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FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD

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Kim Bo
FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 10, 2014 at 7:29:46 pm

I would have few questions concerning Media Composer software. I'm a FCP7 since I started editing videos. I think, that I'm now ready to make the change to go to Media Composer... 

But, before I have few questions...

My footage are from the Canon MarkII camera. I'm use to compress my footage with MPEG Streamclip in Apple Pro Res LT 422. Should I proceed the same thing with Media Composer? I don't want to transcode my footage with Media Composer at the same time as importing, because it's very long and I can't work at the same time. Or you suggest using AMA link? If I use AMA link, what would be the best way to export after? 

Concerning subtitling... Most of my video, I need to make some translation. I've got one person who doing the sub, then I bring back the sub to my final video... What would be the best way to use subtitle with Media Composer? And after, if I want to bring the subtitle for a DVD, how should I proceed? I've got hard time to find how to work with subtitle with Media Composer... and before switching FCP2MC, how subtitle is working is one of my priority...

And then, to create a DVD... which software would you use? I always work with DVD Studio Pro 4. Is there something new, or better that I should try? 

Thank you
Kim


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John Pale
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 10, 2014 at 8:48:37 pm

Sounds like Adobe would be a better fit for you, honestly.

Doing this without transcoding is going to be painful in Avid.

Work without transcoding in Premiere and then make your DVD in Encore. It's all very similar to what you already are doing.

I say this as a long time Avid editor. It's just not the greatest at the type of workflow you are suggesting. Right tool for the right job.

Note DVDSP and Adobe Encore both work well for now, but are both discontinued. There is no real alternative as the major software companies for Mac have decided DVD is dead. Encore can at least make a BluRay, DVDSP cannot.


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Shane Ross
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 10, 2014 at 9:18:27 pm

HA! I agree with John. I too am a long time Avid editor, and feel that Premiere Pro would suit you better.

[Kim Bo] "And if I Transcode my video with MPEG Streamclip in Apple Pro Res LT 422 and create AMA Link in Media Composer, would it be better?"

Better than DSLR native H.264? Yes. But it's still Quicktime, and Avid is slower with QT than with Avid media.

[Kim Bo] "And I just heard that Canon DSLR footage works great with Avid AMA..."

Whoever told you that is lying. Or working on projects that are :30 second to 2 min long. That footage chokes Media COmposer.

[Kim Bo] " but maybe it's better to compress it before?"

No...because you'll compress, then compress again. Or, you can Compress to DnxHD and then CONSOLIDATE that in Avid...that will re-wrap. But it will still take time inside Avid to do that. But far less than transcoding will.

Shane
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Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Kim Bo
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 10, 2014 at 9:30:02 pm

And if I Transcode my video with MPEG Streamclip in Apple Pro Res LT 422 and create AMA Link in Media Composer, would it be better? And I just heard that Canon DSLR footage works great with Avid AMA... but maybe it's better to compress it before?

Or maybe, I can try a new way to transcode video for Avid Media Composer... something that would be a better workflow... I don't know... it's just that I'm use with Apple Pro Res LT 422... and of what I heard about Media Composer, it should be a great software to work with. So I'm ready to maybe change my way to prepare video for Media Composer...

And about subtitling, could you help me?

Thanks John!


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Shane Ross
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 10, 2014 at 9:14:52 pm

[Kim Bo] "My footage are from the Canon MarkII camera. I'm use to compress my footage with MPEG Streamclip in Apple Pro Res LT 422. Should I proceed the same thing with Media Composer?"

No. You use AMA to access the footage, bring it in...point Avid to it. And then you transcode to DNxHD.

[Kim Bo] "I don't want to transcode my footage with Media Composer at the same time as importing, because it's very long and I can't work at the same time."

Then do it at night when you go home for the evening. AMA the footage, organize it...and then transcode when you go to bed. There is no eternal application that converts the footage to Avid native MXF media. You can convert with MPEG STREAMCLIP to DNxHD Quicktime, but Avid doesn't work with QT well. It works with MXF media in a specific file location.

[Kim Bo] "Or you suggest using AMA link? If I use AMA link, what would be the best way to export after?"

I highly recommend NOT editing the footage native via AMA. H.264 is not something Avid will edit smoothly. It craves Avid media in Avid file locations.

[Kim Bo] "What would be the best way to use subtitle with Media Composer?"

The SUBCAP generator. YOu will have to copy and paste the text into it...and do it manually. There is no quick way to import text and have it line up with the video, and create text internally.

[Kim Bo] "And then, to create a DVD... which software would you use? I always work with DVD Studio Pro 4. Is there something new, or better that I should try?"

I use DVD SP too. Avid only makes DVD Authoring software on the PC side. Mac side, we need to go third party. SO DVD SP, or Encore, or Toast.

If you want to edit H.24 native, and want no transcoding time, look at Premiere Pro. Going to that from FCP will be easy. Going from FCP to Avid will be quite a transition. Many things are done very differently in Avid.

Shane
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Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Kim Bo
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 10, 2014 at 9:26:56 pm

So then maybe the best option for me would be to AMA link my Canon DSLR footage. And at night I just transcode it, into Apple Pro Res LT 422 this will work well with Media Composer? Or it would be better to transcode it into DNxHD? What is the difference? Is the quality of my footage will be the same? I'm not really familiar with different format... but if it's better for me to change the way to proceed, I will adjust for the best!

And for subtitling... I will need to test Subcap, but of what I understand, if I need to place it manually everytime... It's gonna be so long... We cannot create a STL file? Exporte STL file from the one who's doing the translation and importing the STL file to the final project?

Thanks for your help Shane!


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Shane Ross
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 10, 2014 at 9:30:41 pm

[Kim Bo] "And at night I just transcode it, into Apple Pro Res LT 422 this will work well with Media Composer?"

Why are you hung up on ProRes? That's an APPLE codec...for FCP. Also does decent in PPro, as it doesn't have a native codec. Avid's codec is DNxHD. Transcode to DNxHD 115 or 145.

[Kim Bo] "Or it would be better to transcode it into DNxHD?"

yes.

[Kim Bo] "What is the difference?"

ProRes is made by Apple, DNxHD made by Avid.

[Kim Bo] "Is the quality of my footage will be the same?"

It'll be the same quality. DNxHD 115 is akin to ProRes LT.

[Kim Bo] " We cannot create a STL file? Exporte STL file from the one who's doing the translation and importing the STL file to the final project?"

Sorry...no clue. I don't think Avid imports STL files. I've always manually done subtitles.


I still HIGHLY RECOMMEND that you look at Premiere Pro CC as well. there's a 30 day trial...and one for Avid. Get them both, test them both.

Shane
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Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Kim Bo
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 10, 2014 at 9:38:33 pm

And why do you think it would be better for me using Premiere?

I already start some tutorial for Media Composer... and for the editing it's seems to be quite similar as FCP. My big point it was where to start, the proper video format to use... But if I change my pro res for DNxHD 115 which is akin to Pro Res LT... I think I should be ok...

Media Composer is not the best software to edit video? I just don't get why you highly recommend me to use premiere... Because of subtitling? Or because of the format of my video, because this... I can adjust myself...


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Michael Hancock
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 10, 2014 at 9:52:40 pm

[Kim Bo] "And why do you think it would be better for me using Premiere?"

I can't speak for Shane, but I imagine he's saying that because Premiere handles DSLR footage incredibly well so you'd be saving yourself the trouble of transcoding. You just import the footage and start editing. I haven't subtitled in Premiere, but I believe it supports importing .stl files, too.

For pure editing, I don't think anything beats Avid. But sometimes it's not the best option, depending on the type of footage you have, the deadline you might be under, or if it's a graphics intense piece or VFX heavy piece that will rely heavily on After Effects. And PremiereCC is much, much better to edit with than previous versions of Premiere.

----------------
Michael Hancock
Editor


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Kim Bo
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 10, 2014 at 10:06:56 pm

Well, it's not a must to work with DSLR footage... It's just that I didn't know about DNxHD, but now I understand better...

And I will still keep looking for the best way to work with subtitling with media composer... I mean big production are working with Avid, might be a way to include subtitling without doing it manually... if it's not STL, it's maybe another file format...

And also, the guy that is working the audio for my video is using pro tool... so I think it would be easier to work together both with Avid. I think we can export our project for pro tool... and he will be able to see all the separate track we use...

What you think?


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Shane Ross
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 10, 2014 at 10:19:04 pm

Premiere exports for ProTools too.

I highly recommended Premiere because it is the most "FCP-like." Editing in Avid is very different. "PURE EDITING," as Michael puts it...is great in Avid. But when you need to layer footage, or add in stills and moves on stills..."composite" shots internally...Avid can be a pain. It's convoluted and backwards at times.

Pure editing is a joy, but I rarely "pure edit." I work in documentaries and we use stills, and need to composite shots on top of moving video...very time consuming and often takes many odd steps...whereas in FCP it was very easy, and took few steps. And the same with Premiere...pretty easy.

Try demo's of both...I just thought coming from FCP, Premiere is the better choice.

Shane
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Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Kim Bo
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 10, 2014 at 10:31:41 pm

I'm really confuse... I was really ready to make the move with Media Composer, specially that now I know what's the best format to work with. And of what I saw in all the tutorial, it doesn't seems to be to complicated for editing.
I heard everywhere that Media Composer is the best for editing... I mean, heaven if it's a little bit more complicated than Premiere... after working more and more with it, I will get use to it...

What do you mean by: ''But when you need to layer footage, or add in stills and moves on stills..."composite" shots internally''

But yeah, I guess, the best is to try demo for both...


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Shane Ross
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 11, 2014 at 1:02:51 am

[Kim Bo] "What do you mean by: ''But when you need to layer footage, or add in stills and moves on stills..."composite" shots internally''"

OK...Let's say I have a video track, and on that is either a scening background, or a computer generated backplate...just a video layer. Let's make it simple...a battlefield shot from the ALAMO. Now, on that shot I want to have pictures appear of the major people involved in that. Fade in a shot of the American's defending the Alamo, the Mexican General attacking it, a still of Davy Crocket. SO that's a video backplate, and 3-4 stills. In FCP, and Premiere Pro, you simply drop the picture onto a track above the first video layer, and then resize and add keyframes to the move.

In Avid...this is far more complex. First off, you have the backplate. Then, you layer the imported still...but you can't use that still because it isn't full quality. Avid CONVERTS stills to match the project settings. You might have a 3000x2000 300dpi still, but once you import into Avid, it becomes 72dpi, and 1920x1080...quality is bad. Which is why Avid has a plugin called Avid PAN & ZOOM. You drop that onto the still, and then open that up in the Effects interface, and then you need to click on a box that then wants you to find the original still on your hard drive...you navigate to it, and then click OK. Bam, now your still is there, in full quality. So now you need to do your move on it...if you have one. Or just leave it full size.

But it's now covering the screen fully...you cannot see the video track below it. SO you need to add ANOTHER plugin...PICTURE IN PICTURE. But you need to hold OPT while you drag that on top of PAN & ZOOM, otherwise Avid will Beep at you. To layer filters you need to hold option. OK, so now PICTURE IN PICTURE is on the still, so now you can keyframe the move. OK, now time for picture 2. Go through the same steps to get the real picture in the timeline, and now you need to add Picture in Picture again...only if you now do the move, you'll notice EVERYTHING shrinks down to smaller...so you need to move the still up a layer...you might need to have one video track separating the stills...or you might not. Depends on Avid's mood.

Do this again for another still...and you'll note that this process is getting really slow. Because layering 3+ full quality stills is taxing on the interface. It's like editing in molasses. OK, fine, you do it, and then render. Whew...it works. OK, hmm...they look a bit harsh, let's blur the edges..oops, you can't! Need to add another plugin to do that.

But lets say you want to do a move on a still that has ROTATION...meaning not just zoom in and out, but turns a little. Can't use PAN & ZOOM, it doesn't do rotation. You might need to use Boris Continuum Complete for that ($1900), or get a plugin called MOVING PICTURE ($200).

Layering 4 stills on a background can take me up to an hour to do in Avid. And I can do the same thing in PPRo or FCP in 10 min.

So it all depends on what you are using the NLE to cut...why type of editing you are doing. Avid is great software...fantastic, I love it. But I curse at it when I need to do certain things because they are a pain in the patoot. This is why i recommend people look at all the NLE options and see what works for their style of editing, for the project types they are doing.

Shane
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Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Kim Bo
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 11, 2014 at 1:48:01 am

Thanks Shane for the explication, this example you explain me really tell me that maybe premiere would be better for me, since we often work with png and animated images...

But still, I will put in application both to be able to compare and having the best idea which one would fit the best for me.

So with Premiere, I will still compress my video the same way as I use to do with FCP, which is compress in Apple Pro Res LT 422 and then import in Premiere?
And for the subtitling, working with the STL file, you know how it's working?

Thank you very much for your advise Shane!


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Shane Ross
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 11, 2014 at 3:25:45 am

[Kim Bo] "So with Premiere, I will still compress my video the same way as I use to do with FCP, which is compress in Apple Pro Res LT 422 and then import in Premiere?"

No need. Premiere Pro will edit the files without the need to convert. One level of compression skipped. Native editing.

[Kim Bo] "And for the subtitling, working with the STL file, you know how it's working?"

Sorry, no idea. I've always subtitled manually.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Kim Bo
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 11, 2014 at 3:31:51 am

Thanks you so much! I will make some search for subtitle but I think it should not be to complicated... seems to work like FCP.

For the audio, you told me later we can export the audio for Pro Tool, with all the separate track?
I only see the AAF, in export. How to bring the audio for ProTool with Premiere?

Thank!


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David Powell
Re: FCP7toMC Import footage in Media Composer/Subtitling/Create DVD
on Mar 12, 2014 at 5:23:49 pm

MC 7 Transcodes in the background. Watch some videos on the new feature. You can work while transcoding now. Shouldn't slow you down any more than your current FCP workflow in which you wait on MPG stream clip to make Prores files. Also check out the dynamic folders which will automatically transcode to DNX (avid's version of prores if you will) when you import them from the camera. This should be faster than how you are currently working. I don't like Premiere's timeline for cutting personally. Also FCPX will cut through native H.264 quite easily, so Adobe isn't your only other option.


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