FORUMS: list search recent posts

Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)

COW Forums : Lighting Design

<< PREVIOUS   •   VIEW ALL   •   PRINT   •   NEXT >>
Kyle Campbell
Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Oct 19, 2013 at 7:41:01 pm

I'm trying to figure out this green screen stuff- currently using a halogen work light (such as for auto repair work) on each side of my green screen.

THE PROBLEM:
The height of the bulb(from the ground) is about 4 feet up(half the height of my green screen) so the green screen is lit very bright in the center, and darker towards the top and bottom. This is causing keying issues in Premiere.

I would like to find some lights particularly for lighting the green screen that have bulbs at multiple height points, or whatever the best way is to evenly light the screen.

Here is a pic of my green screen when lit:
http://tinypic.com/r/2iuoy84/5

Thanks for all the help guys, I really get awesome advice here! I've been searching on Amazon but they just don't have anything very practical.


Return to posts index

john sharaf
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Oct 19, 2013 at 8:07:03 pm

HI Kyle,

The best solution is 4' Kino Flo's set vertically, either or four banks depending on the distance and illumination level you need. It's also worth considering the 4Banks even if you only use one or two globes as they are very versatile lights to use for other location purposes. You can consider lamping them with KF Green Tubes to get the best green saturation.

Next best fix is diffusion to make the light less sourcey and to cast a more even field. This might require backing the lights up (if you have room) and shielding the spill onto your foreground subject. This is the beauty of the Kino Flos; they are soft proximity lights with built in barndoors to control the spill.

There's lots of good advice on the Kino Flo website regarding green/blue screen photography, check it out.

JS



Return to posts index

Todd Terry
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Oct 19, 2013 at 8:36:20 pm

[john sharaf] "The best solution is 4' Kino Flo's set vertically,"

John is absolutely correct, as most always....

A 4' Kino is the best solution...

However, a 4' flo shoplight is the cheapest solution.

Some people may scoff, but we use the inexpensive shop lights from Home Depot all the time for non-critical things like greenscreen illumination or wall washing.

Are they as good as Kinos? No, not at all. But they are 15 bucks each, as opposed to $1500 for a Kino... literally a hundredth the cost. I love Kinos and for many applications I wouldn't use anything else. But for something like greenscreen illumination, often times "good enough" is, well, good enough.

We've even taken a few shop lights and modified them (painted the outsides black, installed switches, attached 5/8" posts to them so they can be used in an ordinary grip head)... and frankly they work like a charm...



They are a great alternative if you want to go the cheap DIY route.

T2

__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com



Return to posts index


Kyle Campbell
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Oct 20, 2013 at 3:23:07 pm

Nice tip T2. Where do you get materials to make custom stands like that for you lights?


Return to posts index

Todd Terry
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Oct 22, 2013 at 3:10:33 am

Well, I didn't make the stands, obviously... they're just C-stands.

I'm guessing you meant the posts on the instruments which I use with stands and grip heads. Those items are all from the same hardware store where I bought the fixtures. They are just strip aluminum (inside and out), 5/8" bolts, and washers.

The bolts that I get from Home Depot are great for making 5/8" posts, because with the longer bolts they are only threaded for a couple of inches...the rest of the shaft is unthreaded. So you can easily sandwich the nuts/washers and attach them to your fixture. Cut off the bolt heads, and voilĂ , you have a standard baby pin that will fit in any grip head or baby receiver.

T2

__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com



Return to posts index

Kyle Campbell
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Oct 24, 2013 at 3:29:29 am

Kino flos are out of my price range at the moment.

I tried using fluorescent shop lights from my house and I positioned them on the green screen from both sides, however they are just not very bright.

What do you think about using softboxes for illuminating the green screen itself? Or perhaps another type of light. I'm going to test out some softboxes right now.


Return to posts index


Todd Terry
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Oct 24, 2013 at 3:43:33 am

Well, nothing really beats flos for greenscreen work, either Kino, another brand, or DIY as suggested.

Softboxes could work, if you have a pretty large studio space and can position the softboxes fairly far away from the greenscreen (and, obviously, position them so they are not hitting your talent). Otherwise you're still going to get hotspots, just like with your halogen worklights (maybe not quite as hot as those hotspots, but the screen will still not be even, same as the situation you had before).

I'm surprised you didn't find the shoplight flos to be bright enough. We use those (two-tube 4' ones) for greenscreening all the time, and ours are plenty bright. In fact, sometimes we take one tube out of each fixture because in some positions they are too bright. Maybe the lighting on your talent is much more than it needs to be?... just a thought.

As for other options, Flolight does make a single LED light just for greenscreening... I haven't used it (or even seen it in person), but it does look interesting...

http://www.flolight.com/led-lighting/cyclight.html

T2

__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com



Return to posts index

Kyle Campbell
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Nov 3, 2013 at 5:17:03 pm

After using them a little more I've changed my mind completely.

These shop lights really are the best for green screen work!

I find they are bright enough with proper positioning and there is less key work in premiere since they are not overly bright.

Now I need to construct the stands and want to do exactly what you did, Todd. I have a couple questions if you are still monitoring this thread, though.

Can you adjust the angle in a grip head so that the "arm" going through it is level? The ones I see advertised show the arm going through the grip head at an angle upwards, and I just want to be sure I can make this sit level for the post.

If you can recommend the particular c-stands/grip heads you use I'll just buy those.

Thanks for your help. This idea rocks. I'm going to Home Depot right now to get some bolts and lights.


Return to posts index

Todd Terry
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Nov 3, 2013 at 10:24:22 pm

Hi Kyle... glad those shop lights are working for you. I figured they were bright enough depending on how you use them, mine are more than enough.

[Kyle Campbell] "Can you adjust the angle in a grip head so that the "arm" going through it is level?"

You can adjust a grip head in most any position. With the flos I don't use a grip arm though... just a C-stand and grip head, putting the post on the instrument right into the head.

[Kyle Campbell] "If you can recommend the particular c-stands/grip heads you use I'll just buy those. "

Well, lots of choices but most are very similar. I personally like Matthews C-stands, although they are going to be one of the more expensive options. There are other brands that are a fair bit cheaper. All of my bases and risers are Matthews. My grip heads are a mix of Matthews and a couple of other brands, but the Matthews ones are the best of what I have. For greenscreen work with the flos I usually use the shortest C-stand risers, which are more than tall enough. For work on stage you'd likely just need the plain 'ol regular turtle bases for the risers... no need for the adjustable "Rocky Mountain" leg ones.

You can down load the whole Matthews catalog at http://www.msegrip.com/ (you can download the catalog by chapter at http://www.msegrip.com/blog-content/?p=2090). Find what you like, then order it usually cheaper from your favorite vendor (whomever you usually buy stuff from, we usually just go to B&H Photo).

A couple of links...

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?Ntt=matthews+c-stand&N=0&InitialSearch...

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/33054-REG/Matthews_339574_Century_C_S...

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/139495-REG/Matthews_350580_Hollywood_...

T2

__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com



Return to posts index


Craig Alan
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Dec 7, 2013 at 6:22:38 pm

Are you putting kino flo bulbs in these shop lights? If not what bulbs are they? They come in different color temps at different price points. Also some shop lights are noisy. Is there one at depot that has a decent ballast that is quiet?

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Camcorders: Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV30/40, Sony Z7U, VX2000, PD170; FCP 6 certified; write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


Return to posts index

Todd Terry
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Dec 7, 2013 at 8:08:15 pm

Hi Craig...

No, I'm not using Kino bulbs in my DIY instruments. The only thing I've ever put Kino bulbs in is a real Kino fixture.

Honestly for greenscreen work I've never found color temp (or the green spike that some flos have) to be at all critical. So we just use the bulbs from the same hardware store... couldn't tell you the brand. They are available in (approximately) both daylight and tungsten temps, and we have sets of each.

I never use these instruments to light people, but I've found the color more than accurate enough for more than greenscreen work... non-green wallwashing, etc. In fact, whenever we are called on to do a white limbo background, these are what I use. If I am doing Kino or HMI or LED lighting I'll put the more-or-less daylight balanced tubes in them... if I am doing tungsten lighting I'll use the other.

You can (kinda) see a couple of them in use in the behind-the-scenes photos from this commercial shoot...

http://fantasticplastic.com/portfolio/news082.html

In the middle photo on the left you can see one of them on the floor shooting up, wall washing. Near the middle of that same photo you can see a vertical one on a stand. This shoot was a mixture of real tungsten and tungsten-balanced LED lighting, so we had the warmer bulbs in the flos.

Maybe I got lucky with these. When I first bought them, since they were $15 fixtures I figured the ballasts were junk (either noisy or flickery) and I'd have to replace them... but I haven't had to. I have noticed some "phasing" when shooting film (my 35mm camera does not, sadly, have a variable-angle shutter), but not real flickering. No flickering when shooting video, either... I don't even have to shoot clearscan with them.

Give 'em a try.

T2

__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com



Return to posts index

Craig Alan
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Dec 8, 2013 at 2:23:42 am

Thanks Todd,

I have students asking about equipment on the cheap all the time.

What did you use to cut off the top of the bolt and drill the hole in the fixture to accomadate it?

Did you file the end of the bolt so it would't have a sharp edge?

I assume the strip aluminum was needed to support the cheap metal of the shop light?

I was concerned about buzz because my shop lights in the garage buzz light crazy even though I asked for quiet ballast at the time. But that was many years ago and they are still working.

Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Camcorders: Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV30/40, Sony Z7U, VX2000, PD170; FCP 6 certified; write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.


Return to posts index


Todd Terry
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Dec 8, 2013 at 4:19:51 am

[Craig Alan] "What did you use to cut off the top of the bolt and drill the hole in the fixture to accomadate it? "

Bolt head was cut off with a metal-cutting blade in a reciprocating saw. The hole was drilled with... (spoiler alert)... a drill bit.


[Craig Alan] "Did you file the end of the bolt so it would't have a sharp edge?"

Yes I spun the bolt while touching the cut edge to the wheel of a bench grinder to clean up the cut and put a small 45° bevel on it.


[Craig Alan] "I assume the strip aluminum was needed to support the cheap metal of the shop light? "

Exactly.


[Craig Alan] "I was concerned about buzz "

Me too, but turns out mine are perfectly silent, and as I said no flicker. Maybe I got lucky. It's a gamble, but at least a very low-dollar one.

T2

__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com



Return to posts index

Erik Rosenbluh
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Feb 27, 2014 at 2:14:17 am

Hey Todd, can you make ME a couple of those lights? :-)


Return to posts index

Todd Terry
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Feb 27, 2014 at 2:42:25 am

Haaa.... sure.

Their components are so cheap it would probably literally cost more to ship them to you than for you to buy the parts.

T2

__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com



Return to posts index


Erik Rosenbluh
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Feb 27, 2014 at 2:45:33 am

Unfortunately I don't have a workshop in my apartment.


Return to posts index

Jeff Zinn
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Oct 1, 2014 at 1:48:43 pm

Thanks guys. I've been scratching my head over green screen lighting. Started off with soft lights from a kit but they produce hot spots. The Kinos are WAY too expensive. Suspected I could get away with standard issue shop lights but wondered if I should try to match a specific color temp. This info is super helpful. BTW, Greenscreener app for iPhone/Pad is awesome. Gives you a clear read on what your GS lighting is actually doing.


Return to posts index

Isaac Freeman
Re: Best Lights To Illuminate Green Screen (not object lights- example pic)
on Dec 16, 2014 at 7:09:05 pm

Hi Kyle! I am just getting into green screen. I came across your post about lighting the green screen. I clicked on the link you provided to view your results. How did u light your subject; with whats lights/setup? I would like to achieve those results too. Secondly did you try the diy way with the Flo lights?


Return to posts index

<< PREVIOUS   •   VIEW ALL   •   PRINT   •   NEXT >>
© 2017 CreativeCOW.net All Rights Reserved
[TOP]