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I want to clone HDV tape from Sony M15U to DV deck via FireWire

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Todd Papaleo
I want to clone HDV tape from Sony M15U to DV deck via FireWire
on May 14, 2008 at 5:35:09 pm

Hi, Folks,

New to the Cow, but oh, so thankful. I have a project in which the client wants to clone his HDV tapes, shot on an XLH1. We rented a Sony M15U to play his tapes (although we could rent another Canon HDV camera if necessary, but I'd like to avoid that).

I was told by the place that rented me the deck that, if both decks were connected via FireWire, then the HDV tape could be cloned to the DV deck, since we both assumed that it is just data going from one to the other.

Is it necessary to have another HDV deck (and an HDV tape for that matter) to accept the FireWire signal and lay it down on the DV tape correctly? I tried a couple runs, and the tape indicator only shows the recording on the clone as being DV.

What is the best and quickest way to clone an HDV tape with what we have?


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Donald Berube
Re: I want to clone HDV tape from Sony M15U to DV deck via FireWire
on May 28, 2008 at 9:19:17 pm

You need two (2) HDV decks or camcorders compatible with the HDV 1080i (60i) format. Using a standard definition DV deck will not help you produce an HDV clone.

- Don
http://noisybrain.com
http://www.bosfcpug.org



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Marlon Diaz
Re: I want to clone HDV tape from Sony M15U to DV deck via FireWire
on Sep 18, 2008 at 12:52:33 am

Todd:

I need to do the same with footage on mini DV tapes that was recorded using the Canon XL-H1 at 1080i/30F. Did you find any solution to your project?

I got 20 mini DV tapes that need to be cloned for a client.

Miami, FL


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Todd Papaleo
Re: I want to clone HDV tape from Sony M15U to DV deck via FireWire
on Sep 18, 2008 at 2:21:13 am

Marlon,

We ended up digitizing the client's tapes since he needed to edit with them anyway, and it worked out best for him in the long run.

But from people I have talked to and what I have read, you can clone as long as you have the deck set to DVCAM mode, which locks the audio on output. It's not possible to lock down the audio on miniDV because it doesn't record the audio locked down - there is some play.

From the DV entry on Wikipedia: "DVCAM and DVCPRO both use locked audio while standard DV does not. This means that at any one point on a DV tape the audio may be +/- ⅓ frame out of sync with the video. However, this is the maximum drift of the audio/video sync; it is not compounded throughout the recording. In DVCAM and DVCPRO recordings the audio sync is permanently linked to the video sync."

From a cached page from the College of Communication at U of Texas in Austin: "Audio Lock - DVCAM's audio is tightly locked to the video signal. Since miniDV was designed as a consumer format, unlocked audio was allowed as a cost-saving measure. In unlocked audio, the audio clock is allowed some imprecision, such that there can be a variation from the locked spec of up to +/- 25 audio samples written to tape for every frame, instead of a precise and exact number. It's the difference between walking a dog on a short leather leash, always forcing the dog to stay right by your side (locked audio), and using a long, elastic leash or one of those "retractable clothesline" leashes that allows the dog to run ahead a bit or lag behind (unlocked audio). In either case both you and the dog will get where you're going at the same time, but along the way the "unlocked" dog has a bit more freedom to deviate from your exact walking pace.

"Timecode - DVCAM incorporates true SMPTE timecode rather than the ABS (absolute time code) used in miniDV."

So to make a true clone, one would need to use a deck that can lock down the audio on play and record. To do this with miniDV, you need to record in DVCAM mode, I think.

Also, I know that Canon's nonstandard F settings cause problems with those tapes being played on other decks. Only another Canon deck will be able to play it.

Hope some of this helps, and if any reads this post and knows some of these things to be not true, please let me know.

Best of luck!




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Marlon Diaz
Re: I want to clone HDV tape from Sony M15U to DV deck via FireWire
on Sep 18, 2008 at 3:21:34 pm

Todd: Would you know if the deck (M15U) will playback my mini DV tapes I got recorded at 1080i/30F ? I rented the camera so I only have the tapes. From what I have been reading it is best to import all the footage with a DVCPRO HD codec.

Yeah I think im going to digitize the tapes into a hard drive and give him the tapes plus a hard drive(s).

From Canon's website: 1080i/30F is 1080i/29.97 interlaced - with a progressive "look" at 30 Frames.

-Marlon

Miami, FL


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Todd Papaleo
Re: I want to clone HDV tape from Sony M15U to DV deck via FireWire
on Sep 19, 2008 at 1:56:54 am

I will ask my friend tomorrow, but I think it will. We used a Sony deck (I will check the model tomorrow, but it is the lower-end M; 35 I think?)

Although the footage is interlace, it is what Canon does to achieve the progessive look that makes their tapes difficult to play properly, if at all.

I think there is a thread somewhere on Cow if you search for Canon HDV and Sony in the same search field...

More info tomorrow - !



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