUSTRALIA


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Brian Louis
Re: 1920 X 1080 vs 1440 X 1080
on Nov 21, 2010 at 7:39:53 pm

[Bob Dix] "Agreed, but, if you can see the difference on a Full High Definition Monitor of a Canon HV20/30/40 and direct connection of the High Definition from a Canon 5D mark II @1920 x 1080 through HDMI"

Bob:
I don't know what you are refering to, the OP was asking questions about why the HV40 was saying it was a 1920x1080 and was putting 1440x1080 on the tape, I didn't make any comparison about the 1920x1080 HDMI a live HV40 and a 5D, I just was saying that if he wanted the full 1920x1080 from the HV40 he would have to use it as a live cam and capture via HDMI vice tape.


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Bob Dix
Re: 1920 X 1080 vs 1440 X 1080
on Nov 21, 2010 at 10:52:37 pm

Yes, Brian.


Iam agreeing with you , it is that the numbers 1920 x 1080 are correct but, either way I personally cannot see any difference between 1440 x 1080 which is the standard HDV recorded from the Canon XL H1,XH G1 the XH A1 and the HV20/30/40 to 1920 x 1080i of a High Definition Monitor ? Nor in many cases the 1920 x 1080i out put from the Canon 5D mark II via HDMI or after being Exported from Premiere Pro on tape or blu-ray at 1440 x 1080 @25mbps or 38.5 mbps in H.264 or mpeg-2.

Freelance Imaging & Video
AUSTRALIA


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Brian Louis
Re: 1920 X 1080 vs 1440 X 1080
on Nov 22, 2010 at 7:15:24 pm

[Bob Dix] "I personally cannot see any difference between 1440 x 1080 which is the standard HDV recorded from the Canon XL H1,XH G1 the XH A1 and the HV20/30/40 to 1920 x 1080i of a High Definition Monitor"
The acuity of the eye changes with age, most people delude themselves into seeing what they can't, although its hard to see differences between HD formats unless you have young eyes and know what you are looking for, the difference between full HD and anamorphic with limited color space comes into play when adding effects, color, keying, generally coding and decoding video while editing and compositing, the higher the res and color space the better the possibilities of edit.


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Bob Dix
Re: 1920 X 1080 vs 1440 X 1080
on Nov 22, 2010 at 10:08:21 pm

How true, Brian.

It will come to all of us ? Thanks for your interest.

Freelance Imaging & Video
AUSTRALIA


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