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William Edwards
Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 2:31:28 am

If I am doing the final conform in Avid, bringing all the color corrected footage together with the sound mix and the graphics, what is the next step that people take to have a file ready to ship to broadcast? Is there another machine or place that a file is sent to before it's then shipped to the networks for broadcast?

It's confusing, because even when pieces are color corrected they're not 100% in range for legal broadcast, etc..


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Michael Phillips
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 3:12:47 am

Do you have the delivery specification from the network you sending the program to? If the pieces are not 100% legal range it may get kicked back. I have to ask why they are not after a color correction session?

Michael


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William Edwards
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 3:28:21 am

This is a general question, more like, rather than specific network.

Graphics are never in range after they are output RGB and conformed on a timeline.

A color correct never guarantees that the color is entirely in range to be shipped legally.

I don't know what people do; I'm never on the shipping side of things.


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Scott Cole
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 3:58:13 am

I'm not sure why you would say graphics are never in range. If they are created correctly and imported correctly they should have no problem being legal. The same is true with color correction. If your colorist can't make legal colors, then I'd suggest you find a new colorist. Regarding effects you may create with both the graphics and the color corrected material, you need to read the specs, have a waveform monitor and vectorscope, and you need to understand the specs of your network. That's part of your job as a finishing editor. That being said, and having delivered a fair share of network shows both to CBS and other networks, on occasion something may be kicked back for an infraction. You either fix the infraction, or you justify the infraction, "that hit was on the original material, and it's intrinsic to the footage" as an example.

M. Scott Cole
Senior Post Production Editor
60 MINUTES
CBS News, NYC
sc6@cbsnews.com
mscottc@comcast.net


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William Edwards
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 1:03:44 pm

Aren't graphics usually output at RGB value? That's not in range, is it?


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Scott Cole
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 1:10:02 pm

Graphics can be made with either RGB values or 601/709 values. You must select the value the graphics were made in with the import dialogue. If you do this correctly the imported values will be correct. If you aren't sure, import one graphic preferably one that has base blacks and peak whites, and check them on your waveform monitor. If those base blacks don't hit 0 and the whites don't hit 100 then you need to choose the other setting. If the results are either over or under those values, change the setting and re-import, confirm that is correct, and then import the rest. That's assuming they were all made the same way.

M. Scott Cole
Senior Post Production Editor
60 MINUTES
CBS News, NYC
sc6@cbsnews.com
mscottc@comcast.net


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William Edwards
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 2:01:57 pm

Would it be in my best interest to have a product like this, or do you think it's overkill?

http://www.leaderamerica.com/web/products/vidcheck/vidchecker.htm


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Job ter Burg
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 1:30:35 pm

You might want to read up on the way the 'RGB' (misnomer, but still) and '601/709' options when exporting from or importing into Avid MC.

601_709_RGB.pdf


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Job ter Burg
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 1:36:29 pm

Oh, and you could of course drop a Safe Color effect on a top video layer to legalize the signal.

Other than that, you will likely need to worry about sound, which should adhere to certain requirements. Mostly ATSC A/85 in the US and EBU R128 in Europe, but there are differences in specs between broadcasters.

And finally, there used to be a brief moment in history where you would output to a Digital Betacam tape, and that would be pretty much a worldwide accepted standard format. These days, anything and everything is done and required, from HDCAM-SR to H264 Quicktime files.

I would argue that if you master in DNxHD or ProRes, then make – and archive – a Same-As-Source QT export of your final sequence with 601/709 levels, you should be able to derive pretty much any required deliverable from that.


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William Edwards
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 1:50:08 pm

I hear you on the safe color limiter, although I've heard from many places that that doesn't get ever single stray pixel.

(as for audio, I'm not messing with making it legal; having someone else handle that. I'm just laying it in there.)


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Job ter Burg
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 7:28:53 pm

The same should apply to color grading.


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William Edwards
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 1:48:29 pm

As for Resolve color, for example, there is so 'broadcast safe color' tool for any renders that one makes out of color.

I was always under the assumption that Flame just handles this; that's been my workflow. But I'm working freelance on a project and I wanted to do all the research beforehand.


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Bill Ravens
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 2:43:42 pm
Last Edited By Bill Ravens on Jan 11, 2014 at 2:44:21 pm

when round-tripping between resolve and avid, I've found that it's easy to clip if I'm not careful with the exports/imports. For that reason, as a standard workflow practice, I always import/export to/from resolve with "Data Levels" (that keeps resolve from remapping levels); import into Avid with 601/709 (that keeps Avid from remapping levels); check the levels in Avid and apply legal levels before my final export to 601/709. Never had any trouble with that approach.



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William Edwards
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 2:52:30 pm

Thanks for this info Bill (and everyone else as well!)

Do you use the Avid scopes to monitor the levels? Do you have a way of double checking your work, or have you never had an issue and just keep doing it this way?


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Glenn Sakatch
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 5:26:45 pm

Another thing to keep in mind is - for better or worse-the reality is that it all depends on the broadcaster.

If you are outputting a local spot to a local station, I would guess there is much smaller chance of that commercial being kicked back because of an illegal range in color.

If you are outputting a 1 hour show to PBS, there is a very good chance that it will be kicked back.

I'm not saying its "right", but it is how the world works.

Typically i color everything to as close as legal as possible, and then depending on the broadcaster, i may run it though a final legalize session where anything that has snuck through so far, can get eased down to legal. I have a preset on my DS that has been created and tweaked over the years to satisfy the third party QC company we use. Basically allowing me to do as little "extra" as possible, while still satisfying them and their equipment.

Glenn


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William Edwards
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 8:17:15 pm
Last Edited By William Edwards on Jan 11, 2014 at 8:17:34 pm

That 'final legalize session' is through your Nitris DS?


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Glenn Sakatch
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 12, 2014 at 4:56:56 pm

I use an Avid DS for mastering, as opposed to an Avid Media Composer, but you could certainly use a plug in with Media Composer. Both Boris and Sapphire have legalizers, but you really have to turn Sapphires down, - it really attacks the chroma in preset mode.

Glenn


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Bill Ravens
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 6:27:58 pm

"Do you use the Avid scopes to monitor the levels? Do you have a way of double checking your work, or have you never had an issue and just keep doing it this way"

Yes, to all possibilities. I use Avid scopes as a matter of routine workflow. I, also, double check output files with calibrated studio monitors and BMD Pocket Ultrascope on a 3rd laptop. This entire issue is, obviously, so critical that I do routine calibration and validation runs to make sure things don't change with new version releases.



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William Edwards
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 8:16:35 pm

That's Avid running through the BM Ultrascope when double checking?


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Bill Ravens
Re: Broadcasting
on Jan 11, 2014 at 11:08:32 pm

No that's cross checking the final output, post-render on Ultrascope.I also have Hamlet Vidscope, but, that's unreliable as Quicktime will automatically clip 16-235.



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