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anna conlon
Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 6, 2010 at 8:18:33 pm

I've been at this two full days now and i'm tearing my hair out!

My sample DVD fails every time at the vitrify point of burning. All the information appears to be on the DVD but I cant risk send it out if its not perfect as it's my sample work and therefore its very important to create the right impression.

I'm working of MAC with DVD studio pro 4 I build and formats the disk on my Desktop. I have an external drive where most of my source files are stored. Within DVD studio pro my file are mpegs. I have a few mpegs side by side on the time line. I read that this my be causing my problem so I tried a method of exporting the mpeg to a full length Video Stream and reimporting this file but the same problem reoccurred

This file used to work perfectly (apart form the odd disc failing) but suddenly its not happy and cant get past the last part in the burn process verification .....grrrrrrrrrr

can anyone help i'm going mad fast


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anna conlon
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 6, 2010 at 8:34:29 pm

I've just tried to build and format another file with DVD stuido pro as a test to see if i get and problems and this message appeared

The file is locked and cannot be opened for writing. Unlock the file and try again.



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Terry Mikkelsen
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 6, 2010 at 8:56:42 pm

Check permissions on ALL files used in the project.

Tech-T Productions
http://www.technical-t.com


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Michael Sacci
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 6, 2010 at 9:53:08 pm

How is the hard drive that you are building the project formatted. These are not normal issues

In your first post how exactly are you formatting the disc. There is no verification in dvdsp.


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Noah Kadner
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 6, 2010 at 11:51:14 pm

Yeah I haven't verified a disc since I gave toast the boot a few years ago...

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera!
Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio with Call Box Training. Featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, Canon EOS 5D Mark II and Canon 7D.
Learn DSLR Cinematography.


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anna conlon
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 7, 2010 at 9:12:38 am

Hi everyone and thanks for the reply's

Terry I'm not sure how to check the permission? can you explain further?

Michael And the method I'm using is a ken stone method I build and format the disk to my desktop and then used disk utility to burn the disk at the slowest method possible 2.4

In a desperate measure I've watched over the samples that failed (hoping they would work and they work ok except in certain parts. I have one main mpeg (which played fine) and then a 2 smaller mpegs lined up together on the time line and I don't think it likes it. I'll try exporting a video stream mpeg again even thought it didn't really work the last time .......but desperate times


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Michael Sacci
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 7, 2010 at 9:27:16 am

I'm not a big fan of some of the stuff on Ken Stone's site with regards to DVDSP. That process is just crazy. DO the Build and Format to a DIsc, DVDSP can burn the disc just fine, burn at slower speeds is not necessary these days. Just buy top end media that is rated for 8x and but done with it.

It is never a good idea to string m2v videos in the same title set, it should always be encoded as a single video.

You also have not posted process of creating the m2v files, what audio codec you are using (should be ac3) and the bitrate of the video.


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anna conlon
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 7, 2010 at 10:15:06 am

I'm using AC3 not sure about the bit rate what should it be exactly do I set this when I"m in compressor?

What media do you recommend I dont mind spending as it would save so much time and pain

"You also have not posted process of creating the m2v files" I create them in compressor 90min best DVD ....I would re extport the file but the problem is i dont have the originally Quick time so i'm trying to export the mpeg to on single video stream from DVD studio pro hope full this will work

I switch to the ken stone method when I was having problems with disc failing when they went out to customers even though the burn process appeared to work


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eric pautsch
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 7, 2010 at 12:50:46 pm

Try the Michael Sacci method :) Check your bitrate in Compressor's Inspector. Use AC3 audio as well.



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Terry Mikkelsen
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 7, 2010 at 2:11:01 pm

This particular "Ken Stone method" is very sound and true. Nothing wrong with it. I do the same thing and here are the reasons why:

1. The simulator in DVDSP and the software DVD player can play back differently. (Rendering of menus, transitions, pauses, breakpoints, etc....) So you must proof your final project off a DVD disc or DVD image on a hard drive.
2. The build & burn to hard drive is much faster than burning a disc.
3. If I need to burn a second or even third copy for a client, I don't need to rebuild or risk having any changes occur. I just burn from the master .img file.
4. I can FTP the .img file for duplication.
5. I can archive the .img file.

All of this from one single process...its much faster.


Now, back to why your disc won't build correctly. You post states that the error message is that "the file is locked". Unfortunately, we can't determine if that file is an asset, the DVDSP project file, or the temp .img file. So we have to try and tackle them all.

1. Asset file is "locked".
Check the file permissions for each asset used in the project. (CMD+i or right-click and choose "Get Info") Make sure "you can Read & Write" for each file and that the "Locked" check box is NOT checked.

2. DVDSP project file is inaccessible.
Try to do a "save as..." for the project and see if the new file works.

3. Temp file is unhappy.
Make sure you are writing your .img file to a happy place. If you have "FileVault" turned on, do not write the .img to desktop, documents or other user specific places. Instead write to a common area, such as the base directory ("c:/" or "Macintosh HD/") (You can check "FileVault" settings in the System Preferences>Security.)

I wouldn't do these in this exact order though, now that I am looking it over. Option 1 will take the most time to do. I guess I would try Option 2 first. If that doesn't work then try Option 3, followed by Option 1. If you perform all three and still have trouble give us a hollaback.

Tech-T Productions
http://www.technical-t.com


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Randy Lee
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 7, 2010 at 3:17:10 pm

One of the only things that has caused DVDs to not verify for me lately has been moving the computer while it is burning - something that should (obviously) be avoided. You never stated what sort of computer you're on, so if you're on a laptop and it is moving at all while you're burning, that could do it. Hopefully unless you're in an emergency situation on location somewhere that would never happen, but you never know.


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Michael Sacci
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 7, 2010 at 4:27:47 pm

Sorry there no way a 3 step process is faster than a 2 step process. Plus DVDSP does not have to build the project every time in order to make a disc. The Format will use just the previous build that is on the hard drive. Plus the fact that you are burning at a fast speed within DVDSP it is really the faster process.

.img files have always been problematic, not to say they don't work but they can be source of issues. If you are ftp'ing files it is better to write a DDP 2.0 file (Zipped). Same as when send the file on a hard drive.

But hey to each there know.

Anna - also the 90 min preset is a waste of time and can cause playback issue. If your movie is under 90 minutes change the encoding to CBR instead of VBR. Bitrate set at 6.3Mbps. Audio needs to be ac3 @ .192 Mbps for stereo. There are a lot of things that make disc not very compatible but burning with the finder never helps. It may not hurt but it never helps.

Also what do you mean - "Quick time so i'm trying to export the mpeg to on single video stream from DVD studio pro hope full this will work " DVDSP doesn't export streams. There is a program called Mpeg Append and it will properly stitch 2 or more m2v files together and give you a valid single file.


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Terry Mikkelsen
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 7, 2010 at 5:25:31 pm

Sorry there no way a 3 step process is faster than a 2 step process.

I guess I didn't clarify the speed issue.

You need to proof your project, right? If I burn a disc and watch it on a TV, that is a good way to do it. But, if I just make an .img file, I am skipping the burning process. So, I am now proofing the project sooner by not burning a disc. If I need to make changes I don't have a coaster and each subsequent change is faster and faster without a burn each time.
Now, if you are doing 10 & 20 minute projects, these time savings can be viewed as negligible, but when you are looking a filling a disc, whether it is DVD-5 or -9, these savings are mandatory. And if you need to make multiple copies, tying up DVDSP for burning is not advisable if you could be working on other paying work instead of watching a progress bar.

.img files have always been problematic...

As far as an .img file being problematic...I have never had a single problem. Having said that though, you refer to FTPing files, and I never FTP raw files (unless html, jpg, gif, etc...) as binary vs ascii encoding transmissions can corrupt a file. It is always wise to compress a file (.zip or .sit) for transfers (not for space savings as that is negligible in this instance).

...the 90 min preset is a waste of time and can cause playback issue.

How has the 90min preset ever caused playback issues? (Assuming your total assets fit within the space requirements of the disc). I don't know of any bugs or mis-calculations in that preset. So, yes it may take longer to encode vs a CBR setting, but not an error causing issue.

Tech-T Productions
http://www.technical-t.com


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Noah Kadner
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 7, 2010 at 5:38:00 pm

I loves me some Ken Stone but you have to realize much of the stuff that's up there is very old and outdated in terms of technique. So I'd take what you read up there with a grain of salt. I have never and would never use Disk Utility to burn a DVD authored in DVDSP- way too many chances to screw things up as you've found. Just do it in DVDSP as simple as possible. I've authored dozens and dozens of discs for replication and duplication this way and never had a single issue.

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera!
Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio with Call Box Training. Featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, Canon EOS 5D Mark II and Canon 7D.
Learn DSLR Cinematography.


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Terry Mikkelsen
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 7, 2010 at 5:51:32 pm

I've authored dozens and dozens of discs for replication and duplication this way and never had a single issue.

I too have authored many discs with .img files without a single issue. (Though I've never used the Finder to burn my disc, so I don't know if that makes a difference. I use Toast.) But the point is that Anna is not getting to the burning process, from what I can tell in her posts. So it seems that either method is not going to help at this point. The problem lies within the project, its assets or temp files.

Tech-T Productions
http://www.technical-t.com


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Michael Sacci
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 7, 2010 at 6:54:17 pm

[Terry Mikkelsen] "Though I've never used the Finder to burn my disc, so I don't know if that makes a difference. I use Toast.) "

But burning with the Finder is what this thread is about. I have no problem with Toast but that is different from burning with the finder.

And no matter how you look at it your way is an extra step, if you like it fine, not trying to get you off of it but it is an extra step that is not needed. If I want to proof a DVD I just do the build, why do I need that in an img file? That is an extra step. Then if I need to Format and there are no changes DVDSP uses that Build folder and no extra time is spent. If I do want to use Toast to burn the DVD once again I use the Build folder.

And as I read the Anna's probably is that she is not getting through the burn process. It is hanging on Verify, which for me means the burn has taken place and the computer is checking the burn.

I'm just trying to give her the easiest way to get her job done.


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Terry Mikkelsen
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 7, 2010 at 7:11:51 pm

I've just tried to build and format another file with DVD stuido pro as a test to see if i get and problems and this message appeared

The file is locked and cannot be opened for writing. Unlock the file and try again.


Sorry, I was mostly responding to this post by Anna. When I initially read it, it appeared to me to be clarification to her initial post, not a separate issue. Now, I am a bit confused.

Maybe Anna can repost (with an update) some more detailed information on what the problem exactly is, the steps taken to produce that problem and what steps have been taken already to fix the problem.

Tech-T Productions
http://www.technical-t.com


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anna conlon
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 10, 2010 at 5:20:01 pm

Hi Everyone

First of all thanks so much for all the help. I have six potential customers waiting on my sample so this is very important I really appreciate the help and time you've all given. Where would i be without creative cow!

Sorry for the delayed response ...I've been following all of the advice and the problem still isn't fully resolved. I have however gotten one disk to burn successfully (still using the ken stone method) I then tried it again and got the bloody verification message again.

Terry - i checked all permission and File vault and I'm ok there. Unfortunately the save as didn't make a difference but it was worth a go!

Micheal - Most of my movies are 90min because they are weddings I've checked the bit rate and they seem to be already set as you've advised. I think I may have in the past had problems with the bit rate and that's why they are set correctly but I will be sure to keep an eye to this when i'm compressing . On another thread I read that it was bad to string mpegs together and I do think this is defiantly where part of my problem is rising. Within DVDSP i've gone to the export>mpeg file. This has given me on single video stream mpeg which I've then reimported to replace the string of mpegs on the time line. Because I've done this the build and format I send to my desktop works every time. This is one problem solved.

Another thing I was doing wrong (and this is very stupid) i wasnt unselecting the lossless during the build and format. As soon as I did I didnt get any messages about permission again. i dont know how they relate but they must some how

I think that the disc I've been using are part of the problem but only part. I'm using new disc TDK +R and i'm having more success.

So to recap - Lossless been switched on was one major problem
- The DVD quality made the burns unsucessfull part of the time
- and the string of mpegs was not helping either


Currently i'm trying not to send to the desk top and I'm just burning directly in DVDSP to see if I have any more luck with that. I will report back


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anna conlon
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 10, 2010 at 5:45:31 pm

ok I've just tried to do a burn directly in DVDSP and it gave me the thumbs burned successfully but then when i tried to watch it it stalls at the end ....its actually in the roughly the same place near the end of the dvd where every disc is failing .....i'm going to try a build in DVDSP to see if I get any error messages.

I've been thinking that with the one disc that seems to be ok should i try and get copies of it?? or is that risky?


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Michael Sacci
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 10, 2010 at 7:20:00 pm

Anna, you need to give detailed list of your settings, all your settings. All the steps you are taking. Comments like, "I checked the settings and they are correct" are not helpful. What do you mean by stalls? for a sec? stops the DVD? Freezes on that frame?

You are simply all over the place is describing what you are doing.

+R media is never recommended. This is more of a playback thing, -R are safer for compatibility.

Within DVDSP there are 2 ways to make a disc. Burn (I never recommend) or Build and Format. Once you build a project you can just use Format if no changes are made to the project. You should be using the Build and Format. Yes it is a good idea to uncheck loseless linking.

The m2v files need to be clean and single files within each track. The audio needs to be ac3 and not uncompressed PCM.

So if you want more help you need to provide a simple step by step list of what you are doing and details of your settings.

Also what HD are you using for your build Video TS, how is that formatted.



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anna conlon
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 10, 2010 at 8:23:26 pm

Hi I've re read my post and I'm sorry I though I was been clear

no were in my post did i say "I checked the settings and they are correct" I did however say "I've checked the bit rate and they seem to be already set as you've advised".

and what I meant by that was you earlier advised "Bitrate set at 6.3Mbps. Audio needs to be ac3 @ .192 Mbps" I checked my files and the bitrate and audio are at these correct settings. Again sorry if my post were confusing I was trying to reply to everyone's suggestions and therefore my post my seem a little confusing.

As for how i'm burning the files I've tried every method Build/Build and Format and the ken stone method. At the moment I'm doing a Build and then Format inside DVDSP. I've purchased new disc and I have both DVD- and DVD+ media and they are both producing unreliable results. At the minute almost every second disc fails. Really random? I am just persisting with burning and frustrated because its really not making any sense.

I understand if everyone is sick of this thread ...this just doesn't seem solvable.


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Michael Sacci
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 10, 2010 at 9:15:00 pm

The frustration is that I'm asking for details, step by step details of your procedures. A list of all your settings. I've asked about your system and HD, don't see an answer.

To put it another way I would like a list of what you are doing and then the result. No more paragraphs.

So if you want me to help that is what I need.


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Terry Mikkelsen
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 12, 2010 at 2:26:42 pm

Anna,
I know its frustrating to have these problems, but don't let it get to you yet. You have taken great strides and eliminated a few possibilities.

Here is my main thought. If the disc that successfully burned is stalling in the middle of a video asset (not a jump command or other authoring option), then the media (audio/video not DVD) is to be suspect. I have never "export" a string of MPEGs from DVDSP to make a single file. No one else seems to be complaining about this, so it may be a valid workflow. I have and often DO have many different MPEG files within the same track and not had any problems. (I do this to mix different encode settings for different scenes depending upon complexity and composites)
So again, if the video is stalling, lets check it. Open the single long .m2v file in Quicktime, scan to near the stalling point and let it play and see what happens. If it glitches, flashes, gets blocky or anything other than your great video (even for just one frame), that would indicate a problem. I would then check the smaller .m2v file that was strung together. IF that file is also bad, then check the source file you placed in Compressor, and keep going back till you find a "clean copy".

Tech-T Productions
http://www.technical-t.com


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Michael Sacci
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 12, 2010 at 5:55:27 pm

[Terry Mikkelsen] "I have never "export" a string of MPEGs from DVDSP to make a single file"
That is because there is no such feature within DVDSP. Using multiple m2v assets in a single video stream has always been a problem. There is a program (Mpeg Amend) that can stitch these files together give you a valid single video. It is not a valid workflow if you want playback compatibility.

I agree that her problem is probably the video stream but more than likely it is a spike in the bitrate which cannot be seen in a player, and this could be a combo of the file and the media. It could also be she has a command placed in a chapter marker. It can be several things


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Terry Mikkelsen
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 12, 2010 at 6:01:46 pm

Using multiple m2v assets in a single video stream has always been a problem.

That's interesting that you have that problem, as I have never had a problem doing that. It is also a convenience (besides encoding different bitrates) in that you can right click on an m2v file in the track and select "add chapter marking to clip end". (LOVE THAT COMMAND)

Tech-T Productions
http://www.technical-t.com


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Terry Mikkelsen
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 12, 2010 at 6:12:11 pm

Sorry to beat this thing to death, but I think I found some clarrification!

I thought it odd that the command "place chapter marker at clip end" exists, if you shouldn't have more than one clip per track. Started looking through the manual. Page 368 talks about timecode and it referencing the clip (depending on which clip you have selected) with a screenshot showing multiple clips on the track (along with a clearer image on 369).
BUT, then I see a really interesting highlighted box on page 371:

About Segmented MPEG Files
The segmented MPEG files created by some third-party encoders do not import
correctly into DVD Studio Pro. Some encoders segment their large encoded files into
1 GB files. When imported into DVD Studio Pro, only the first 1 GB segment is
imported. You need to append the files into a single file before importing the asset
into DVD Studio Pro. There are several third-party applications that can be used to
append a segmented MPEG file into a single file.


So you don't want "automatically" segmented files, but "manually" (by exporting separate .mov files from FCP) segmenting is OK. It must be some kind of flags used by the encoder or incomplete GOPs in the segmented files that give DVDSP the hassle.

Tech-T Productions
http://www.technical-t.com


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anna conlon
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Jul 13, 2010 at 8:53:35 am

I did finally get enough DVDs working to get the urgent samples I needed.

The problem defiantly related to the string of Mpeg. Watching over the DVD's it stalling always occurred where the mpegs joined up. Doing the video stream helped a little but didn't fully resolve the problem. What I have to do now is return to final cut create one .mov and then compress that into one mpeg file.

-I also was leaving lossless switched on
-and my DVDs wasn't the best quality

Hopefully this thread will help someone with similar problems

thanks to all who took time out to help


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anna conlon
Re: Cant get DVD to verify!
on Aug 12, 2010 at 10:46:37 am

I really hate to start this head wrecking thread back up but I'm starting to have the same unexplained problems .....AGAIN.

Just to refresh ...Even though formatting my sample DVD appeared to be successful. On half of the disc I tested it would stall at the same point on the disc with green banding, freezing and jumping.

I'm using a

-Mac OS X 10.5.8 with 2GHz Power PC 5 and 2GB memory and western digital MYbook external hard drive
-I created my sample file in final cut and export as .mov 126min long
-I use compressor to create my mpeg2 and dolby digital files
-I then create my DVD stuido pro file with motion menu audio and chapters.
-The motion menu is created in After effects as .mov and then compresses to mpeg2 and audio format is .aiff this is used in the menu
-I build the file to my desktop and then format
-I also tried building the file to my desktop and then used disc utility to burn the disc at the slowest rate possible (x2) both burning methods produced the same unreliable results (some disc worked some stalled)

When consulting this forum we identified a few things that may be causing the problem

-I was leaving lossless switched on when formatting the disc
-The DVDs I was using wasn't the very best quality possible
-I was stringing together mpges in the time line

I resolved all of the above. The most complicated was stringing together mpeg2. In order to avoid this I had to go back to final cut create on uninterpreted .mov and re-compressed this file. I also cut footage at the point where the disc stalled the majority of the time. I replaced this with new footage. I created an entirely new DVD studio file. Even though this new file worked the first few burns it has started to stall again on testing. This time randomly at different point on the disc. It gives green bands and then stops and jumps or completely stops.

Just as an experiment I tested a DVD in my DVD player at home and it stalled at one point and competently stopped. I took this DVD and tested in another DVD player and it worked perfectly. I then tried the same DVD back in my own DVD player and now its working perfectly. I've tested it several times on both DVD players and its almost as if its gotten better??? I've tried this with a few DVD that were stalling and they work now on another player. Can DVD players damage disc ...The more testing I do the more confussed I become.

-The way I test the DVD is by forwarding them by x8 speed. I know the footage so well that i can see very quickly if the disc stalls slightly

I have spent weeks trying to resolve this problem. Could it lie in DVD player? I know this sound stupid but can you damage a DVD in a player and you make it better in another. Clutching at straws! I want to put and end to this so I can move on and do actual work!


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